I’ve often wondered about the legality of bicyclists riding three (or more!) abreast in the bike lanes. It makes a concientous driver like myself nervous trying to pass them when they stick out into the road like that. I understand riding two abreast if one is passing another, but I get annoyed when it’s two, three, sometimes four cyclists riding right next to each other chatting away. I’ll have to dig into the California codes later tonight. (Unless someone already has and can share their findings?)
[QUOTE=conurepete]
They try to make right turns over bicycle rides they have overtaken in the street.
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When I come up to a light or four way stop, I will move to the left enough that I am essentially taking the lane. I don’t know if this is according to Hoyle or not, and frankly, I don’t care. I’ve had close calls like this too many times, and do it my way now as a matter of course.
This is not to mention the individuals who feel that their day is only made better if they run me off the road. Thanks to them, I have the ugliest legs around. And a number of colorful/profane ways of expressing myself. Even as I go ass over elbows.
[QUOTE=Red Barchetta]
It can’t be wrong if it’s an opinion. And I don’t give a damn that they can’t keep pace because they’re “human-powered,” that’s the precise reason why they don’t belong on the road.
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But the point isn’t that they keep pace with you, it’s are they safe and entitled to be there. IMO, the answer to both is yes. If it means you have to slow down occasionally to safely pass, that’s fine with me. I don’t mind it when I’m driving and I expect drivers to do the same when I’m riding.
IMO, your opinion boils down to “roads are meant for cars, so anything that impedes car traffic is bad”. I disagree with pretty much every part of that.
Since those who defend riding on the sidewalk say they do it because drivers honk and curse at them, the obvious solution here is for all pedestrians to start screaming at every bicyclist we see on the sidewalk, and refuse to allow them to pass. Maybe knock them over once in awhile, too. Time to take back the sidewalks!
[QUOTE=Telemark]
IMO, your opinion boils down to “roads are meant for cars, so anything that impedes car traffic is bad”. I disagree with pretty much every part of that.
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Close. If a bike can keep pace on a slower road, great. But I feel they have no place on any street that where they can’t even come close to keeping pace. It fucks with traffic, and I’ve seen it create dangerous situations for both drivers and bicyclists.
[QUOTE=Red Barchetta]
It can’t be wrong if it’s an opinion. And I don’t give a damn that they can’t keep pace because they’re “human-powered,” that’s the precise reason why they don’t belong on the road.
[/QUOTE]
Sorry, all vehicles have a right to the road, including bicycles. The only exceptions are roadways explicitly marked differently (i.e., most limited-access freeways).
[QUOTE=Red Barchetta]
Close. If a bike can keep pace on a slower road, great. But I feel they have no place on any street that where they can’t even come close to keeping pace. It fucks with traffic, and I’ve seen it create dangerous situations for both drivers and bicyclists.
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Then lets slow the pace down to bicycle pace and everyone will be happy, right?
It’s not that big a deal for cars to go around bikes on streets. I’ve been riding and driving on roads all my life and it’s really not that big a deal. If bikes stay to the right and cars are a little patient, everyone is happy. If you can’t drive past a bicyclist safely, perhaps its your problem, not the cyclist?
Bikes are a vital, efficient, and safe mode of urban and suburban transportation. Every bike is pretty much one less car on the road, which should be good when you’re stuck in traffic. Certainly there are some roads where it is not safe for bikes and cars to coexist on, such as interstates. But short of that, it’s not really a problem as long as both sides follow basic rules and show some common courtesy.
[QUOTE=Red Barchetta]
Close. If a bike can keep pace on a slower road, great. But I feel they have no place on any street that where they can’t even come close to keeping pace. It fucks with traffic, and I’ve seen it create dangerous situations for both drivers and bicyclists.
[/QUOTE]
I really don’t give a flying fuck if you think I have no place on the street. I’m legally entitled to one, so you can just kiss my ass.
In point of fact, it’s people like you that make a lot of cyclists ride in assholish ways. “If you want to be treated like traffic, follow the traffic rules” is all well and good, but jackasses like you (and there are a lot of you) won’t treat me like traffic even if I do follow the rules. So why the hell should I follow the rules? Now, I usually do follow the rules, because I’m not a jackass, but you sure aren’t giving me any incentive to do so.
