Solid, Anthracite. Unassailable point.
I think you’re missing the point, Anthracite, did you actually click on any of the pictures of her? Conventionally, she’s quite attractive, although personally not my type (As others have pointed out, she could really stand to eat a few cheeseburgers). However, this is not the context. Her hate-filled diatribes make her ugly. It’s the Shallow Hal concept, where her inner beauty, or lack of it, is apparent to many who see her. Beauty isn’t just appearence.
I think from comments like the ones Una posted, it is clear they aren’t talking about Ann’s inner beauty.
Anthracite, I can’t speak to other people’s posts, but I will defend mine (the OP). In case you didn’t read the whole thing, here it is:
It’s certainly not a compliment to Coulter, and wasn’t meant to be, but it’s not an attack on her looks either. I started this thread because I couldn’t for the life of me figure out why Ann Coulter seems so popular (bestselling book, speaking at major conservative gatherings, etc.). As I said in my post, I could only think it had to do with the outrageous statements she made and with her being a pundit with a pretty face. However, this alone didn’t seem to warrant her celebrity. I do think she is attractive, and said as much. Should she be the GOP’s sweetheart just because she’s cute and says crazy things? That’s what I don’t get. This is not tantamount to calling her ugly, and I take great exception to your comparing me to racists, anti-Semites and homophobes. It seems that you did not read my post fully, but raced throught this thread looking for instances of apparent discrimination to add to your rant. I hope this is the case. If not, I urge you to explain how what I said makes me a bigot; it would be a useful thing to know.
I’ll defend my comment about her insectoid appearance. Several people had posted that they find Ann Coulter attractive, I honestly can not comprehend that. I wouldn’t comment about her appearance if others didn’t bring it up first, and the point I was attempting to make is that she is so evil that she could never be attractive.
To put it in Beavis and Butt-head terms, at the risk of incurring Godwin’s wrath: “If Hitler was a hot chick, would you do him?”
Another point about Ann Coulter’s looks, as well as the looks of Laura Ingraham and the other Scaife-funded “independent women” is that the looks are an important part of the package that is being sold. She was chosen and marketed based on her looks, and she flaunts them in her tv appearances. I think that that makes her looks a legitimate target in a way that Karen Hughes’, for instance, are not (and I know that a number of people have mocked KH’s looks- I think they are wrong to do so).
JDM
A clarification about my “badger with hooters” remark. That was in response to another poster saying that Coulter “is hot (in an untameable kind of way.)” I was replying to the untameable part, by mentioning what was the meanest animal I could think of, not discussing her looks.
You know, there was one part at which I was perhaps not fair. And since I want to achieve my goal of offending everyone on the SDMB equally…
A large number of people commented how they found her attractive, hot, sexy, etc.
I didn’t single those people out because they were positive remarks. And thus not intended to tear her down.
However, they also aren’t really fair to characterizing who Ms. Coulter is and what the value of her opinions and viewpoints is. There is also the implication (see dantheman’s post) that she uses her more attractive looks to push her agenda. Well, if that’s so, I certainly cannot and will not defend that. In fact, there is a certain irony involved in my defending her, if it is true.
The reason I posted is…it’s different for us ugly people, guys. When you know you are ugly, and you see people on the SDMB tear someone down, and then throw on snipes or swipes at someones appearance, well, it might be the closest thing that I personally (a white chick) would feel akin to racism. No, it’s not the same, and not as severe, certainly. But it gives me a feeling once again of “Everything I say, I do, all my contributions, all my hard work - it won’t matter in life. Because people will go off of what they see, and not what I am.”
So it disappoints me to see things like this here, a place which is a better place by far than society in general. Because there is a such a large concentration of intelligent, open-minded, and friendly people here.
It’s like finding the proverbial Baby Ruth floating in the swimming pool.
I will respond to one post before I head to the hospital for my brand spanking new brown recluse bite (don’t ask).
dantheman, it’s not an offense, but I wonder why we will not allow someone to call another Member a racial slur, but will allow them to denigrate a person based on their personal appearance. And as for celebrities…well, try starting a thread using racial slurs against Colin Powell and see how fast it is closed.
Racism is multi-faceted, true. The racist does not solely hate the way someone looks, they also hate and fear them and their culture, and the imagined threat that they are to them. One facet of it is judging the person’s appearance. Because that’s what you see in the public eye.
Your comment on Ms. Coulter regarding her using her sexuality as a “prop” is a valid one, and not a hateful one. There is a difference saying she is “bad looking” and complaining about her unfair use of her appearance. And as I say above - if she really does that, then there is an irony in my defense of her.
I did click on a picture of her now, because I was asked to. I didn’t bother before because - well, because I don’t see how it matters what she looks like.
stofsky, I understand now, thank you. Now all I can think of is her fighting off a grizzly bear.
peasea - if you had put it that way to begin with, I wouldn’t have had anything to say about your post. As you explain it, I understand and I withdraw my indignation towards you. However, the initial brevity of your mark lended it towards being interpreted - wrongly - in the manner that I did. So if what you say now is what you meant then, I apologize.
