AIDS deniers

The BBQ Pit
1

Time for the annual HIV test (being sexually promisc… er, I mean, active and all), so I head down to the Community Center to do my wifely duty. As I head into the front door, I see three guys standing in front of the building with a sign: “Ban the ‘HIV test’!” Not quite knowing what that was all about, I just duck in and get in line.

(Side note: I’m a queasy thing - can’t handle needles, and pass out at the sight of them. Thankfully, they have the oral “cheek scrape” test - not quite as accurate, but it’ll do until I can get someone to come with me to help me home should I faint, ever so demurely, at the sight of my own blood. :frowning: )

So while inside, the volunteer asks if I have any questions. “Yeah,” sez I. “What’s with the guys out front?”

“Ah,” sez he. “Well, it seems that some people believe that HIV does not cause AIDS, and…”

“Stop right there,” sez I. “Wackos.”

“We usually just advise folks to avoid them,” sez he.

AIDS deniers.

Charming.

I remember reading an article a while back about the fact that San Francisco ACT-UP, once the forefront AIDS activism group, had to split off into another group, because the people who were in power went from “ACT UP, fight AIDS!” to “HIV doesn’t really cause AIDS - maybe poppers do, or unclean living, but The Establishment[sup]TM[/sup] is lying to us! Aaaah!” So, um, what the fuck is wrong with these people? Anybody have any clues? What, new drug therapies take the wind out of your sails and you need something new to rage against? Over twenty years of solid epidemiological research linking HIV to AIDS isn’t good enough for you? What is this, fucking South Africa? Or maybe you’re not getting enough attention from the media because the disease has gone on for too long? Still mad no cure’s been found? Tired of using condoms? Never mind that STD rates are up again. Never mind that a surprisingly large portion of the twenty-something gay generation is either thinking “it’ll never happen to me” or “you don’t die from AIDS anymore.” Never mind that barebacking and bug-chasing is all the rage. Never mind that all these great new club drugs impede your thinking and you’re only helping muddy the waters.

What the fuck is your damage, you fucking morons?

:mad:

Esprix

2

I’m guessing that these don’t have anything to do with horses or the study of insects, but what are they, if you don’t mind my asking?

3

Barebacking is sex without a condom; “bug-chasing” is having unsafe sex with the goal of deliberately infecting oneself with HIV.

Sick, sick, sick.

Plus a big “me-too” to everything Esprix said in the OP>

4

Interesting. Just last week I was pointed to a news article about Africa’s government, scientists, and health workers authoring a paper regarding the theory that HIV isn’t the cause of AIDS. It seems that Peter Duesberg’s theories and other, independent theories are becoming mainstream now.

::Shrug:: I don’t really have an opinion one way or the other, just wanted to let you know that the “denial” theory is picking up academic and scientific backing.

Sam

5

I’m presuming here you mean South Africa, not the entire continent. :wink:

Alas, Thabo Mbeke, in charge of a country with a really bad AIDS problem, is also in the thrall of this theory:

I’ve heard him on the radio saying that AIDS is caused by poverty, not viruses. :rolleyes:

6

Double-J, I can’t recall where the news article said it was. I had believed it to be a collaboration of many countries within Africa, but it might’ve just been South Africa and I misread.
Sam

P.S.- I thought you were gonna tell me to shut the fuck up again LoL :smiley:

7

I didn’t know popper use was so high in South Africa. :rolleyes:

(I trust that these are those nasty inhalents and not jalapeno cheese popper, to which I am addicted and which will eventually kill me.)

8

:eek: Why?

9

In every admitted case I’ve heard of, it’s a desire (borne out of helplessness, coercion or a deep, deep lack of any sense of self-worth) to eliminate the need to take preventative measures with a “life partner” who is HIV+

The really pathetic part of it is that these people are ignoring that even when both partners are HIV+, condoms and dams should be used to prevent secondary, opportunistic infections that may not be affecting one partner but would be devastating to the other.

