BTW, anyone else reminded of A Wrinkle in Time by this part?
Anya spoke of shrimp both times; Willow didn’t say anything about shrimp, although Tara admitted an allergy to shrimp.
From Superstar:
From Triangle:
I liked the scenes with Wes and Ilyria, but then I’m a sucker for dialogue that tries to explore human nature. And so I liked the morose Lorne in the bar, too.
The heel dimension was a bit too recycled from ‘The Truman Show’ for my taste and the watchdog in the basement was a bit too much like Humungus of ‘Road Warrior’. The episode didn’t feel like a filler, but rather a bridge and I enjoyed it, in spite of my small complaints (btw, another one was the totally meaningless recap about where everyone’s at, by Harmony in the beginning).
I’m wondering about one thing though: Hamilton has some supernatural strength (and gee, Baldwin can project force), whereas I thought Eve was only human. ut then she said that the SP created her, which makes me think the was some kind of supernatural entity too, but was downgraded to mere human? Or am I just too tired?
And as a bonus - I give you Angels and Spike muppets. The page loads very slowly, but it’s well worth the wait.
Bless you Gaspode for the bonus! You so just made my afternoon!!
What struck me most about Gunn staying behind in “Hell”, was the part about wearing the medallion that made him forget everything that came before. I think Gunn’s staying behind was meant to be ambiguous: did he really think he deserved to be tortured over and over again for eternity (or at least until the Senior Partners let him go), or was he attracted to the idea of forgetting everything he did? Maybe he thought knowing that he caused Fred to be utterly destroyed body & soul was too painful, and he opted for the lesser torment?
I thought of another thing that bothers me, in hindsight - What was the point of the shootout? Apart from cool pics in slomo of furniture being destroyed?
I mean, if this is a totally rigged hell dimension, where every house contains a convict and the automations that are part of the charade, it’s not like Angel, Spike & Gunn could have entered without the SP (or their caretakers) knowing. And since they couldn’t leave unless they left without Lindsey, or as it turned out Gunn, was there really a point to the shootout?
I doubt the SP can, or would, monitor the hell all the time. As such if some punk sorcerer or the like broke in they would get gunned down if they tried to release someone. I don’t think they were shooting at Lindsey - just the individuals who removed the amulet, that was the function of the shooting.
While Angel and the crew could violate the laws of the hell they brought no mojo with them. None. They were thus victim to the rules of the hell. If you got mojo you can bend the rules. Like leaving an effigy of the person wearing the amulet to fool open the gate, stuff like that.
Yeah, but Angel is the head of a major branch of W&H. Apparently, there are circumstances in which he would be expected to visit that particular hell dimension. That’s why the Senior Partners gave him that Camero, right? That hell is reserved for people the Senior Partners are angry with, but who are too valuable to kill out of hand or to lock up in a really nasty drives-you-insane-from-torment type of hell. There’s probably some sort of protocol or magic code word or something that can temporarily restore the prisoner’s memory so they can be pumped for information, or even released if the SP ever decide they’ve been punished enough. Tearing off that amulet apparently isn’t part of the protocol, so the dimension went into “defence mode,” of which (I imagine) the uzi-wielding neighbors were only the first part.
And it looks like that was a real neighborhood they found, and hired a couple of dozen extras for the business in the background. I wonder if the residents were happy that their block was chosen for a national television show, then surprised when they tuned in and found that the show was using their eye-bruisingly homogenous neighborhood as a representation of Hell?
AND A BRIEFCASE!!!
I can’t believe they’re cancelling this show 
I was amused that Spike was so into his new freelance role and the meeting that he brought beer.
I doubt this is the last we see of Gunn. I agree that the attonement aspect (and the forgetting aspect) were key to Gunn. Otherwise they could have grabbed any number of evil types from their office or client files and taken them along. Gunn’s uber knowledge will be needed sooner or later.
