I really don’t get the anger in here today. I can’t understand the idea of “America chose wrong,” when in this particular case, that’s logically impossible. “America,” insofar as that even means anything, chose people they wanted to hear sing over people they didn’t so much want to hear sing. Why is that so wrong?
I just don’t believe that there’s any objective standard when it comes to singing, such that you can say with certainty that Jennifer was better than John, and that her elimination and his safety are therefore injustices. People’s opinions about the relative merits of different singers vary wildly. Sure, Jennifer is more technically proficient than John. But hey, Diana is generally flawless technically, and a large number of people hate her as if she were a serial killer of puppies. To go into agonies at the injustice of it all because a sizable percentage of the population disagrees with your assessment of the relative merits of the singers? It doesn’t make sense. It’s music. There will always be debate; there will always be disagreement. The winner of American Idol cannot be presumed to be the “best” of the candidates, simply because there is no way that makes sense for us to truly determine who is “best” in an objective sense… we can only determine who people want to hear the most.
For that reason, I was actually furious at the little lectures that Ryan and the judges were giving the viewing audience last night. Viewers are entitled to enjoy a performer for any reason they wish - if they’ll buy his or her CD. Look, I am aware that Luciano Pavarotti is generally considered a brilliant singer, far, far better than, say, Eric Clapton Put them both on a stage and make me vote for whose CD I’m more likely to buy, whose performances I enjoy more from my own subjective standpoint… I’ll vote for Clapton.
But, storyteller, I’ve done an in-depth survey of the four other people I know IRL who are watching the show, and all of us say the results are wrong! (Did I mention that none of us vote?) I think it’s obvious that there is something rotten in Denmark.
Three of us IRL here - all fine with the results. I badly want to see John go (for his sake as much as ours), but I never like Jennifer at all. Her eyes bugging out of her head was distracting. Lately she seems to be overcompensating for that and pretty much keeping them shut the whole time. And I don’t like the shouting style that she had. I could barely tell what song she was singing on Tuesday night.
That’s the problem. I like all three of the divas, so even as I sat there, dumbfounded at the bottom three, I couldn’t figure out which one I would save if I were ambitious enough to bother voting.
I really liked Jennifer in the last couple of weeks and I’m sad to see her go. I think maybe, if I were to vote, I would choose Fantasia. But I like Latoya, too! See??! This is hard!
I think John Stevens just wants to be put out of his misery already. He knows he should have been gone at least 3 weeks ago and he’s in WAY over his head. He has the potential to be a good singer, but needs a few years of seasoning first.
I am amused by the shock and wailing about the injustice of it all and the predictable spilling of ink (and pixels) by both entertainment journalists and Internet posters… Fox is playing this storyline to the hilt. John Stevens really isn’t as bad as they say he is, nor is Jennifer that great (just screechy), but you’d think from the response that William Hung beat Ella Fitzgerald in a sing-off. I’ve been trying to tell people this is not really “reality TV”, but just a contest, but it definitely is reality television and more entertaining because of it.
I agree – Fantasia’s career is already made. If she had left last night, it would have been better, because her CD would have come out that much sooner! Poor Jennifer though – I’m not sure we’ll ever hear from her again.
I also agree with DtC – after the top 10, we should vote for whom to kick, not for whom to keep.
And re: John Stevens – it’s fine if you like him, but please don’t pretend he’s a good singer. He’s not. And that is not an opinion, it is a simple fact!
storyteller, I completely agree that there isn’t anything “unfair” about more Americans saying they’d rather hear Diana or John over Jennifer, or LaToya over George, or Fantasia over LaToya, etc. And if it were only about singing style, such as, to use your example, Pavarotti vs Clapton (who I disagree isn’t as technically proficient – he’s brilliant at his craft*), then no big deal. But in this case, I think the one thing people are the angriest about is that John Stevens, who, like Simon said the other night, is not a good singer, is still in this competition merely because people think he’s adorable and not because they actually prefer his out-of-tune warbling over Jennifer’s SCREAMING. Sure, some people do prefer his style of music, but everything I read from his “fans” admits that even though they like him better because they like his style, he doesn’t actually do it well, but they vote for him anyway.
The problem for the judges (particularly Simon) and the producers is that they’re going to be stuck promoting whoever wins this thing, and if that turns out to be John, they’ll lose millions of dollars because he will tank. Radio will not play him, television will not book him and the majority of non-AI-viewing America will not randomly hear him and rush out to buy his album because his voice sounds so great (since it doesn’t). I would be willing to bet you that if John Stevens wins this thing, the producers will scrap the entire format and we won’t have an AI4, or we’ll have a very, very different one.
(*Have you heard his new CD? It’s on our amazon.com wish list, but we haven’t bought it yet.)
As far as Simon and the producers go, well, the world’s smallest violin is playing just for them, and John Stevens is singing along. They could have done any number of things to make certain they ended up with a good singer - notably, passed only good singers into the final 32. Bao Viet, Cassie LeBeau, Lisa Leuschner, even that doofus Michael Keown all could have been passed at least one step further than they were. Simon et al put John Stevens in the final 32; they have to live with the fact that he might do better than they expected.
