Anyone ever taken anger management? Does it work?

In My Humble Opinion
1

The title pretty much says it all. I’m interested to find out if anger management classes work. Not for me, but I was considering recommending anger management to my husband.

I really hesitated posting this - I know that some people on the boards tend to react with, “Call the police - immediately!” “Divorce him now!” and other such comments. But I really do feel like I need second opinions. Here’s what happened:

Over the past few months - mostly since the baby was born - he’s been getting really irritated with our four-year old. He has an incredibly short fuse with him and I’m tired of feeling like I have to defend my kid to his own father. I think some of it is cultural (some of his irritation arises from academics, which aren’t really stressed in the U.S. until kindergarten - also, my son uses that issue as a hot button, pretending not to know the alphabet with his dad but recognizing every single letter when he and I are alone), but most of it might be a result of my husband’s own experience. His father smacked him around a LOT if he didn’t resond immediately to a directive. Any sort of defiance resulted in a beating.

Last night was kind of the last straw for me. We were all in the kitchen. I was cooking dinner, my husband was washing dishes, the baby was playing on the floor and my son was playing at the doorway with a body ball (one of those really large balls you use for crunches). It was pretty idyllic - everyone was happy, joking and laughing and talking about their day. My son started trying to push the ball into the kitchen and my husband told him to keep it out and away from the baby, for obvious reasons. The thing is bigger than she is.

Anyway, long story short, he ignored my husband, bounced it through the kitchen, it hit the baby, she fell over and started crying (she was fine, by the way). I scooped her up and she calmed down, but my husband began screaming, grabbed the ball and shoved it at our son, demanding he get it out now. When my son didn’t respond, my husband shoved the ball at him pretty hard, knocking him over. He terrified our son so much he started screaming almost involuntarily. My husband started walking toward him like he was going to haul him to his feet and start yelling again, but I stepped in between the two and told him to calm down and let me handle it. I handed my husband the baby (who promptly began screaming again - the noise was probably scary and I was the only person not yelling), picked up our still-screaming son and headed to his room where he continued crying and letting out these terrified little screams for a few minutes until he was able to talk again. It was a pretty fucking awful experience.

I have nothing against a thought-out tap on the butt after everyone’s calm, but it seemed like everyone lost their damned mind at the same time. They’ve since reconciled and my husband agreed that his behavior was inexcusable and apologized to our son (reinforcing the idea that he needed to listen afterward), but seeing him lose it like that was terrifying. I know that he was afraid for the baby, but I still don’t think that excuses him losing control like that. I told a friend of mine about it and she suggested that perhaps my husband should consider anger management.

So, like I said, has anyone tried or know someone else who has tried anger management? Was it successful? Also, am I making too much of this? I really don’t think I am, but I’m not exactly an objective observer. Have you ever done something like this or been involved in a similar situation?

Before you respond, please consider the following:

  1. This is the very first time something like this has happened.

  2. I don’t think this necessitates calling the police or moving out. Obviously, if my husband harmed one of our children or if I felt such harm was imminent, I would get them out of harm’s way. However, I don’t think that’s necessary now. I’m trying to prevent it from happening in the future.

  3. Please don’t pit my husband. I’m looking for constructive feedback, not, “God, what an asshole! You should get a divorce immediately.” I’m not backing what he did at all, but, like I said, I want to help him manage his anger, not dump him like a hot potato.

2

Well I’ve been in the same place as your husband so I know how he feels. I have taken an anger management course, just a few months ago. In some ways it has helped, in others I still find myself getting upset easily.

That said, if he wants to take a course, he’s going to want to take it for himself. In the class I was in a lot of people didn’t seem to want to be there, and I had people say to me, I’m only here to pass the class. If he’s in the DC area I know of a class, the one I took.

You might suggest to him to take a lot of deep breaths, not when he’s angry, but just when there’s quiet time. Breath in, hold it, then breath out. Do it 10 times or so. I tried to do this, it does help somewhat, but then I forget as time goes on. My friend who suggested the class to me says it helps him.

3

That’s a realy good suggestion about the breathing. We both agreed to talk about it a little more tonight, so I might just suggest that he take the time to do that daily. Even if he only does it when he’s starting to get ticked off or goes out to take a walk around the block or something, that’d be better than last night.

Oh, and I wouldn’t force him into anger management - I’m just trying to think of ways that this could not happen again. It was frightening for everyone involved. Thanks for your response.

4

Walking out for a quick walk around the block is a pretty good and often-overlooked coping mechanism. The key is to COME BACK, obviously, and to come back a little winded and tired, and having mentally done all the yelling and hollering and swearing you want, so you’re done taking shit out on others around you.

Maybe - just maybe, I don’t know - your husband needs education about child development even more than he needs anger management training? Realistic expectations for a 4-year-old might be a little … different from what he *thinks *he can expect. I can’t recommend any books or sites, but maybe someone else can. But I do think that at age four, “academics” shouldn’t really be an issue yet. He’s still learning in an organic way: picking up new words, and, ahem, noticing the actions and behaviors of those around him.

