Because guys are stupid and getting laid is a powerful motivator?
Brilliant post, Bone.
Really well said.
“You should have known better” might be a valid argument if you’re talking about a natural disaster or something like not maintaining the tires on your car and then experiencing a blow out. Maybe.
But it’s not a valid criticism when there is another human being actively mistreating you. “You let him do it” is not an argument meant when the harm is coming from a human being who is choosing to harm you.
It might or might not constitute sexual assault as a matter of criminal law. However, as a societal matter, we are perfectly justified in treating someone who behaves like this as a person who commits sexual assault when we are deciding whether we want to associate with him personally or professionally.
Wouldn’t you shun someone who did this to someone you cared about? Wouldn’t you tell your social circle to stay away from this person, who coerces his SO to “starfish” for him every night without caring how it makes her feel?
Again, even if we posit that Dykstra stupidly and pathetically got herself into the mess she was complaining about, this still doesn’t mean that publicizing her story as a warning to others is inherently wrong.
It seems like people are faulting for her staying with this abusive jerk, while also faulting her advising others not to follow in her footsteps. Other than staying quiet for the rest of her life, what should someone in her position do? I would like someone to take a stab at this question.
Right, so you understand the psychology of the man who didn’t dump his crazy lying girlfriend the first time she crazy lied. Or who goes to a hotel room with a woman who might crazy lie him. He did it for reasons that are explicable to you.
But the reasons a woman might be alone in a room with a man are unfathomable mysteries to some people.
Right, regardless of how deficient you find Dyktra’s character, it’s perfectly just to judge Hardwick for doing those things in the first place. The fact that he got away with it for three years doesn’t exonerate him.
Unless he didn’t do it. She COULD be lying. That’s not an attack, by the way—just a suggestion. And it’s also possible he’s a total dick who’s done worse than she described. WE JUST DON’T KNOW AND SHOULD REFRAIN FROM PRE-JUDGING.
This side steps the question I asked. If this experience actually happened to her, do you think she’s wrong for talking about it?
Forget about what readers should do with this info. I wouldn’t recognize either of these people if they sat next to me on the train, so I’m wondering if that’s why I read her piece without immediately wondering about his side of the story.
I’m wondering about one element of this story, as a general issue (rather than with respect to the celebrities involved): the issue of being a recovering alcoholic and, as a consequence of that, preferring and choosing partners who don’t drink during the duration of the relationship.
Is it considered abusive, in and of itself, for a recovering alcoholic to say “I’m a recovering alcoholic and if we are going to get into a relationship, it needs to be alcohol-free”…?
I’m talking specifically about “beginning of a potential relationship” situations. I’m not talking about ‘out of the blue he told me I couldn’t drink and I had nowhere to go because I have no assets, no allies, and even though I don’t like this change that he’s trying to impose on me after X time together, I have to comply because I have no other options.’ Again, I’m talking about ‘we just got to know each other and are considering a serious relationship’ situations.
Abusive?
Abusive only if it’s a man saying it to a woman? Abusive regardless of who says it and what genders are involved in the prospective relationship? Not abusive? Sometimes abusive?
If it actually happened, yes she has every right to talk about it. However, the one she accused may also be a composite, with the traits of more than one individual described that everyone seems to assume is one person. CH may be guilty of some things but not others, if he’s guilty at all. Again, we should refrain from judging without more information.
You are judging. In the absence of more information you have judged her not credible.
And what does it look like when one refrain me from pre-judging? It looks like this—“We have suspended production on Hardwick’s show while we look into these accusations “
It looks like this—“Hey, Hardwick, explain yourself. Is this true?”
The we look at Dyktra’s allegation and we look at Hardwick’s response and we decide whom to believe.
And, guess what, THAT’S EXACTLY WHAT WE ARE DOING.
What is NOT a valid response is things like—
“I don’t think she is a victim.”
“The threat was to break off the relationship. Not much of a threat. Let me fuck you when ever I want to this sicko relationship is over. Gives her a nice out.”
“Many couples do it when only one party is really interested. That does not constitute sexual assault.”
Statements like this are bricks in the wall that create our culture of rape.
2-10% is the range often quoted but with reference to sexual crimes reported to the police so the number is in that range. But it’s the rate from various studies of false reports of criminal sexual assaults, defined as “a reported crime to a law enforcement agency that an investigation factually proves never occurred.”
There are no studies of what % of criminal accusations are actually false. Nobody knows that, but it must include some % of cases where charges aren’t filed or people are acquitted (though of course some ‘no charge’ and acquittals are of guilty people, ie we don’t know). More importantly here though, and in some other borderline ‘me too’ accusations, those studies do not deal with subjective differences in characterizing what is abusive or harassment beyond criminal violations. There are lots of legal things you shouldn’t do to other people but we can’t ignore the subjective element in defining them, that problem in definition is one of the reasons they aren’t illegal.
In short, there are no stats saying how ‘likely’ it a story like Dyktra’s is 100% reflective of what any given person would have concluded with video and audio of every moment of their relationship. One is still completely free to say they automatically believe her because she’s a woman, but there are no directly relevant stats.
Saying “I’m in recovery, and for the sake of my sobriety I need you to not drink around me at all.” is a reasonable request.
Saying “I noticed you have a glass of wine with dinner. That’s going to stop.” (bolding mine) is different. Not “I’d like you to stop”, not “I need you to stop” but an assertion that, because he wills it so, she WILL NOT be drinking. It is not necessarily abusive in itself, but it is a huge red flag that he expects to be dictating what she does in the future.
Yes, that is right.
I have CXG, I don’t feel the need to publicly identify her or give all the details. If in were to give advice I’d say “if you think something is off, it probably is and it won’t get ant better. It’s better to end things quickly a”.
And you have judged her as credible and him as not credible. You are no better than anyone else you criticize.
It’s also what the attitude is towards saying no to the request- if saying no, somehow she’s wrong for not doing what you told her to vs saying no means you two have different priorities and values Nd it’s just a bad match.
Abuse not in and of itself, but, as the focus of the article is about, it can be a red flag worth noticing.
I’m not the one claiming that I’m not judging her. You are arguing that your position is somehow neutral, but it is not.
Yes, her story seems credible and in the absence of any additional info I believe her. If that info comes to light, then I’ll change my opinion. If she claiming abuse by little green men, I would judge her story not credible, unless evidence comes to light.
Nothing was changing until women started publicly identifying the men behaving like this in private, until the floodgates started opening, people started believing them, and started punishing men for their private behavior. This is what it took to start changing society. It needs to continue to happen.
Let me ask you this—if it it turns out that every word Dykstra has written is true, then is it not a good thing that she did this? If not, why? Why shouldn’t someone who has behaved like this in private be publicly humiliated?