You misread.
One could just as easily ask why you need him to not be white. You’re pressing the point harder than anyone in this thread.
Like I mentioned before, the first cops at the scene identified him as a white guy. Multiple times, with no qualification.
His previous arrest record for assaulting a cop showed him as white, too. I can dig the record up for that, if you doubt me.
My personal rule of thumb is if the police thinks you’re white, for all practical purposes, you’re white.
Okay, why did the cops call him white if this is so obvious. And what do you think it says about them that they listed him such, when he so very clearly isn’t white, according to you? Do you think they were making a political statement? Or do you think they just went with what their eyes and head told them he was.
I am a straight up Mestiza and I saw Zimmerman as a white person from the start. I still see him as white man, as white as his wife. Plenty of white people are of his coloring and features. What is the big deal?
It depends.
I’ve heard numerous black people make statements about the Rodney King beating.
Without a single exception all have described it as a beating perpetrate by “4 white cops” and not a single one has said that it was committed by “3 whites and 1 Hispanic” or “3 whites and 1 Mexican” even thought one of the police officers, Ted Briseno was Mexican-American.
For the record, Briseno was as “dark” as Zimmerman so presumably XT will be quite shocked by this and start insisting that all the accounts of the beating being conducted by “4 white cops” is bullshit.
Similarly, in Florida, contrary to what XT’s been claiming, light-skinned Latinos generally are considered white and claim that they’re white.
Anybody who disputes that should talk to some Cuban-Americans in Miami.
In the words of Matt Yglesias, “light-skinned Cuban dudes consider themselves white and generally are considered white.”
Matt Yglesias, for those not aware, is himself a “light-skinned Cuban dude”.
Similarly, back in the 80s, there were a number of high-profile shootings of blacks in Miami by cops identified as “white” both by the black community and the Florida media and general public. Several of the cops who did the shootings were Cuban or Colombian immigrants.
Now, obviously “whiteness” is in the eye of the beholder, but it strikes me as ridiculous to say that people of 100% European descent aren’t white so personally I don’t see anything weird about classifying Andy Garcia, Jose Canseco, Salma Hayek, Penelope Cruz, Emilio Estevez, and Sofia Vegara as “white” and all of them are considered “blancas” or “blancos” in Latin America.
From the looks of him, Zimmerman seems to be of 100% or nearly 100% European descent and there’s no evidence that he’s been treated throughout his life as anything but a white guy.
Had I asserted that he looked white because he looks like someone from Portugal or Sicily you’d have a point, but you don’t.
I merely asked if you consider Portuguese-Americans and Sicilian-Americans to be “white” and if you think they look “white.”
The fact is lots of people in Pawtucket RI and Fall River MA have the same coloring as Zimmerman and they’re generally considered white.
I never made any such claim. I simply have pointed out that many Hispanics do consider themselves white, particularly those who are of 100% or nearly 100% European descent.
Moreover, historically, light-skinned Hispanics have been treated as white. To give obvious examples, until 1952, by law immigrants could only become naturalized US citizens if they were “free white persons” which is why Chinese, Japanese, and Filipino immigrants weren’t allowed to become naturalized. By contrast, Latin American immigrants were able to be naturalized and Hispanics born in the US were generally classified as “caucasians” on their birth certificates.
Similarly, there were lots of light-skinned Latin Americans playing in the Major Leagues when baseball had an official “whites only” policy.
Nor for that matter would I Love Lucy have been such a huge hit or even been allowed to air had people not thought of Dezi Arnez as “white” since Americans in the 1950s would certainly not have tolerated the idea of a blonde white woman getting defiled by a non-white.
That obviously didn’t mean that light-skinned Hispanics weren’t subjected to prejudice and discrimination but nobody argues that the Irish or Italians weren’t white because of the discrimination they faced.
[QUOTE=florez]
I am a straight up Mestiza and I saw Zimmerman as a white person from the start. I still see him as white man, as white as his wife. Plenty of white people are of his coloring and features. What is the big deal?
[/QUOTE]
Serious question here…do you see yourself as ‘white’? Why or why not…and is it no big deal if someone calls you ‘white’…you cool with that, 'mano? I ask because I’ve seen plenty of hispanics who WANT to be ‘white’, and who want to see themselves as ‘white’…and be seen as ‘white’. I can sympathize…I’ve striven all my life to be part of this country, to blend in, to lose the accent and be an American. My children don’t even speak Spanish, and my wife actually IS ‘white’ (i.e. northern European, blonde, blue eyed, etc etc).
[QUOTE=you with the face]
One could just as easily ask why you need him to not be white. You’re pressing the point harder than anyone in this thread.
[/QUOTE]
I’m going to answer this question and then leave it at that. If you people want to see him as ‘white’ then fuck it…he’s ‘white’.
Why is it a big deal to me? Because it annoys the fuck out of me when people categorize hispanics as white, that’s why. There is no political horseshit or spin on my side…it’s just fucking annoying to me. Yeah, some of my ancestors were from Europe. That doesn’t make me either ‘white’ or European though. What I’d like to know is this…where the fuck were all of you when I was a kid? Huh? I wasn’t fucking ‘white’ then. But now I am, ehe? Because, you know, I COULD just be a really tanned Italian, or a Spaniard, or maybe an Arab or Greek…all presumably ‘white’. Now. Not when I was a kid though…oh no, not then. I have cousins who look like Mr. Zimmerman…they weren’t ‘white’ either, not when they were younger. But they are now. Because, you know, a bunch of white folks think he looks white to them. Just a European with a good tan and all.
