One of two people will be president. Biden has been pressuring Bibi, abstaining from some UN votes, etc. Trump recognized Jerusalem as the capital of Israel.
The choice is clear – if you have any sympathy for the Palestinians at all, vote Biden. If you side with liberal Israelis that think that Bibi may be going too far, vote Biden. (If you like American democracy, vote Biden).
Biden is a good option for pro-Palestine voters. He’s a far better option than Trump, and he’s the only other option. Pro-Palestine voters should do whatever they can to get Biden elected, because Trump would be a nightmare for Palestine, whereas Biden is doing what he can within the realistic limits of US politics.
Protest votes during the primary are fine, but when it comes to the general election, pro-Palestine voters should be first in line, canvassing, doing whatever they can to get out the Biden vote.
Trump will be worse for the Palestinians and a lot worse for the US which will in turn be a lot worse for the Ukraine and The World.
So no, not voting for Biden unless their in a blue state is not good pressure. It is bordering on insane. Protests and pressuring congressmen and Biden are the much sounder “good” option.
Protest Votes are more effective and less lazy than protest Facebook Profile Picture Changes, but only barely. They are among the laziest and least effective ways to protest something.
The good option for pro-Palestine voters is to engage in their activism outside the ballot box, where it might make a difference. Call and write to your representative, show up at their town halls, donate to aid organizations, join your local party and work on changing the platform. Do the very difficult, long-term, boring, and deeply unsexy work of organizing.
Then, one day a year, cast a ballot that’s a chess move, that puts the person in power who’s likeliest to be closest to what you want, even if they’re a long way away from it. Cast that ballot, and go back to organizing.
I think that many people believe that living in a Democracy means that in any given they will be able to vote for a candidate that shares their beliefs, and that if they are unable to do so then the Democracy is broken. That is fundamentally flawed reasoning.
Under the current system* any division away from the consensus candidate only increases the probability of the election of a office holder that opposes your beliefs. So this results inevitably in a choice between two final consensus candidates. Given the myriad possible stances on multiple issues it is impossible that all of them can be represented by those two. So there will be some issues that are left out. If one of those happens to be an issue that you feel strongly about, that sucks, not everyone’s team makes it to the Superbowl. Pick yourself up, dust your self off and try to form enough popular momentum in favor of your cause to either influence the current office holder, or to replace him with someone who matches your views better the next time around. But at this point a protest vote is basically just throwing away what power you have left.
*I’m all for ranked choice voting but we aren’t there yet. Nor are we likely to get there any time soon.
At heart, this basically seems like the old question, “are third party voters responsible for Bush/Trump?” At the least, they seem to feed into much the same issues.
Relitigating this issue in this thread is a hijack to the question posed by the OP. Continue your discussion about the particulars of how the war is going if you wish, but not in this thread. This thread is for the narrow discussion about how best to use your vote if you are pro-Palestine and not pleased with how you perceive President Biden is handling the situation on behalf of the USA.
If you don’t have a strategic answer for the OP, this is not your thread to post in. Thanks.
This is a formal warning for disregarding moderator instructions. Your answer is a non-answer and offers nothing in the way of a suggestion for how to vote strategically for the OP.
You are also banned from further posting in this thread as you appear to have no constructive advice to offer in it.
Right- you have two choices- Biden, who has been a good but flawed human as president, or trump- who will end American democracy as we know it.
So- Biden is trying to do the best he can within the limits of his office to end the disaster in Gaza. Honestly- it isnt much, but again-within the limits of his office.
trump would ignore all the limits of his office to help Netanyahu make things worse in Gaza.
The division is pretty clear and so is the choice. If you dont like what Netanyahu is doing in Gaza vote for Biden. If you think Netanyahu hasnt gone far enough- vote trump.
