adaher, you cowardly shit

OK, here’s what to do. Whip up some sort of temporary housing camps for Syrian refugees, something decent, something you’re not ashamed to see on TV. As large a population as practical, so people have plenty of time and space to mingle and get to know each other. Find people from their home town, stuff like that.

Quietly let it be known that if you spot someone you know is a radical type guy, and then you tell the nearest refugee custodian…and it proves valuable…then American immigration services will regard you with generous benevolence.

Propaganda bonanza! Pictures of the captured infiltrators, turned in by other Muslims in loyalty to America!

Now, I’m a pretty smart guy. But violent and clandestine groups have paranoia as a survival mechanism, they sprinkle paranoia on their al-Cheerios. So, if I can think of this, so can they.

Until the first argument that finds an innocent man fingered as ISIS.

Yeah 'luc, I’m not seeing “hey y’all, rat on each other for preferential treatment” as an effective direction to take.

Weren’t a lot of the prisoners at Baghram Air Base there because of US policy of preferential treatment (and sometimes commissions) for informers? Do we remember how that worked out?

I’m’a vote “no” on this one too, 'luc.

Jesus Fucking Christ–hundreds of posts in and you still haven’t addressed the fact that you jumped onto this decrepit bandwagon in the first palce because you don’t know shit about the U.S. refugee resettlement process. There’s no point in engaging in these endless moral quibbles when your whole starting premise is baseless.

Can you name even one instance in the near decade of resettlement from that area of a terrorist (not an asylum seeker) using the refugee process to get into the country? (Of course ISIS says that’s what they want to do–ISIS will say anything.)

This is what I posted in another thread, but it bears repeating here:

"Part of what I do is refugee resettlement–in the U.S. (And yes, I’ve worked with Syrians.) This bullshit about Syrian refugees being some kind of threat is one of the stupidest turns in public discourse this country has seen in a long time, and I’m including the whole ‘freedom fries’ thing. It’s embarrassing. It’s fucking idiotic. Forget about the moral questions (which are self-evident). Let’s just start with the basic proposition, which IS PURE IGNORANCE—or, if not that, scummy and disingenuous.

In addition to the craven, pandering, shameless political figures (Trump, Cruz, Christie, various governors, etc.), who are so transparently and desperately just attention whoring themselves, we have even here on this board some posters flaunting their ignorance (or their scummy disingenuousness) as they buy into the whole idiocy. You know who you are. Let me just ask you one question: What ISIS member is going to get through this process, even if one should be stupid enough to voluntarily submit to it?"

And here is the U.S. refugee resettlement process again, for the sake of this thread:

===========================================
STEP 1
Gaining refugee Status: In most cases the UN High Commissioner for Refugees (UNHCR) determines that an individual qualifies as a refugee under international law. A refugee is someone who has fled from his or her home country and cannot return because he or she has a well-founded fear of persecution based on religion, race, nationality, political opinion or membership in a particular social group.

STEP 2
Referral to the United States: A refugee that meets one of the criteria for resettlement in the United States is referred to the U.S. government by UNHCR, a U.S. Embassy, or a trained Non-Governmental Organization.

STEP 3
Resettlement Support Center: A Resettlement Support Center (RSC), contracted by the U.S. Department of State, compiles the refugee’s personal data and background information for the security clearance process and to present to the U.S. Department of Homeland Security (DHS) for an in-person interview.

STEP 4
Security Clearance Process: With information collected by the RSC, a number of security checks are conducted. The State Department runs the names of all refugees referred to the United States for resettlement through a standard CLASS (Consular Lookout and Support System) name check. In addition, enhanced interagency security checks were phased in beginning in 2008 and applied to all refugee applicants by 2010.

STEP 5
Security Clearance Process: Certain refugees (SUCH AS SYRIANS and IRAQIS) undergo an additional security review called a Security Advisory Opinion (SAO). These cases require a positive SAO clearance from a number of U.S. law enforcement and intelligence agencies (FBI, NSA, CIA, and I think military intelligence, too) in order to continue the resettlement process. When required, this step runs concurrently with Step 4.

STEP 6
Security Clearance Process: Refugees who meet the minimum age requirement have their fingerprints and photograph taken by a trained U.S. government employee, usually on the same day as their DHS interview. The fingerprints are then checked against various U.S. government databases and information on any matches is reviewed by DHS.

STEP 7
In-person Interview: All refugee applicants are interviewed by an officer from DHS’s U.S. Citizenship and Immigration Services (USCIS). A trained officer will travel to the country of asylum to conduct a detailed, face-to- face interview with each refugee applicant being considered for resettlement. (Under limited circumstances, refugee applicants may be interviewed in their home country rather than in a country of asylum.) Based on the information in the refugee’s case file and on the interview, the DHS officer will determine if the individual qualifies as a refugee and is admissible under U.S. law.

STEP 8
DHS Approval: If the USCIS officer finds that the individual qualifies as a refugee and meets other U.S. admission criteria, the officer will conditionally approve the refugee’s application for resettlement and submit it to the U.S. Department of State for final processing. Conditional approvals become final once the results of all security checks (Steps 4, 5, and 6) have been received and cleared.