Antracite – bullshit. Ann probably spends two hours making herself presentable for the cameras; her opinions are dreck, and most of her fame comes from her body and her willingless to flaunt it. Would she be as popular if she dressed like, say, Janet Reno?
Coulter is a xenophobic racist scumbag that hopefully one day will be forced to eat humble pie very publically indeed.
Sorry to hear about the brown recluse bite.
If one were to begin a thread about Colin Powell and ask - as this one did - what his appeal is, there would be no problem. If people further said, well I find him hot - no, I think his nose is too big - then it would still be fine. Now, I know what you’re saying - that a thread like that would degenerate quickly into a racist thread. That’s not what’s happening here. In fact, it would never happen with Colin Powell, because he’s much more universally liked and respected than Coulter.
It’s frowned upon when someone attacks another Member. Ann Coulter is not a member (as far as we know). More importantly, she’s a celebrity who, as I said, uses her looks to get her places. This is indefensible, no matter what. If she were a porn star, we wouldn’t be having this discussion. The fact is, she uses her looks to promote her own hatred. That’s uttery despicable, and I can’t blame people for pointing out that she (in their opinion) isn’t all that good looking to begin with. In other words, she brings her criticism upon herself in her words and actions.
That’s not all that you see, though. You see them inside and out. They’re laid bare for everyone to see. Inner and outer beauty are both in the eye of the beholder. Some people think her views are quite lovely. Some people think her looks are excellent. But there are many others who think her views are ugly and that she’s not all that attractive. This is not simple needless slamming; this is an honest opinion (although certainly some comments are a lot harsher and needless than others).
I’m ugly and proud of it. Fat too. 240 pounds of me to go around. But then, I’m a real person, not some gooey celebrity who doesn’t work for a living.
It being said that I’m fat, ugly, balding and aging, I really do feel for my fellow members who are not yet at that point of middle age (as I am) where hearing someone say it to your face in mockery really says far more about them then it does about me. I’m not going to change, and I like what God gave me. I do understand the painfulness of being a youth and hearing these things and feeling badly whether they were said about me directly or just about other people and feeling I didn’t make the grade.
It may sound trite, but you choose how to feel about yourself. Don’t let anyone else substitute that for you.
Beauty is skin deep, ugly goes all the way to the bone, but neither has any relation to your worth as a human being.
Una, FWIW, if I hurt your feelings, I’m sorry.
However-and I hope this doesn’t come off like I’m weaseling-Ann Coulter tries to sell her looks. Every time a thread about her comes up, some half wit always has to add-“Yeah, she’s a bitch, but I’d do her!”
I don’t think she’s ugly, but I DO think she’s too skinny-and from what I’ve read, she eats very little, smokes like a chimney and comes off as nasty, bitter and hateful (in person). My comment about her smoker’s breath-well, if she smokes, she probably has terrible breath. She also is about as friendly as a rattlesnake with hemorhoids.
Una, also check the link in an earlier post that leads to, IIRC, a file called silver dress.jpg. It shows her in a sexy pose, the kind of thing you might see in Entertainment Weekly, People, or Cosmo. Then check the site that picture (and the photo gallery it belongs to) comes from.
Ms. Coulter is certainly not above using her looks, to the point of providing conservative cheesecake for the loonies to masturbate to while thinking of converting all non-Christians at gunpoint.
In fact, I think it’s reprehensible that if (and this is a big IF) her views are, in her opinion, correct and well-thought and the way things ought to be, she uses her bod and blonde to sell them rather than the merits of said ideas.
From what I’ve read on the board, you are a highly respected person in your field on the basis of your abilities. Since I have not seen you, I can make no judgements on your attractiveness. But I get the idea that you have earned that respect on your professional merits and abilities. Could Coulter do the same? Do you think that if she were “Ann Coulter, Elephant Woman” she’d be on the talk shows? And would she put a photo gallery on her website?
Rambling, I know, but I’m strung out on Benadryl. Regular formula makes you sleep; Non-Drowsy keeps you from falling asleep but you’re just as stoned.
It’s OK Guin. And everyone else.
Let me lay out my feelings bare for you, and you can see why I posted.
I am ugly. I have been ugly all my life. I did, like stofsky said, work hard to get where I am. I even chose a profession known for its geekiness - in part, because I felt a closer kinship to those who were “unpopular” - that is, those interested in the sciences.
But for all I do and all I’ve accomplished, I am still sensitive to being criticized about my body. I hate my body. My body is disgusting and loathsome to me, and each morning I wake up with it is a morning of pain.
I’ve self-mutilated out of hatred of my appearance - and worse. Much worse.
The SDMB, and web boards, are perfect for me because no one sees me. No one looks at me, grimaces or smirks, turns and suppresses a laugh, and dismisses me out of hand, because I’m an ugly little freak.