10

Hrrm ya know I’m glad I don’t go out to clubs and what not. They sound more dangerous than work (and I just made up 32 mls of HIV today)

11

Lunatic theories have gained intellectual and scientific adherants before. This, unfortunately, isn’t terribly new.

What bugs me is that even if HIV didn’t cause AIDS[sup][/sup], why would you choose to risk infecting youself with any virus?! Deliberately risking infection of any kind is kinda non-survival selective, no?
[sup][/sup]And, yes, after 20-odd years of top-flight research, we can safely say the HIV does, unequivocally, cause AIDS.

12

I was a TA for Duesberg when I was a grad student at UC Berkeley. The guy is really not all there. He doesn’t know Jaques Schitt about immunology.

He’s pop cuture, not science, when it comes to immunology. I wil defer to him - a little - on biochem, but the evidence for a causative link between HIV and AIDS is very strong.

13

I have to ask-WHY???

ACT-UP-was this the group someone said allegedly ran into churches and through condoms at people? :confused:

14

::sigh::

Denial. The New Religion for the New Millenium.

15

Actually, Guin I asked the same question above. Thanks to tlw for the answer. This is one of those times when I almost wish I had stayed ignorant of the whole concept.

16

the new ‘sex clubs’ (large empty room, $8 at the door, 3 rules: no clothes, no condoms, no mention of HIV status) was pathetic.

20 years ago, it took a hell of a fight to close the bathhouses (same idea, but with hottubs).

Now a new generation re-creating the atmosphere - great.

But to deny a causal relationship between HIV and AIDS?

Could we just shoot these morons?

and yes, ACT-UP was an in-your-face ‘shock troops’ in the battle.

Remember: Reagan never even MENTIONED the word ‘AIDS’, let alone did anything to fight it. The 80’s were not pretty.

17

Well, as far as popularizing this crackpot theory goes, a lot of the credit can be placed at the feet of one Christine Maggiore. After being diagnosed HIV positive (and not dying), she decided that something was wrong with medicine, and started her own organization.

(Here’s a link. I’m just throwing it in FYI – I think it’s a buncha bullshit, personally. If you Google her, you’ll find more than you care to know.)

Since she refuses to take another HIV test, it’s possible that she got false positives. Actually, that whole story is pretty wierd, but the popularity of her materials just goes to show you what a good Internet campaign can do for wackos these days.

18

HIV was primarily spread through gay sex and intravenous drug usage. Reagan actively and effectively fought against illegal drugs. He certainly disapproved of the gay lifestyle. So, accidentally, his policies did indeed oppose the spread of AIDS.

BTW, during the period 1981 - 89, I don’t remember too many other people doing much of anything to fight AIDS. E.g., which leading Democrats fought AIDS at that time?

IIFC, some gay leaders were fighting to keep the bath houses in SF open. Some gay leaders managed to keep AIDS and HIV from being classified as an STDs. Until recently, certain groups managed to prevent mandatory HIV testing of pregnant women. (Now it’s known that there are ways to reduce the chance of transmission to the newborn, and testing is being done more routinely for high-risk women.)

At least Reagan didn’t do anything to encourange the spread of AIDS.

19

I started another thread on a related topic, if anyone in interested. It can be found here/

20

Phil Burton, for one. You’ve probably heard of him, but in case you haven’t, he was a congressman from California until his death in 1983. He came close to becoming House Majority leader in the '70s. He was a strong advocate of AIDS research, education and prevention.

Henry Waxman, also a Democrat from CA, was also a strong advocate in the fight against AIDS, as was Al Gore, and Ted Kennedy. There were also a number of strong Democratic politicians on state and local levels.

Also, (although outside the scope of your question), there were Republicans during the time period who spoke out for AIDS programs.

Orrin Hatch, Republican from Utah, was, and still is, a leading crusader in the Senate for more money for AIDS research and fighting against discrinination against people with AIDS.

C. Everett Koop, Reagan’s Surgeon General, caused a good deal of controversy in the White House when he released a report on the spread of AIDS and urged that programs be set up to discuss AIDS transmission and sex education.

So, to answer your question, there were a number of politicians of both parties who were active in speaking out against AIDS.