[QUOTE=Spiral Stairs]
Let me add this gloss to this well-deserved pitting: Bicyclists: If you want to be treated like vehicles, which you are always self-righteously saying you do in letters to the editor and other typical fora for self-righteousness, then fucking act like vehicles. That means:
Ride on the road, not the sidewalk.
Observe one-way street signs (because, as a frequent pedestrian on such streets, I don’t want to have to worry about some bat-out-of-hell cyclist going the wrong way when I make my crossing decision).
Observe stop signs and lights.
When you are on the road, stay as far fucking right as you can, so you don’t hold up a line of traffic while you lollygag along.
I’m sick of cyclists who want it both ways. They want cities to reorganize themselves to acknowledge the vehicle-ness of bikes, but they want to zoom around in total disregard for the laws governing vehicles.
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Can you produce some examples of such assholes?
Because IME, cyclists come in two classes: (1) those of us who are pretty serious about the rules of the road (or at least as serious about them when we’re on two wheels as when we’re on four), and (2) those who don’t know the rules of the road apply to them, or if they know, they don’t particularly give a flying fuck.
First of all, those who participate in cyclist organizations, who are insistent on maintaining their pre-existing right to the roads, are almost exclusively a subset of group 1: members of the second group can’t be bothered.
Second and finally, if there was something I could do to make group 2 magically disappear, I would. But (as you can see from my breakdown) cyclists don’t all pedal in lockstep. There’s nothing legal I can do to make some other cyclist behave.
But that doesn’t mean you can or should keep me from using the roads.
Here in Arizona we’re legally allowed to ride on both. I usually use the road but there are some special circumstances in which I will ride on the sidewalk.
[QUOTE=Wolfian]
asphault is easier on the joints than concrete.
[/QUOTE]
I just read in a marathoning book that this is a myth.
I do. More often, even, than a lot of the motorists I see and/or encounter. Particularly stop signs. I can assure you that the number of motorists who blow through stop signs out far outstrips the number of cyclists who do so.
As I can, right. I do that regularly. But as far right as I can is, I can tell you from personal experience, not always as far right as motorists want me to be. And if you have to slow down because I’m not riding as far right as you might like, well, you can fuck right the hell off. I can assure you that I pay a helluva lot closer attention to the road, because there’s naught but spandex between the two of us.
Wow, I guess I touched a nerve or two here. My rant isn’t against bike riders in general–hell, I ride 3 or 4 times a week. It’s about a certain group of people who think that they own the sidewalk. If the, ahem, gentlemen I mentioned in the OP had dismounted and walked their bikes as they passed me by, I wouldn’t have started the thread.
But I’m incensed at these fellows who think I’m going to jump aside when they approach. It seems to be a game of chicken for them, a macho challenge to any pedestrian they may encounter. It’s getting worse, and I’m sick and tired of it.
[QUOTE=blondebear]
Wow, I guess I touched a nerve or two here. My rant isn’t against bike riders in general–hell, I ride 3 or 4 times a week. It’s about a certain group of people who think that they own the sidewalk. If the, ahem, gentlemen I mentioned in the OP had dismounted and walked their bikes as they passed me by, I wouldn’t have started the thread.
But I’m incensed at these fellows who think I’m going to jump aside when they approach. It seems to be a game of chicken for them, a macho challenge to any pedestrian they may encounter. It’s getting worse, and I’m sick and tired of it.
[/QUOTE]
Perhaps you should notify your local constabulary. Unfortunately, the members of the SDMB are fairly powerless in the face of these mounted marauders.
[QUOTE=blondebear]
But I’m incensed at these fellows who think I’m going to jump aside when they approach. It seems to be a game of chicken for them, a macho challenge to any pedestrian they may encounter. It’s getting worse, and I’m sick and tired of it.
[/QUOTE]
Then clearly the solution is in your grasp. As they approach, simply cluck, flap your arms, and peck your head like a chicken while taunting them as the sissy, girly-men that they are for being too scared of the big, mean road.
Seriously, biking on the sidewalk is the awful. You are invisible to cars, your view of upcoming intersections is crap, the surface is unpredicatable, and every driveway is a surprise intersection. Did I mention the surface is crap?