5

I don’t know, as I’ve never taken such a class. But I’ve done a lot of self-work over the past couple of decades, and I almost never get angry anymore. I’m not sure I could tell you specifically how I got to that, though. Growing older probably accounts for a lot of it. Massively raising my self-esteem has helped a lot, I’m sure.

I’m wondering if an anger management class is the only route for your husband to take. Since he was raised in the kind of environment that he’s now creating, going deeper into his psyche might be of benefit.

I’ll second the breathing suggestion. I’ll also suggest that he learn to “cultivate the pause” between stimulus and reaction. That is, son acts up, husband has to wait X number of seconds before he reacts. That way he’s acting out of thought instead of emotion.

6

I’ve been in the same place as your husband–I have, in the past, been known to react to relatively innocuous misdeeds with what my wife refers to as “dinosaur roaring”. Although I’ve yet to commit physical violence on animate objects because of it, I’ve punched a few holes in walls while bellowing.

I suggest a combination of anger management therapy and meditation (an hour a day or every other day) with a coach if possible, as that’s what worked for me.

When you say

I hope you mean he was frightened too–that’s often how I felt, and I think it’s one of the easy ways to distinguish someone truly able to be helped by basic therapy and techniques vs. someone with a real problem.

7

We’ve gone back and forth about this, too. I’ll ask him to read something for him on child development, he’ll agree, I’ll provide him with the literature, then he’ll read it…or not, then still blow up. Or we’ll sit down and talk with the pediatrician or parent educator together, and it still happens. We’re probably at the point where he agrees to read things just to get me off his back, but they don’t mean much to him.

He’ll have these moments when he’ll say to me, “You know what? I want a good relationship with my son. Can you help?” And I do try, and I work very, very hard to be completely neutral. Grrrr… This situation is so frustrating.

Thanks for all the comments so far. And I really appreciate the non-judgy nature of everyone’s suggestions.

8

Anger management classes can work if a person desires to manage his anger. In order for him to make use of the techniques he needs to be able to comprehend the perceived reward that his inappropriate expression of anger provides him and be willing to relenquish it.

That is the student’s responsibility. The rest of the equation depends upon having an instructor who is able to facilitate that understanding and willingness and to provide effective methods of resolution of personal anger.

The desired results of a partner requesting this interaction are not always what is accomplished in the hoped-for transformation.

9

You might also talk to your husband to see if it’s something else that he’s dwelling on and getting upset about and the kid(s) (or whatever precipitates the reaction) really have nothing to do with it. I know that’s happened to me in the past. You mentioned the stress he’s under. That might be what he needs to focus on first, ways to work through or better handle the anxiety that’s causing.

10

I’m not in any way qualified to give advice, but it sounds more like he needs therapy, not anger management; he’s repeating a childhood abuse pattern, not having a general lack of emotional control, at least that’s what it sounds like.

shrug

11

I had a longer post typed up, but I think instead I’ll just ask: you seem to be aware that your son is deliberately ignoring or needling your husband. Are you working on correcting that issue as well? Your husband blowing his lid off is certainly inexcusable, but what I’m seeing is that it’s a symptom of a deeper problem, and treating just the symptom is only a temporary solution.

12

Bosstone, that’s a good point, but in the long run the kid is just reacting to his father’s parenting style.

I’ve seen it before. A kid about the same age was a perfect angel in almost every situation. He turned into a hellion when his father was around. I think it was because the father didn’t set very strong boundaries.

13

Possible, and I have very little experience with 4 year olds, so I can’t even begin to say what expected behavior should be. I only bring it up because the temperament described sounds an awful lot like my own. My easiest rage button to push is being deliberately ignored by someone I’m ostensibly in charge of, especially when they have the capacity to know better, and it sounds like that’s what’s happening here.

Again, it’s completely inexcusable and it is entirely the guy’s responsibility to master it. But if that’s the same kind of rage button overly’s husband has, fixing the disconnect that’s causing the anger (as well as the anger itself) will go so, so much farther toward a peaceful, stable household than just trying to get the guy to not let the trigger affect him.

14

This is a good way to put it, though in this case, I think it’s because my husband is too strict and doesn’t know how to pick his battles. In other words, he’s not lenient in the least.

We try really hard for consistency. There are clear boundaries at home, and those boundaries and our rules are enforced religiously. However, our style is vastly different. For example, if I say, “Hey, overlyson, come over here. I need to talk to you,” if he doesn’t respond, I’ll say it again. If he doesn’t respond the third time, I’ll touch him on the shoulder, he’ll come over, I’ll say my piece and we move on.

When my husband is in the same situation, if there isn’t immediate compliance on the first request, he will pick him up bodily, telling him very sternly, “I’m talking to you. Your job is to listen to me when I’m speaking to you.” Then he’ll go into a discussion about why our son should respond to the first request, advise him to listen, then will say his piece. But by the time he’s said what he wanted to say originally, that idea is diluted by the lecture on why he should respond to his dad the first time.

This is something we’ve never agreed on. I don’t say anything in front of our son because I also don’t want to undermine my husband, but he knows that I don’t agree that this is effective.