But dont be that silliest and most stupid style of voter- the single issue voter. The pro-gun voter who sees Biden passing bipartisan legislation to keep guns out of the hands of criminals- and decides that means “BIDEN IS COMING FOR MY GUNS!”- even though trump has done nothing for you- they are idiots. Pretty much- any single issue voter is. They have decided to not strain their limited brainpower to look at all the issues- or at least a handful of big issues- and have let one single brain cell control their vote.
I mean, to be fair, being concerned about genocide is slightly different than being concerned about a nonexistent gun confiscation conspiracy theory. At least to me. That added weight is not nothing.
Do you want a -10 president, or a -10,000,000 president? Or do you want to throw your vote away entirely on someone with no chance over a single issue?
I believe Israel’s government is actively engaging in war crimes and in genocide, and that Biden has been far too supportive of their government during this process, and hasn’t pushed nearly hard enough for Israel to recognize the human rights of Gaza residents.
So I’d offer other pro-Palestine voters a magic wand: wave the wand, and you can replace Biden with Trump. Not in the past–Biden’s done what he’s done–but going forward. Will you wave the wand, in order to improve the lot of Palestinians?
I don’t have another wand, that erases what Biden’s done. I don’t have a wand that allows me to put Cornell West in office. I don’t have a wand that ends the war. The only wand I have is the one that puts Trump in the White House, as a solution to the humanitarian crisis.
If you are a pro-Palestine voter who would wave the wand, I don’t even know what’s going on with you.
And that’s what the vote is. It’s not a chance to end the war–that’ll have to happen through other means. It’s not a chance to get aid to Gazans–that’ll have to happen through other means. It’s not a chance to prosecute Netanyahu for genocide, or to enact a two-state (or one state) solution, or to free Palestine from the river to the sea, or to punish Biden, or to to anything else. Anything else will have to happen through other means.
You get the one wand, and you can wave it or not. You wave it by not voting for Biden.
So: no. There are no good choices on election day. But there sure is a shittier choice.
I thought I read that the US is putting a floating aid station off the coast of Gaza. Is that something that pro-Palestinian voters think that a Trump administration would do?
No, there are no good choices for pro-Palestinian voters in the upcoming US presidential election. If that’s their only real issue, i expect they will stay home. Or vote a random write-in, it a third party with no chance of winning, but that won’t make them feel dirty to vote for.
If they live in a swing state and have other issues, they will likely vote based on the other issues. But they’ll have to hold their nose.
This is basically false. Biden is and will be much better for Palestinians than Trump will be, actually putting some pressure on Israel to hold back. One of Biden or Trump will be president, and a pro-Palestinian voter who doesn’t vote is doing their cause a disservice.
I can’t believe I’m defending the Israeli government her, but…
One of the SPECIFIC war crimes they are accused of is bombing hospitals. I put the blame for that DIRECTLY on Hamas. Hamas has major tunnel entrances in the hospitals; this is where a number of the hostages were being kept. How else are they supposed to clear those tunnels? At least this is a squishy ethical area.
Hamas are a bunch of cowards. They hide behind the innocent population, then whine when innocents become collateral damage. The &%$@ing leader isn’t even in the country, letting his minions die in his place. Yes, I understand that Israel has been (trying to) slowly suffocate the Palestinians, but there are no excuses for the atrocities committed in October.
And I firmly believe that people calling this “anti-semitic” and “call for genocide” are exaggerating a bit, especially when chanted by suburban American college students. It’s a catchy slogan that can be chanted, but how many people (outside of the ethnic groups directly involved) know what river is being referenced? I’m willing to bet most of those protesting college students don’t. Or, even if they do know it’s the Jordan River, how much of Israel exists “from the river to the sea”.
Quite frankly, I think Joe Biden is doing a commendable job steering through this quagmire.
How long will it take? How will they ensure that building supplies and food get there safely? How will we pay for it? Who will provide security? What if they’re attacked?
I think it’s a solid hypothetical idea, just wildly impractical. And unless more trucks are allowed through with aid, I don’t know a better one.