[QUOTE=CaveMike]
Then clearly the solution is in your grasp. As they approach, simply cluck, flap your arms, and peck your head like a chicken while taunting them as the sissy, girly-men that they are for being too scared of the big, mean road.
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Goo-goo-ga ja! Goo-goo-ga ja!
Seriously. Has anyone on this message board ever even seen a chicken?
[QUOTE=blondebear]
Wow, I guess I touched a nerve or two here. My rant isn’t against bike riders in general–hell, I ride 3 or 4 times a week. It’s about a certain group of people who think that they own the sidewalk. If the, ahem, gentlemen I mentioned in the OP had dismounted and walked their bikes as they passed me by, I wouldn’t have started the thread.
But I’m incensed at these fellows who think I’m going to jump aside when they approach. It seems to be a game of chicken for them, a macho challenge to any pedestrian they may encounter. It’s getting worse, and I’m sick and tired of it.
[/QUOTE]
Yeah, this is a touchy subject around here. It probably has something to do with neither side is completely right or completely wrong.
Have you ever considered just shoving them off their bikes as they pass you on the sidewalk? If they get upset, call the police and get them to explain why they were operating their vehicles on the prohibited sidewalks (assuming sidewalk biking is prohibited where you are) when you happened to accidentally bump into them. (No, I’m not serious, but damn, it has gone through my head about a hundred times as a bike courier is bearing down on me as I try to walk on the sidewalks downtown.)
[Disclaimer: I do not live in California. Every place that I have ever lived has about 95% of people travelling by car, 4% by bike, and 1% walking. Car traffic is rarely so gridlocked that a bicyclist can pass a car driver. So what I am about to say may not apply in your own situation.]
Bicyclists, get off the fucking road!
[QUOTE=lowbrass]
…“Keep pace”??? What on earth are you talking about. I don’t know if you’re aware, but bicycles are human-powered; they can’t keep up with a motor vehicle. .
[/QUOTE]
Exactly. That’s why they should stay off the fucking road. If you are not in a vehicle that can travel at the speed limit, you should not be on the road. The roads are for cars.
[QUOTE=lowbrass]
…The advice is more specific than “don’t screw up”; it’s “don’t ride on the sidewalk”.
[/QUOTE]
Here’s my advice: Ride of the sidewalk, and when you get to an intersection, act like a pedestrian. Because you’re far closer to a pedestrian than you are to a car.
[QUOTE=lowbrass]
Since those who defend riding on the sidewalk say they do it because drivers honk and curse at them, the obvious solution here is for all pedestrians to start screaming at every bicyclist we see on the sidewalk, and refuse to allow them to pass. Maybe knock them over once in awhile, too. Time to take back the sidewalks!
[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=Rucksinator]
Exactly. That’s why they should stay off the fucking road. If you are not in a vehicle that can travel at the speed limit, you should not be on the road. The roads are for cars.
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Seriously, What the fuck am I supposed to do? Fuck this, I’ll ride wherever the hell I want from now on, and bitch when people yell at me, that way I can be just as self-righteous and whiny as the drivers and pedestrians.
[QUOTE=hawksgirl]
Seriously, What the fuck am I supposed to do? Fuck this, I’ll ride wherever the hell I want from now on, and bitch when people yell at me, that way I can be just as self-righteous and whiny as the drivers and pedestrians.
[/QUOTE]
There was a thread recently about cars passing on the right. It occurred to me that people were talking about 2 different situations, and getting mad at people that were talking about the other situation. I think that’s what’s going on here. From what I’ve seen on TV, the situation in New York City is far different from the situation down here. It seem that in NYC, the sidewalks are crammed with walkers. That’s not the case here.
When I was working in Columbia, SC, I once angrily honked my horn at a lady riding her bike on the street. If I sound like an asshole, please let me finish setting up the story: I was driving down a busy street. She was riding on the road on a bike. Following her was a child on a child’s bike. Two feet to her right was an unused sidewalk. I honked because I was going too much faster than she was to have the time to roll down my window and shout: “You dumb cunt, you’re a bad mother, and you’re going to get your child killed!” Again, this situation is probably different from the situation in California. If you can travel 1 mile on a bike faster than you can in a car, then I’m not talking to you.