If I thought you were capable of having a rational discussion I’d be glad to discuss it. You’ve shown me you’re not. Here again you drawn completely false conclusions about me and resort to name calling.
Please point out to me where I called myself a christian.
from some of your other posts I’ve read I gather you’re more capable of a rational discussion than** Mockingbird**
I must be unaware because I have no idea what the KArl Rove reference is refering to.
You know what.
You call me names and draw completely false conclusions about me based on a few words and your own prejudice.
This is a prime example of what I’m talking about. You are doing exactly the thing you critisize and despise in others and you are totally oblivious of it.
You think you’re standing up for truth and justice by jumping all over someone you don’t know who doesn’t parrot your self righteous venom. What an incredible hypocrite.
I’m sure cricetus still doesn’t agree with me and thats fine. I’m not fool enough to think I’m always right about certain issues or how I express myself. At least he was enough of a person to apologize for attacking me. You just continue on with your assumptions and insults.
Until you figure out how to have a rational discussion without being profane and insulting at the drop of a hat I have no reason to engage you.
I see what you mean by self-contradicting - I don’t believe it actually is, though. When I say something is objectively, empirically “bad”, it doesn’t matter who is doing it or defending it - it simply is bad, regardless of circumstances or individuals. That’s why I also said that very few things fit this category. I wouldn’t even say homophobia is one of them. There are hypothetical situations where a person would be justified in not liking homosexuals - they’re extreme, unlikely cirumstances, but they could exist.
That still doesn’t make homophobia good, though - just possibly justified, and I don’t believe your friends would have a good reason to justify their homophobia if it is simply based on the Bible telling them it’s icky.
cosmosdan, you’re wasting your time with Mockingbird. Don’t sweat him. His screen name is entirely apt: he makes a lot of noise that sounds like human speech, but there’s no actual content to any of it. He’s long since used up any credibility he had on the boards.
Thanks Miller I got that feeling myself. btw I appreciated our exchange.
I enjoy SDMB because it makes me think and input from good people like yourself educates me as well.
You disgust me.
You are pure vermin who is willing to sell someone out to make yourself look better.
That you, Otto, and a few others have the nerve to pull this to make yourselves seem more palatable is contemptible.
My points are valid, and you undermine them by your pretentious superiority, which would work better if you were actually superior.
See what I mean, cosmosdan? Apparently, you’re a “fucking liar” and a Rovian agent of the “Christian Right” because you support gay rights across the board, but refuse to shout curses at people who disagree with you. I’m a sell-out and “pure vermin”, because I’m willing to shout curses at the people who disagree with you, but I’m not willing to shout curses at you. And Otto is “contemptible,” because he’s willing to shout curses at you, but apparently he doesn’t get spittle-flecked enough when he does it. I mean, how can you argue with a guy this irrational and narrow-minded? Why would you even want to?
Oh, well. I guess we need extremists to remind us where the middle is.
Cosmodan, I don’t know if you’ve been aware of me long enough to be aware of this, but when I was a teenager, my best friend was tormented to the point where she had a nervous breakdown by “confused angry teenager[s]” who were only trying to fit in. After she had her nervous breakdown, I was next on their list. One of the reasons my friend was tormented was because she had handicaps; two of the reasons I was tormented were because I was her best friend and because I was an immigrant. The experience fueled my lifelong distaste for bigotry in all forms. I would condemn both equally. I grew up in a small town in southwest Pennsylvania and returned there as an adult. I’ve seen prejudice in both adults and teenagers and I’ve seen indications of good hearts even in those who are prejudiced. What I find objectionable is that goodness tends to stop at those who are like them or who can convince these people that they’re like them.
As a part of my, personal Christian faith, even as a teenager, I refused to meet evil with evil, even though it was tempting at times and I certainly had my share of fantasies. I was also aware that Christ said something about turning the other cheek and shaking the dust from one’s feet and moving on. If a person makes a bigoted response in my presence, I will say something, unless it would be completely inappropriate. E.g., when having dinner with my parents and certain old friends of theirs, I don’t bring up religion because one of them is a very conservative Christian who believes Harry Potter is evil. Bringing up the subject would do nothing but cause hurt and ruin dinner. I won’t associate closely with such people, though and, if they try to persuade me of the Rightness of their views, I will respectfully disagree.
I understand the forces which make one a bigot; I’ve experienced them myself. I just don’t believe in yielding to them or condoning them, even by silence. You see, I didn’t know about the people who silently thought my best friend was being mistreated; I only knew there was almost no one to speak for either of us, so I vowed to speak for others. By the way, here’s one reason I would never choose to do business with that company and why I cannot believe that homosexuals are somehow more sinful than the rest of us humans. You see, twenty years after I couldn’t walk down a hallway without being insulted, I was talking with an old friend of mine, one of the few people who would speak up for me, one of the few people who would befriend me. He told me something he seemed to think would damage our friendship (a ridiculous thought). He told me he was gay.
Respectfully,
CJ
I with ya there. I cannot understand how anyone justifies their treatment of others with some quotes out of Leviticous. It doesn’t make sense even by there own logic or beliefs.
I have a dear old friend who has a sister who is a lesbian. She still loves her sister and they spend time together whenever possible. My friend is a loving person who would extend a helping hand to anyone, but she believes homosexuality is a sin is against gay marriage. We’ve had a couple of talks about it. When I ask her to explain how homosexual marriage will corrupt the morals of this country she can’t really explain. It’s because the bible says it’s wrong and all her conservative friends think so too. I trust the kindness in her and I feel that she and those like her need to be plainly shown the hurt being done. I believe they can be swayed because they are basicly good people. Maybe I’m naive. There are others who seem filled with hatred while they speak of God’s love. I don’t have much patience with them. Once civil rights are secured time and reality will shut them up.
Siege
I appreciated your story. I hope you understand that I’m not excuseing horrible behavior or minimizing the hurt that it causes. I believe we do need to take a stand. Whats the old saying? “All that is required for evil to win is for good men to do nothing.”
The Quakers have a belief that there is nothing any other person can do to diminish the dignity of another person. Each person can only do that by their own action and whats in their heart.
Because of this belief when someone harms them they pray for that person for they believe that individual has only damaged themselves.
I’m not so idealistic to think that many people can live by this understanding. I know I certainly haven’t been completely successful but I think there is truth in it and it’s something to strive for.
The Bible says a lot of things, a whole bunch of them contradictory. I personally believe it is better to think about things and draw your own conclusions than just swallow someone else’s belief system whole. Keep asking questions of her - her brain will have no choice but to think about these things then, and she might start thinking on her own some day.