And it Begins:Sabathia to the Yankees

The Game Room
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There’s not really an active baseball offseason thread right now, I guess partially because there’s barely been any baseball offseason, but in the lat 24 hours two of the big chips have fallen, both to New York teams.

First, the Mets have all-but-signed Francisco (“K-Rod”) Rodriguez to replace Billy Wagner. There’s not much to dislike there, I guess; they desperately needed bullpen help, Wagner won’t play this year, and Rodriguez was the best available guy. He’ll only be 27 when the new season starts, which makes him a pretty good investment for three years. All the same, I’m weirdly disappointed. I think the Mets only have one major splash in them this offseason, and to make that splash with a guy who - no matter how good - will pitch only 70 innings in a good year seems short-sighted. I’d have preferred if they had used that financial capital to make a real run at one of the top-level starters - Derek Lowe would be my preference, since Sabathia was never realistic for the Mets - and then signed somebody like Brian Fuentes to close. I mean, I’m hearing they’re going to go for Jon Garland as their starting pitcher add, and I just can’t see that Garland + K-Rod > Lowe + Fuentes would have been. Oh, well.

Second, this morning ESPN is reporting that C.C. Sabathia has reached a preliminary agreement to join the Pinstriped Legions of Hell. The contract is reportedly six years, $140 million, and Sabathia’s first-born. I suppose it was inevitable, but I got a little frisson of excitement thinking that maybe Sabathia was about something other than the money, which was stupid. Repeat after me, boys and girls: it’s always about the money.

Now the Yankees will pursue Burnett and Lowe, and if they get both in addition to Sabathia it’s possible I may resign from baseball fandom in disgust (actually, I won’t, but I’ll bitch about it heartily on this board).

Outside of New York, most of the rest of the league seems content to let the top teams grab the top players and pick at the leftovers. I’m amazed that no West Coast team made even a credible offer for Sabathia; 6 years and $115M from the Dodgers might have actually gotten it done.

So what think, all? Where do you expect them all to end up? What’s your favorite team been doing so far this offseason, and does it make you psyched for baseball season or inclined to watch more football? Let’s argue about something!

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I’m also fairly indifferent to signing KRod, but the other options weren’t without risk, and the terms weren’t bad at all. I disagree though that the Mets could have had Lowe + Fuentes for anything close to what Garland + KRod would cost. Fuentes asking price has been around what the Mets paid for KRod. Now KRod’s asking price started much higher, but still I don’t think Fuentes is going to sign for less than 3 years 30 million, and perhaps a bit higher. The Yankess, Red Sox, and Phillies are all pursuing Lowe. He wants at least 4 years 64 million, and will likely get it. The 2 million a year saves would do little to dent the difference between Garland and Lowe

I think if the money was close, Sabathia would have gone to the west coast. I can’t really blame him for taking the money though.

I’m not upset they signed Sabathia, because he wasn’t what they needed. The best free agent is still there and the one who would have been the best fit for the Yankees. Now he most likely will stay in Anaheim. The Yankees main problems last year were offensively and defensively, and they have done nothing to address them. Boston and Tampa are both still better.

I want the Mets to sign Juan Cruz, Ben Sheets and then take a bunch of flyers on the Brad Penny’s of the world. Plus, bring in as many hard throwers as you can find to audition for the bullpen. I’d also like to make Heilman a starter, but that isn’t going to happen. I hope Scheidner becomes a Red Sox, and the Mets can pursue a Castro/Zaun platoon. We need an outfielder and 2nd baseman too, but I’m inclined to let the market play out, and see if one of the sluggers is available for cheap come Feb. We also need to upgrade the bench, get a credible platoon mate for Delgado and generally avoid ever employing Marlon Anderson again,

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I think you’re being a little hard on Sabathia. I remember hearing him talk years ago about wanting to play for a big team and you don’t get much bigger than the Yankees.

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Even he did sign with Yankees because they offered the most money, so what? Why is it wrong for a player to want money? How does this make him any less of a person or a baseball player? Why should I respect him any less? It isn’t like he tried to sell a senate seat to get extra cash. He simply took the best offer.

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According to Jon Heyman, The Yankees are in serious negotiations with Derek Lowe and are also looking at either Ben Sheets or A.J. Burnett to complete their pitching staff.

SI.com

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I would love it if the Mets signed Sheets and Penny. I’ve always thought Penny was underappreciated and Sheets has yet to have that career year that would make him ridiculously expensive, but I know it’s in him. So now’s the time to sign.

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After living through the hell of the build-by-buying Yankee teams of the 80s, I generally don’t like the idea going after every big name FA out there. It rarely works out. That being said, it’s better than trading away good young prospects for old, past-their-prime “name” players. I hope Sabathia’s stated preference for the West Coast was more of a bargaining chip, because the last thing the Yanks need is a guy who just grabbed the biggest contract out there and won’t give his all. I’m willing to give him the benefit of the doubt and see how he performs.

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I have to agree with Hawkeyeop - I have no idea why the Yankees didn’t make a huge effort for Texeira, and I say that as a fan. He does everything well and he’s light years better than any member of the 1B/DH/LF platoon they’ve been doing lately with Damon, Matsui, Betemit and others, and in fact, I might even go so far as to say he’s better than Nick Swisher. :stuck_out_tongue:

The prices for Sabathia and Texeira were pretty similar except that a position player is a better investment than a pitcher who goes out there only once every five days. They did need to improve their pitching and Sabathia is certainly the best option, so it’s not like I’m rueing the signing, but I’m confused by the strategy. I could see signing Burnett, but Lowe is getting old and I don’t feel the enthusiasm there.