Anyway, I’ll leave it there. It bothers me. A few years ago it would have SERIOUSLY bothered me (as Red can attest), but not so much anymore. At any rate, I don’t really give that much of a shit about the case. I haven’t participated in any of the myriad (ridiculous IMHO) Zimmerman train wrecks. I came in here because I thought it was ridiculous that Bricker was being called a racist for his stance on this silly subject. It’s interesting to me how mild the responses were to this assertion, over all…and interesting that this hijack about whether Zimmerman is or isn’t a hispanic has gotten more responses, and heated responses than that. I know why it bothers ME…what’s funny is why it seems so important to the rest of you to ‘prove’ that he’s ‘white’. I see that Ibn Warraq has got some more proofs lined up that he presumably feels knock this one out of the park. 
-XT
I have met many people who call themselves Hispanic and want desperately to be white, even though they are not. I am sorry for your frustration, but I always assumed that the wanting to be white thing was based on the belief that whites have more power, resources, and a higher status.
Maybe the people who choose this route are trying hard to move up the ladder, and maybe they are trying hard to improve their lives and the lives of their children. It is very understandable.
You say that you have striven all your life to blend in to America, that you married a white woman and that your children do not speak Spanish. This was your choice, and more power to you for going there, I hope you found your bliss.
My choice was different, no one would call me white, and I was encouraged by my family to hold my head up despite racism. I grew up during the civil rights and ethnic pride era, so also I had social encouragement to be proud of our culture and language.
I married a native American like many others in my family. It seems that we shared with the native people a sort of pride in being different from Europeans, historically and in many ways.
My daughter speaks Spanish, English, and some of her fathers language, which was almost a lost language but for revival studies and a few native speakers left to teach it.
Choices are what made my child, myself, my elders, and my ancestors not be white.
The relevance to the case is that the treatment George Zimmerman, who is considered white by everyone he meets until he tells them otherwise, receives when he murders somebody, is markedly different than the treatment that Jose Maria de Jesus who looks like a stereotype receives, not to mention what Treyvon Martin would have received if the roles were reversed. Duh.
Then the problem that needs to be addressed is why other people are not receiving the same treatment as Zimmerman, as his treatment has been entirely correct according to the law. Are you seriously arguing that, because some non-white people have been mistreated by the authorities, Zimmerman should be similarly mistreated?
Also, nice attempt at poisoning the well by pretending it’s a settled matter that he “murdered” someone.
Not to worry. Turns out I deserve it, what with my elevating the law over common sense.
Kind of reminds me of a story about G. Gordon Liddy, who was sentenced to 20 years in prison for his role in the Watergate burglary – a first-offense burglary in which no property was stolen and no one was injured. His lawyer sought assistance during the appeals process, and reportedly reached out to the ACLU. “If it was anyone else, yes,” was the reported response, “But not G. Gordon Liddy.”
No, I did not; might want to read what I wrote yet again. I simply made a statement saying that there are, in fact, quite a large number of “white Hispanics.” Which is simply a fact: you can be Hispanic AND white. As is the case that many within that subset are as racist as can be.
Note that I am not saying Zimmerman was a racist, I simply don’t know that for a fact. But that he could pass for white…no doubt.
I don’t see how anything I wrote could reasonable be construed to say that, no.
You’re just proving my point. The idea of you going to bat like this for Cory Maye is ludicrous. In conservative land, arrest means gui.ty and that’s that and how dare you question our noble and patriotic cops…unless a white guy gets accused of a crime against a black guy and then suddenly you all turn into Clarence Fucking Darrow.
Are you George Zimmerman? I thought that this was whom this discussion is about. It’s not about you.
If we’re being honest with ourselves, it should come as no surprise why people call GZ white. His last name is Zimmerman and he has no Spanish accent. There, I said it. Put that combination together with his light brown skin and what you get is a guy whose Latino-ness easily gets overlooked or unrecognized due the blinding effect of people’s assumptions.
If he had a Peruvian accent and was named him Garcia, it would be different. But big deal. Either way it’s nothing to get upset over. Being upset suggests you’re the one giving the label of white more power than called for.
Sounds like the same kind of baggage some black people have when it’s comes to the “biracial” labeling trend. Used to be if you had any visible (or even not so visible) black blood, you were called black and that was that. Maybe it was crazy, but it greatly simplified things. Now, people want to call themselves or others “mixed” or “biracial”. And it pisses some people off because they perceive that as a way of seperating the golden children from the stigmatized darkies.
But your issue seems to be different than this. Correct me if I’m wrong, but I’m getting the sense that you’re jealous that he gets the honor of being called white when you were denied that. This is your baggage talking. If some people think that GZ is white, it has nothing to do with you. These are just labels.
I was a public defender. My job, every day, was to rebut the proposition that arrest means guilty.
And I was a conservative.
How is that possible?
According to Condescending Robot, that’s because all your clients were white and all the alleged victims of your clients were black.
Hell, Bricker, for all we know, it might have been the best you could do.
Cite? The ACLU have defended Rush Limbaugh, NAMBLA and the Phelps family. I think they’re the definition of non-partisan.
Liddy himself relates the take in his book Will.. He says that when he discovers his lawyer made overtures to the ACLU, he was furious.
So my cite is Will, Liddy’s autobiography.
What does this mean?
And of course G. Gordon Liddy is famous for his integrity and honesty so if he said this happened it had to have happened.