And when I read people picking on someone on here due to their appearance - or at least seeming very much so - it hits me hard.
If an SDMB’er had been the target, I would have gone postal.
The fact that Ms. Coulter is a celebrity (for better or for worse) means that I was not nearly as outraged or shocked. Celebrities, be they liberal or conservative, are used to detractors.
But I was disappointed. Because inside, I think “Why must they make comments on her looks? Do not her opinions and writings, or her failures, give enough ammunition to those who want to flame her?”
And then I think of my accomplishments, and my many failures. And how poorly I would measure up overall, if my appearance and my body were part of the judgement.
On reflection, I imagine that maybe I am still just smarting over the road-rage attack on me on July 4, where the primary epithet hurled at me by the two men that attacked me was “fucking ugly”. And then I spent the whole Holiday inside, alone, drinking, as a result, because they got away with it. And they went on their way and likely laughed for the whole weekend about how they intimidated the ugly little freak.
I know a lot of people on this Board - who I love, respect, are friends with - who would never win a beauty contest. One might think for a minute how some of them must feel too. It just seems that the point one tries to make is lost, or at least lessened, by the comments on appearance. I don’t know; it just seems that way.
I still think that some of the comments here were wrong, but I do not feel now that I should have raised a fuss over them. This is the Pit, after all, and people are here to blow off steam. And people say a lot of things they don’t really mean, or say them with a little too much “oomph”, IMO, whilst blowing off said steam. I do that too.
I am sorry, once again, to have raised a fuss.
Anthracite, you’ve probably been online long enough to know that everything you wrote in that last post is true for many, many people; many people on this board, in fact. Many people in this thread, even.
Whether we admit to it or not, there are plenty of people who are eloquent and well-read but also self-loathing. I’ve been online for a great many years, and time and time again I have found people who are escaping from something in their own lives, whether it’s a physical pain or just a latent unwillingness to face themselves in a forum other than online.
I’m a little surprised that you still feel the way that you do about yourself, but that is probably because I do not know you, and I will definitely not pretend I understand how you feel or how you think. That would be terribly presumptuous and pretentious of me. I can only add that I’ve witnessed people who have appeared self-loathing in their own way and who have (as it appears you have) poured themselves into their online interests. Many of them have found self-gratification and even a good burst of self-esteem in those pursuits. I had always assumed you did, too, because my impression has always been that you are extremely intelligent and very well spoken.
All of which might not mean a damn thing, but as far as I am concerned, this is the one place in the entire universe where your looks and how you perceive them don’t matter one whit. Not one. If you expressed ugly opinions, then you’d be perceived as ugly. You don’t.
I agree, some of the comments in this thread were wrong, even if they were expressed sort of off the cuff. The point is that most people really detest Ann Coulter, but they do so because of her opinions and attitude, not because of their opinion of her looks. The fact that some people think that she’s not terribly attractive is almost irrelevant.
Upon looking over this post, I guess it might have been better to simply emailed this to you. I respect you deeply, and I did want to say these things to you. I apologize if you would have been more comfortable receiving it in email.
Ann Coulter communicates with me via the occasional threads that are posted here in the SDMB BBQ Pit. We write about her, I proposition her, and she tacitly agrees to meet me by not responding. But I don’t show up to our arranged meetings, because I enjoy tormenting her quivering sense of self.
Yes, I’ve read The Rules. It’s Tuesday (in California), and I’m calling in the date. How about Saturday? Wait…
Oh, I’m sorry, Ann. Saturday is off the books for me. I’m helping a friend move.
Sunday? OK. I’ll be at the Spy Museum, at closing, eight o’clock.
Don’t bother to respond. Just wait for me in the rat-infested alley behind Ford’s Theater, just like the saddled horse that was waiting for Booth.
I’ll take you for a ride you’ll never forget.
Thanks for the serious Heebie-jeebies, Sofa King.
I just saw her on The Daily Show. Jon Stewart’s non-partisanness prevented her from going on the attack against him, and she mostly looked like an idiot. The audience booed her when she said there were no good Democrats, she contradicted herself by saying the Dems were too critical and then that they weren’t criticizing the president, and Stewart mocked her lack of tolerance for those dissenting from the president.
As for her physical appearance, it was bizarre. It was almost like she was paralyzed from the neck down. When she laughed her head would shake, and her torso a little, but her hands and legs were in the same exact position the whole show. Also, she seemed skinnier than normal. I hope she’s not anorexic. She also has a really long neck, it’s a good thing she has that long hair.
Anthracite: I’m not sure if our criticism of her looks is as bad as those in the “Celebrities most people think are hot but you don’t” threads. Apparently she’s a freeper wet dream and we’re going to disagree with them. When you’re a celebrity and you use your looks (partially) to market yourself, which Ann does, you do open yourself up to criticism a bit.