My granny had eight. Her mother had thirteen. They were probably hoping one or two would fall into the quarry.
Yeah, I think it’s already been said, but we do a very strange job in our current society of simultaneously infantilizing our children and throwing them to the wolves, maturationally speaking. We over-control the areas that perhaps might be better with freedom, and under-control the areas that could use a little more guidance.
I drive to work along several bus routes. The private school elementary school kids are leaving - as are the middle school kids and a few of the high school students as I head in (the public school elementary school kids leave later than I leave - but I work from home one day a week and my own kids catch the bus that day).
It always amazes me how many parents I see out at the bus stop. The little kids, sure - though I only did if for Kindergarten myself. But lots of parents are out at the middle school stop - and occasionally the high school stop. I wonder if the kids are such skip risks that Mom needs to make sure they get on the bus or if watching your fourteen year old get on the bus is the extreme end of helicopter parenting.
Kids (and families) today vary a great deal, and I suspect this was always the case: I know older teens better (as I teach Juniors and Seniors) but I know kids who seems to do nothing and be totally catered to, but I also know many kids who have 60-70 scheduled hours a week either between work and school or just in school (get to school at seven for tutoring, don’t leave until after practice gets out at 5, 2-3 hours of homework a night and a game or some sort of activity each Saturday). Some —quite a few–of the kids that work full time do so to help pay basic family bills, rent and food and clothes not just for themselves but for parents and siblings. The kids that put that kind of time into school are under intense pressure to graduate in the top 10 and go to a fabulous school. Other kids are responsible almost entirely for raising younger siblings–not just babysitting a few hours a day after school, but more or less everything–dressing ,bathing ,feeding, homework. And there are a few kids that are basically keeping irresponsible parents functioning, which is always a weird, twisted co-dependent relationship.
So there are lots and lots of kids with huge responsibilites.
I think you need to start out by defining what your definition of infantilizing is, then decide whether or not it’s going on with most kids in the age group you’re talking about. Is it a lack of freedom, or contribution to the house and family, or something else?
There’s a trend, here on the SDMB, and elsewhere that involves looking at one aspect of a situation, and filling in the other details based soley on the little information you have. For example, Joe’s dad drives him to school. Is he driving him because he’s afraid he’ll be kidnapped or because he works long hours and he’d like to get a little extra time in with his son? Who knows, but some people will decide that it’s the former, and that Joe probably spends his whole day playing videogames under 24 hour supervision. Then, it’s used as another data point about lazy, spoiled kids.
Or, to go back to the other thread, my sister is apparently being infantilized. On the other hand, what about the numerous extra household responsibilities she’s taken on since our mother became severely disabled? The OP mentions baby-sitting as an example. There are fourteen year olds who do that now, and there are others who weren’t allowed to in the past. There were and are kids who had jobs outside the home, but no household chores. Were these kids infantilized? Does the answer depend on whether you meet the kid at home, or at the after-school job? Of course, this *is * IMHO, not the ground-work for a scientific study, but I don’t see how anyone can reach a conclusion based on what little we’re working with here.
Perhaps it is a situation of over and under control, like **WhyNot ** said. To get it out of the way, I understand that this isn’t meant to be about my situation, but everyone else is sharing anecdotes, so I’m chiming in with mine.
To make my point more clear- this is one of these cases where you can “spin” things to find what you want to find, unless you start with a clear hypothesis, and start gathering real data. Or, basically what **RickJay ** said.
Another anecdote: I’m probably in the beginning of the generation that made people start worrying about helicopter parenting. At 14, I was routinely responsible for my 1 year old brother while my parents were out and about. There wasn’t anything in the house that was off limits–and I routinely did things like work in the kitchen and take out the trash while supervising him, safely. (But weren’t we all shining examples of the perfect teenager?) I think a big part of it is the parents’ confidence in the teenager, which bolsters their own confidence. The thing is, teenagers aren’t really quite fully formed people yet, and while they may be perfectly responsible in some areas, they’re total freaking idiots in others. Parents and other close adults know this, and know their kids’ limits, much better than any outside observer can. I think this can account for most of these complaints.
I took out the trash and did chores when asked, was available for babysitting at a moment’s notice (this took priority over entertainment, but not other obligations), and kept my room in a reasonable state, sometimes. Of course, my parents subscribed to the idea that “school is your job,” and I was expected to do well. I was also in tons of after school activities and kept up my grades. Also, I was responsible for coordinating my entire college search on my own. Finding scholarships, choosing and applying, coordinating due dates, preparing for essays and interviews–all that on top of schoolwork and extra curriculars–by high school, my parents weren’t nagging me about homework due dates and projects and if I messed up, that was my problem. (I’m sure if I was flunking, all this would have been a different story.) I think things like this should be taken into account when discussing the responsibility level of teenagers. Maybe there’s bit a shift in the areas teenagers are considered responsible for, rather than the overall responsibility level?
All that said, I think my parents sheltered me a bit (I’m 24) compared to my peers at the time, and I think they’re doing it with my little brother. When I got out on my own, I think I had more growing up to deal with regarding shyness, personal upkeep (chores, bills), and dealing with a crisis on my own. Based on watching friends and family growing up and raising their children, I think this is because of my parents’ personalities, and not an overall trend, though.
But how much is the 20-25 still living at home a product of overextended school loans that need to be repaid? I know when I graduated college at 22 I couldn’t have moved out if I wanted to between all my debt, my lack of a full-time job and the fact that my car was a 10 year old clunker that was ready to die at any minute. And all of my friends fell into this category too, so it was hard to gather any support for “let’s rent a place together!” But after 8 months I got on my feet and I’ve been independent ever since.
The 30-35 year olds still living at home are not part of this generation and it’s wrong to include their laziness (or fear) in this discussion.