For the rest, I hear you, and I feel your pain. But honestly, I really would rather listen to John’s out of tune warbling than Jennifer screaming. I’d also rather listen to John than Jasmine (honestly, Jasmine makes me feel like I think John makes many of you feel). I find something soothing and pleasing in his voice, regardless of whether he misses notes. Really and truly. I’d rather listen to George than either one of them. I’d rather listen to Diana than George. And of course, Fantasia and LaToya are in a class by themselves.
But to me, it doesn’t really matter what order the rest are eliminated. Someone will win; everyone else won’t. In the meantime, I - and I suspect many people who actually vote - want to keep some variety in the mix, just to keep the actual broadcasts from becoming an endless stream of Whitney on parade.
I guess I’m gonna have to start voting. I was shocked when I turned to AI in the last minutes and saw Jennifer standing there. It makes no sense. Then I hear that LaToya and Fantasia were also in the bottom three, and I really got confused.
I don’t understand the sympathy voting. Diana, John, and Jasmine are not fit to be backup singers for the other four, and I think most people know it. They seem to feel sorry for John, and hey, I do too. He’s awful. But, this isn’t a contest for most pathetic. Or is it?
John Stevens is my least favorite singer ths year, bar none. And I like subtle, understated singers too. Imho, he just isn’t very good. Likeable, but not very good.
BUT, this nonsense where he should just be put out of his misery and send him home, is off base.
He’s made it half way through the final 12. He obviously has a following. And more power to him.
I disagree. There is a concrete, objective difference between an ok singer and a good singer. John is not a good singer. You can like him. You can like his voice. That doesn’t change the fact that he is not a good singer.
A good singer has a larger than average range (an ability to sing both high notes and low notes clearly). John does not.
A good singer can modulate (sing louder and softer, while still being clear and in tune). John does not.
A good singer sings in key consistently, and hits the vast majority (I won’t say all, because I’m sure even the best occasionally miss a note) the notes correctly. John does not.
Just because, in some people’s opinion, his voice has a pleasant tone, and he generally sings in tune, does not mean he is a good singer. He is not, and that is not an opinion.
Sliding away from the whole Red 04 issue, did ya happen to notice how much Seacrest was milking the whole drama last night? Sure, drama, Seacrest, that’s what the results show is for/about. He went to previously unplumbed depths last night though, face right up into the camera, elongated pausing, breathless announcing, drawing out words, that entire set up making poor George go ‘stand with the top group.’ :rolleyes:
Egads, what’s next? About the only way he could top himself now is to start reading the cue cards like. William. Shatner. with. unnatural. separations.
Once again, I’ve reconsidered my opinion about what should happen to JS. Last night, TWoP was chockablock with posts saying, “He’s miserable…He wants to go…Put him on suicide watch…It’s not right to do this to him; STOP VOTING…”* Then I rewatched the results show.
And I am no longer convinced that JS wants to go home so bad that he’ll chew his own foot off if he has to. People keep saying and saying that he “looks miserable” and so on, but I really didn’t see him looking upset this week. Flabbergasted when he found out who the bottom three were, yeah, but so did everyone else.
Is it possible that he really does have the stamina to keep on?
Maybe he really likes to sing, and is grateful to have this chance to learn and improve and stretch.
Maybe he’s not a quitter.
Maybe his strength is that he is a teenager, and specifically one of those teenagers who sees a challenge and rises to it.
Maybe he’s at a point now where he’s not about to let the haters win. (Which is not to say that he wants to win the competition, just that he’s not going to say, “You’re right; I can’t sing; I withdraw,” or deliberately low-ball his performance.)
Maybe he has it in himself to survive this. Maybe what isn’t killing him is making him stronger. Maybe he doesn’t need anyone’s damn pity.
*Not to mention the people saying “DIE, JOHN, DIE” and “Get me a lock of his hair for my voodoo doll!” and “He better have bodyguards, 'cause his ass is grass if I catch him”. I mean, come on. [William Shatner]How old are you people! It’s just a TV show! Gah…IT’S JUST A TV SHOW![/WS]
I kinda like John Stevens. He has the potential to follow in the footsteps of Harry Connick Jr- but the style he sings needs serious charisma to back it up, and right now he just doesn’t have it. Give him ten years, get him laid on a regular basis, break his heart a few times, and he may well develop that presence, but right now, I think people are voting for him either because he’s cute (and he is, like a bunnyrabbit) or because they see that potential. He isn’t an American Idol- but he may grow up to be one.
If I cared enough, I’d vote for La Toya. To me, her performances are consistently professional, like she’s singing at her own concert and not auditioning over and over, which is what I see a lot from the others. Very polished and confident, and I just like the smoothness of her voice.
HennaDancer
He said something to Jennifer when he hugged her and she shook her head at him. I later heard Seacrest said that John said “it should have been me”. Granted this could just be to set up for more drama but I do think John looks miserable everytime he gets off the hook, especially when one of the better singers ends up in the bottom 3 instead.
Ya know, the thing that still annoys me even more than the idiotic voting and the people complaining about it all being racist, is what they did to George. That was so damn cruel to tell him to go stand with the top group and make him pick which group. That was cruel for so many different reasons.