And I know I’m hardly a perfect parent, but it’s so frustrating to see what used to be a wonderful, loving relationship deteriorating over something that seems so fixable to me (note, emphasis on seems - I get that this is probably more complicated for my husband than I realize).

15

I used to run family violence behavioural change groups for men (not saying women cant be violent too, thats just where I worked to hopefully head off that potential hijack). Much of the work I did was with men where physical violence was comparatively rare or sometimes even absent, but there was yelling, slamming doors, standing over people etc, and that and the amount of work going into ‘not making him angry’ was what was making the relationship a dealbreaker.

I would say ideally you are not the person who would be doing the research here, the job starts with him. Its normal to be nervous if not terrified to talk about this stuff, but it helps to take ownership.

Programs can be effective if the person sticks with them, but the dropout rate can be very high. You have to be sure the person is sincerely using the program, if you hear ‘you need to stay with me until the program is finished’ or the like, they arent.

The problem will be what programs are available in your area, if its one where most people are court mandated and serious offenders, it may do more harm than good, as they can come away with a ‘well Im not like THEM’ experience.

Otara

16

Penn and Teller say it’s bullshit, so I say it’s bullshit:

17

The Stosny HEALS method of anger management supposedly works better than more mainstream methods.

Basically it is a process of finding out what your core hurts are (the claim is that intense anger is a mix of powerlessness & deep seated hurts) and then doing a few hundred exercises where you attempt to train your unconscious brain to respond to them with compassion rather than powerlessness and pain.

http://compassionpower.com/reviews.php#NEW APPROACH TO DOMESTIC VIOLENCE CHALLENGES STEREOTYPES - AND FINDS REMARKABLE SUCCESS

And they don’t. Follow-up research on more than 260 graduates found that a year later 87% were violence free (defined as pushing, grabbing, or shoving) and 72% were even free of verbal aggression - of hurting their feelings. This based on interviews with the previous victims.

In 1995 Stosny conducted one-year follow-up research on 285 abusers who had undergone court-mandated treatments, comparing his graduates with those treated with a protocol derived from the power-centered model. After a year, 86 percent of his clients had not engaged in any violent episodes of pushing, grabbing or shoving, compared with 41 percent in the agency programs. Maryland’s Department of Motor Vehicles also sampled 312 Stosny clients, comparing their driving records against a random sample of Maryland drivers. Two-thirds of Stosny’s clients had aggressive driving records before taking his workshop. A year after treatment, 7 percent of the same group had traffic violations—three times better than those in the standard driver-improvement classes.

Another good book is ‘breaking the cycle of abuse’ by Engel.

Your husband sounds like he may just be repeating what was done to him.

18

I’ve done this as well. I actually broke a bathroom door and this is what caused my wife to leave me a few months ago.

This too. I’ll also bet he feels like a horse’s ass too. I had the fun job of fixing the door I broke, and every damn day I get to see it too. There are times when I’d like to kick my own ass.

I can also say there are probably lots of things going on with him. You now have two kids, and that’s damn hard as you know. I think his work is hard but he doesn’t want to show it. He knows you have a hard time of things and probably doesn’t want to complain. His job probably sucks, I know mine did, the kids don’t seem to respond to him as well as they do to you, which really sucks sometimes, and he probably gets little to no attention from you. This isn’t an excuse, it just seems like everything sucks all at once then you start getting mad over something stupid and it all comes crashing down. I should know as I lost my family over it.

19

My sympathy is with your son. Your husband sounds like my father and I grew up afraid of him at first and hating his guts later. I wasn’t free of that man until he died. You might try telling your husband that your son might be trying to get his attention and doesn’t know any other way to do it. Even a raging tantrum might be better than indifference, if indifference is all your son gets. If your husband was abused as a child, that carries over; he might think that is how a child should be raised. Try to convince him it is not. In my case, I vowed early on that I would be as different from my father as I could manage. It worked for me.

20

I think what he’s doing is frightening to him, and he’s definitely disappointed in himself.

Edward The Head, I’m sorry your wife is no longer with you. And I appreciate your story - I know my husband feels stupid - after all, he’s pitted himself against a four year old. I never thought of everything else, though. The way my mind works, I think, “Shit, I work full time, just like he does, I do most of the cooking and cleaning and I’m draped in children most of the time I’m home and still waking up with the baby at least once a night and somehow I keep it together. What the hell is wrong with him?”

Of course, I’ve never said anything like that, and have tried very hard not to let that exasperation get through, but I’m sure it has at some point, somehow. Also, when I think of the kids, I love them dearly, but sometimes I’d give my right arm for some peace. As I type this, it’s the first time in almost two weeks I’ve had five minutes to myself. (ETA: as soon as I typed that, my five minutes was up.) So it’s hard for me to imagine wanting more attention. But thinking about it, it would definitely suck if my baby screamed every time I tried to hold her or my four year old cringed away from me or promptly began pushing my buttons every time I tried to interact with him.

As for the job stress - well, he and his buddies just started a new company, which is already very successful. I don’t think he dislikes his job, but he is overwhelmed and having to spend more time than usual away from home, which does affect the amount of time we can spend together.