I work in an education center where one of the courses offered is a babysitting class open to kids 11 and up. It’s about a 6 hour class and covers stuff like first aid and I don’t know what else, but it takes all day.
Next year they’re going to raise the course fee but provide lunch. Why? One of the instructors told me it was too much hassle escorting the kids to the cafeteria to get lunch, so the teachers didn’t have time to eat their own lunch.
So I asked, “If these kids are too young to walk down a flight of stairs and along a hall, and order their own lunch, aren’t they too young to be babysitting?”
Blank stare in response.
Although I liked not having any cares at the time, I wish I would have had more responsibility as a child, and not been He Who Can Do No Wrong.
(I know you’re all shocked that I was raised that way. 
)
HA! Yeah, I know exactly what you mean.
On the other hand, it’s a well known fact that the IQ of people under 23 drops 5 points for every additional member of their cohort standing within a 10 foot radius. 10 points for members of the opposite gender. Really, it’s amazing that a whole classroom of them remembers to breathe on a semi-regular basis.
My friends are all in their 40s and we all graduated around 1988 - which wasn’t a great year for jobs. I was the exception - I got out of school and into a full time job. Most of them had part time jobs for two or three years while they found themselves. And student loans (many of my friends went to one of the most expensive schools in the Midwest - on loans). And none of them moved home with Mom and Dad.
They lived in rathole apartments with roommates on bus lines and didn’t own cars. They worked the morning shift at a coffee shop to pay rent and the evening telemarketing shift to pay loans. Ate ramen and the cheap mac-n-cheese.
One BIG difference is many of my friends didn’t have a “home” to move back to…several of them had parents who moved and didn’t have a bedroom for them.
What young adults face today isn’t any different than the people ten years older than them. And I know OF people who moved back with Mom and Dad.
I didn’t say anything about young adults having it different or harder than young adults twenty years ago. I merely stated that the very idea of college graduates moving back in with mom and dad for a year or two is not the end of the world and is not “infantilizing” them.
I think it’s a good thing that most people don’t have to look forward to a life of shithole apartments as a reward for graduating college.
I imagine in a few years “When I graduated college I lived in a shithole apartment with 8 other people and ate nothing but ramen for one meal a day yada yada yada” will become the new “I walked 15 miles to school uphill both ways.” While it might be true for some people, the majority telling the story will just be saying it to make their life sound tougher.
Those aren’t young teenagers, and as somebody who lived at home until 25 and knew others who did the same, it has more to do with the cost of living and cost and availability of housing. If you want to connect that to “infantalization,” I’d like to hear the reasoning.
That is really well put.
Dange - my wife and teen daughter went out to run some errands yesterday p.m. They passed a grade school right as it was letting out. It was in the mid-30s and drizzling. Not nice weather but by no means horrendous for Chicago winter. Both commented that they did not see a single kid walking away from the school. As my kid said, “I remember you making us walk to school in a couple of blizzards!” Yeah - and wasn’t it uphill both ways?
*(I remember a twinge of guilt - just a twinge - when we had our kids walk to school one snowy morning, only to arrive and find school had been cancelled. Oops! Builds character, don’t it?) *
My mother is the quintessential helicopter parent. When I was in 12th grade, the school bus came around at 5:40 in the morning. Since she wouldn’t let me get a car, I had to take the bus. But instead of letting me walk less than two blocks to wait five minutes for the bus with a couple of other kids, she *drove me to the bus stop * and waited until I got on the bus. Oh yes. And why did she do this? Because if she didn’t make sure I was on the bus, I’d get raped. Really. I was not allowed to walk two blocks in the semi-darkness at the age of 16/17. And *then * she complained about always having to wake up so early. :dubious: Hey mom, how about you *let me go by myself * then? It wasn’t like we lived in a bad place, either. It was a safe and sleepy little culdesac, where the worst thing that could feasibly happen at any given time is the old lady across the way having to put her 15-year-old dog to sleep.
If that’s not coddling/infantalizing, I don’t know what is. I’m in college now, and she makes darn sure to take care of all my affairs for me. :rolleyes: Including making absolutely sure that I get enough money to pay for my books and supplies. Don’t get me wrong, I appreciate her concern. Some people would kill to have a mother like her. But don’t you think it’s time to let me take care of things myself just a little?
One more thing. The other day I wanted to go to Wal-Mart to get popsicles (everyone wanted some but no one felt like going). It’s a seven-minute walk, tops. I’d be back in 20 minutes total. But no, I can’t do that. Why? You guessed it. I’ll get raped. Granted, our new neighborhood isn’t as safe as our old one, but seriously. I am an adult, though she doesn’t seem to realize it. What’s going to happen when no one’s around to drive me to class or go shopping or pick out my classes?
Sorry for the rant, felt like getting this off my chest.
I was previously of the understanding that “Teenager” meant “Between the ages of 13 and 19.”
I don’t understand this strain of posts at all; the OP was most clearly about “parents these days…”
I have been appalled at how much the young people in my families have been coddled and restricted; most of them, like Stauderhorse would love to walk to school barefoot in a blizzard up hill both ways. They would think it an adventure.
What about Hallowe’en, the Children’s Night of Anarchy?
They were all escorted by parents this year! Even the young woman trick-or-treating with her child had a parent waiting at the foot of the stairs. [Dindale’s “weird dynamic”].
Well, almost all. Two girl in their mid-teens, when asked if there was a parent with them (parents get candy, too, at my house), told me not to worry, they had cell phones.
Whiskey-tango-foxtrot, one worries about what teen-agers will do, not about them on Hallowe’en!
So, I think the OP (with which I agree) was more “Some people’s parents …” than “Some people children …”