I’m part of the Francisco Rodriguez-is-overrated brigade, and we knew the Mets were going to sign him, so I was glad to see that work out. The Mets will be paying Wagner and Rodriguez about $22 million next season, incidentally.

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Can someone explain to me why Peavy hasn’t been a big, or bigger target than Sabathia? It seems like only the Cubs are trying to sign him? I don’t follow the National league that closely, but I thought he was a #1 starter?

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Peavy isn’t a free agent. He is still a Padre and has a no trade clause. He is very specific is the places he is willing to go (Reportably only Chicago and LAD).

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Their starting pitching is a shambles. You have:

Wang - very solid pitcher, but was injured last year
Chamberlain - dynamic potential ace, but too young to rely on
Hughes - 0-4 last year
Kennedy - 0-4 last year

They can probably re-sign Pettitte, but he was a .500 pitcher last year, and he’s not getting any younger. You can’t go into the season with that as your starting 5. You need at least one other guy at the top of the rotation.

Sign C.C. and Pettitte, and you push Kennedy off the rotation, if he straightens out, he’ll give you coverage in case of injury, or if Hughes doesn’t get it done. I’m not sure I’d go after another FA starter, unless that means you don’t sign Pettitte. I certainly wouldn’t go after another 2 starters, why pay big bucks for your #5 when you can put that money towards the hole you have at 1st? Your #5 starter is where you’re supposed to put guys like Hughes and Kennedy.

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Ah, that makes sense then, thanks.

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I understand they needed to improve the pitching and I’m glad they are doing so. What I didn’t understand was the fact that they ignored Texeira and might give Lowe a five-year deal that would take him to age 40. They also probably outbid themselves for Sabathia, but it’s not my money. When I referred to strategy, I was saying I am concerned they are throwing money at the problem without regard to merit.

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Of course the Yankees could use Sabathia and Lowe, but the rotation was good last year. Wang and Joba are a credible 1/2. Hughes was a top prospect, arguably more so than Joba, who had a bit of a rough adjustment. It happens. Anything less than giving him 30 starts would be a huge mistake. Kennedy has fringe stuff, but he likely still can be a back end starter. Bring back Pettitte or some equivilant, and it is still a pretty good rotation.

Meanwhile, if Posada can’t catch, you don’t have a catcher. Swisher could be alright at first, but that is no guarantee. He was terrible last year. Cano took a major step back. Jeter is starting to show his age, and the Yankees lack a credible replacement. He wasn’t a good defensive shortstop in his prime and he can’t defend or hit like he used to. Arod also is not a good defensive 3rd baseman anymore as well. Cabrera and Gardner can’t hit enough to play center every day, and Damon no longer can play it defensively. Damon and Matsui are best mediocre corner outfielders now. There isn’t really a DH on the roster, just whoever happens to be left over.

I see a mediocre aging offense and a terrible defense, and absolutely no depth up the middle. Much bigger problems than anything in the pitching staff.

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For whatever it’s worth, I believe his line drive stats were similar to past years - he just hit more of them at people. An out’s an out, but if I’m remembering correctly, it suggested he may not do the same next year.

Cano and Cabrera were disappointing last year, but I’m not prepared to give up on either.

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Oh I agree Swisher was worth taking a chance on. And the SABR numbers generally say he will bounce back. The scouting though said his bat was really slow, and that isn’t necessarily something you come back from. Delgado did though, so we shall see. Sometimes you just lose it.

Oh and putting Lowe behind that infield is a terrible idea.

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I suppose you’re right. I Live in and love San Francisco. Supposedly, Sabathia loves the city and wanted to play here. I don’t begrudge him taking the longer-term contract (I think the numbers tossed around by the Giants were only in the 3-year or 4-year range, bor maybe a million or two less per year.)

But I did the math in my head, and for ME, I’d gladly take, say, $125 / 6 to play in SF, over $140 / 6 in NY. But the players seem to never do it. I’d take the 6-year deal over the 3-year deal (maybe not in football, because they can cut you whenever they want without paying you, but definitely in baseball or basketball), but to me, getting to play in MY CITY is worth the small pay cut.

Maybe I’m nuts. I certainly can’t say I have any experience dealing with such huge numbers outside of math class…

Joe

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Now, the question is Sabathia the next Barry Zito? :smiley:

I do wonder about Sabathia if he gets off to another slow start like last year. He’s never been exposed to anything like the New York media and he doesn’t seem to take criticism well.

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The Tigers tradedfor Gerald Laird, filling up the hole at catcher. Laird will do rather well outside of a platoon, and he’s a good doubles hitter, which works for him at spacious Comerica Park. Also, he’s reputed to call a game rather well.

We’re about to signAdam Everett, who has no bat at all, but is great with the glove, which we need up the middle after the Edgar Renteria fiasco went up in flames last year. Everett will more than likely platoon the position with Ramon Santiago, also very good defensively, but we don’t know if he can take the everyday grind.

Also, the Tigers are looking to tradefor JJ. Putz. The Mariners want either Jeff Larish and/or Matt Joyce, both good, promising left handed bats. That upsets me, because then we’re without the decent bats. I’d trade Larish over Joyce. Either way, we’re short on left-handed bats. I’d be cool with signing Trevor Hoffman and calling the closer role filled for a year or two.

There’s a need for a lefty in the bullpen, and the Tigers are eyeingJoe Beimel.

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The Yanks overpaid but they desperately need a real Ace. Now they need one more pitcher and it does not need to be Lowe or A.J. Sheets or Andy Pettitte should be enough.

As for Texiera, the Yanks still of plenty of money left over as nearly $75 million cleared from the payroll.

I think the Mets did good get K-Rod. The price was reasonable.