STEP 9
Medical Screening: All refugee applicants approved for resettlement in the U.S. are required to undergo medical screening conducted by the International Organization for Migration or a physician designated by the U.S. Embassy.

STEP 10
Matching Refugees with a Sponsor Agency: Every refugee is assigned to a Voluntary Agency in the U.S., such as the U.S. Committee for Refugees and Immigrants (USCRI). USCRI will place refugees with a local partner agency (“volags,” which are the agencies I contract with), or other office that will assist refugees upon their arrival in the U.S.

STEP 11 (my area of work)
Cultural Orientation: In addition, refugees approved for resettlement are offered the services of acculturation programs while waiting for final processing and after arrival, to prepare them for their journey to and initial resettlement in the United States.

STEP 12
Security Clearance Process: Prior to departure to the U.S., a second interagency check is conducted for most refugees to check for any new information. Refugees must clear this check in order to depart to the U.S.

STEP 13
Admission to the United States: Upon arrival at one of five U.S. airports designated as ports of entry for refugee admissions, a Customs and Border Protection (CBP) officer will review the refugee documentation and conduct additional security checks to ensure that the arriving refugee is the same person who was screened and approved for admission to the United States.

Enough of these tit-for-tat moral arguments. The big risk you are proposing is a fabrication in the first place.

LOL, yeah adaher is basically this board’s version of Donald Trump. He shoots from the hip and doesn’t bother checking his allegations against, you know, the facts. With a brief google search.
I’m a little embarrassed to say that I used to despise the guy. But not anymore. adaher has a sense of humor: I cut a lot of slack for those who can laugh at themselves. Also, he has actually ramped up his game IMHO. He is no longer quite the Earl of Error and has taken a liking to making predictions. All good.
But sheesh adaher, do you see that a lot of your exchanges create more heat than light? Shooting from the hip is easy: it’s call bullshitting. I’ll turn the mike over to Harry Frankfurt: [INDENT]It is impossible for someone to lie unless he thinks he knows the truth. Producing bullshit requires no such conviction. A person who lies is thereby responding to the truth, and he is to that extent respectful of it. When an honest man speaks, he says only what he believes to be true; and for the liar, it is correspondingly indispensable that he considers his statements to be false. For the bullshitter, however, all these bets are off: he is neither on the side of the true nor on the side of the false. His eye is not on the facts at all, as the eyes of the honest man and of the liar are, except insofar as they may be pertinent to his interest in getting away with what he says. He does not care whether the things he says describe reality correctly. He just picks them out, or makes them up, to suit his purpose. [/INDENT] Admittedly, I had a different philosopher in mind. In high school and college, there are 2 categories of bad papers: bull and cow. Bull consists of allegations strung together which reflect no knowledge of the material presented. Cow consists of stringing together of facts presented without making any sort of argument or grasp of concepts. adaher mostly presents bull. Not wholly useless. But I’m reluctant to engage with it.

As for the the topic of the OP, I haven’t bothered figuring out adaher’s position on this stuff. Skimming it over though, ISTM that his argument would be stronger if he reigned it in a little. Here’s an example:
[QUOTE=adaher]
There are two policies that make sense:

  1. Don’t admit Syrian refugees because it’s too risky

  2. Admit as many as we can because we’re compassionate.
    [/QUOTE]
    If somebody else made this argument, you could figure out a response to it in like 10 seconds, right adaher? It wouldn’t be a well thought out response. But you could come up with it quickly, right? Yeah, me too. I used to marvel at the power of bullshit in high school, before I quit the habit. Mostly. Ok, somewhat.

I can quit anytime I want!

Measure for Measure, this is why I read the SDMB. You get posters dropping quotes from On Bullshit the same way they’d quote from Princess Bride or The Wire. (All three being indispensable sources for the well-prepared 'Doper.)

adaher is this board’s version of dog shit. Once you step in it and engage him, the smell lingers for days and you’ll never get it off your shoes completely.

I haven’t rescinded my decree, btw.

How best can we approach this question…What Were the Three Main Causes of Southern Secession and the War Between the States?.. a question that has been prominent in our history, our culture, and our essay questions. What, indeed, are the three main causes?

We may take our first insight from the fact that there are three. One is severely too few, two, not enough, unless one proceeds to the third. Four is too many, of course, and five is right out!

More proof of pure trollery, in case you weren’t convinced yet.

“Any Republican examples?” he asks.

Lovely examples of the No True Scotsman fallacy. And confirmation bias. And just ordinary head-up-the-birch-tree foolishness.

He makes an inordinate number of errors of fact. He makes a lot of claims that are discredited by the very cites he links to. I wish he’d go into the stockbroker business, so I could buy all the stocks he says to sell.

Yep, that’s his usual “my position is utterly indefensible so my only hope is to lie about the other side to make it look worse” approach. That’s not a cowardly position compared to the ones appearing previously in this thread; it’s just the usual desperate flinging of shit in the hopes that something will stick. It’s practically a “dog bites man” story as far as his posts go.

But for continuity’s sake please allow me to reiterate my point about adaher from post #310:

No change yet, alas.

That sentence is a weary march of words, exhausted and forlorn. Crying out for the comfort and rest of a period, but finding only commas, trudges on, trudges on.