Smurfy-Fred and Mopey Wes are getting really old, really fast- I hope they do something with this very soon. Actually, the whole Fred dying/Wes moping thing was a blunder IMHO.
Oh well, next week the fun should begin.
Only 3 or so major Firefly cast members left to fit in before the finale.
Did anybodye else notice the theme on “Layers”. I liked that. I don’t know what it means, but I like it. 
“… and you’re already two soldiers down.”
Two? With Fred, Gunn and Cordy, that’s at least three since they came to W&H. Four if you go all the way back to Doyle.
I don’t think they could have just grabbed any “evil types” to take along to the hell dimension – After all it is not like they would have come along willingly. And from a purely practical standpoint, anyone evil enough to deserve getting tortured would also be dangerous enough to put the mission in risk.
Oh man, the best part of the episode was when the suit-guy was walking through the lobby and they were like “how tough can he be?” and then he punches right through that guard and they all scream. So funny I almost soiled myself. It was kinda serious up until that point and that was so great by contrast!
Unforutnetly, my nitpick detector was on over-drive, because I was bothered for the rest of the episode that his hand and shirt cuff weren’t covered in blood.
Mebbe he licked it off or something.
Between the armament and equipment available through Wolfram and Hart, and the combat abilities of Angel, Spike, and Gunn, whether the substitute is willing is irelevant.
Being evil does not automatically mean that somebody has power. The mobster from the talking stick episode(Please validate me by remembering the episode.) had no mystical power. The coach who gave mutagenic steroids to the swim team had no mystical power.
The talking stick that made everyone weepy, right? I remember that one.
Even someone without mystical power can fuck up a mission in a strange, unfamiliar dimension. Doesn’t take a magic spell to shove Lindsey in front of a machine gun and destroy the reason for undertaking the mission in the first place.
Am I the only one who’s seen no real setup for the big show they are promising at the end?
We’ve seen little of any plan of the senior partners to start any THE apocolypse. What are they distracting Angel FROM? What’s been going on the world that they’ve been missing? They seem to save just as many people this season as they have in previous seasons, and nothing else seems doing other than the usual monster of the week.
And we still don’t know what Lindsay’s plan with Spike was supposed to accomplish: why is picking this or that vampire champion important?
Picking Spike is setting up a fail safe, or out right replacement, because Angel is currently helping the senior partners.
On the purely practical level the information gathering system in place to find people to help is no longer delivered by a higher authority, but found using an organization designed for evil. In addition Angel and company are helping this corporation and its clients, they are saving people but at the same time helping those who cause people to need saving.
On a symbolic level the champions have given up. The side of good has no representation now. Establishing Spike as Angel’s replacement provides a champion. It also gives a vampire with the soul to both sides. If only Angel is involved then he is the one who is going to be a major player, and right now he is playing for the senior partners. Destiny is stupid and easily tricked with appropriately symbolic mojo. At least Lindsey seems to be working on this principle.
I think that the Apocalypse that the Senior Partners want is more a revelation and less a destruction. Earth is a hell, it was a hell, it is a place that is only sort of crawling away from evil. I think the goal of Wolfram&Hart is to keep earth from breaking too far away from its roots, and to show people in a convincing way that it is indeed hell. They want to drag the world back down and make everyone know that the world is back to the way it should be. Angel, when he’s being heroic, often talks about how the world is not a good place but champions need to act like it is to make it better. There is definitely the sense in the show that good is at the disadvantage, that it is the atypical and invading force.
Oh and the reason there isn’t build up yet is that evidently this episode was shot before the cancellation announcement.
Lindsay
I thought Lindsay’s plan was to make Spike into a champion in order to steal Angel’s destiny. Once Spike becomes the subject of the sanshu and other prophecies, Angel isn’t important. The senior partners would no longer protect or even care about Angel. Then, Lindsay could take his vengance on Angel without the senior partners interfering or retaliating.
Izzybella
Thank you! That obssessive level of detail is exactly what I was looking for.