Arrest made in JonBenet Ramsey case

[Martin_Hyde]

@Rick

Can any parent here tell me with a straight face that if your 6 year old was killed you would wait 4 months before you sat down with the cops?

I’m not a parent, but I do not think if I felt the police were inappropriately looking at me as a supect in the murder of my child I would throw caution to the wind and allow myself to be railroaded into a conviction. This kind of stuff happens all the time. Completely innocent people can be made to look stupid, incompetent, and guilty when on the receiving end of a skilled interrogator.

It is mostly a moot point, however. Because the Ramseys sat down with the police THREE TIMES in the days following JonBenet’s murder.

JonBenet was murdered sometime in the early morning hours of December 25, 1996.

On December 26th the Ramseys met with the police and were interviewed by the police.

On December 27th the Ramseys again met with the police and were interviewed by the police. On the 27th they gave various things to law enforcement, handwriting samples, DNA evidence, blood, hair, fingerprints and etc.

On December 29th the Ramseys had a memorial service for her at a local church. On December 30th they flew to Atlanta with JonBenet’s body to have her buried. They returned to Boulder again after New Years to assist the police with their investigation. I understand that their daughter had been murdered, however, a death in the family is a death in the family. You want to give a loved one a proper funeral and burial. That takes time, effort, planning and etc to get all the details worked out. I don’t think anyone can fault them for not being extremely involved in the case from December 28th-January 2nd or so. After all, the Ramseys had already given two interviews to police and additional personal evidence, the police had access to the Ramsey home (where the Ramseys were no longer living as it had become a highly publicized crime scene.)

Somewhere in between their first interviews and their return to Boulder, the Ramseys hired criminal lawyers. This is not surprising. At this stage, the police had already made it clear who the primary suspects were, and the media had already started to crucify them.

The police began to demand more interviews, however, at this point the Ramseys realized the police no longer had any interest in looking for the real killers, and were fixated on convicted them. Under those conditions, I would not cooperate with the police anymore than legally required. It’d be a terrible situation, knowing that your daughters killer was going to evade justice because the police were no longer going to accept that anyone other than you were responsible. And cooperating with the police would only serve to make it more likely you get strung up.

After time, the Ramseys did eventually agree to additional interviews, supervised legally, to attempt to get the police off of them and on to the real culprits, it never worked.

[Zabali_Clawbane]

Here’s a thought. The person who is giving details of Karr’s confession has admitted that he was not present for the confession. Maybe this person, (a Thai official) who has no real knowledge of the case, is making stuff up in order to get camera time? He is pretending to be “in the know” when really, he isn’t? I have not seen any video of Karr saying “I used chloroform on her” or words to that effect. Has anyone else seen such footage, or do all we have is a second hand source? I believe I will wait until Karr is in the United States, and a more official report on what he did, or did not confess is given.

[Harborwolf]

@Zabali_Clawbane

Here’s a thought. The person who is giving details of Karr’s confession has admitted that he was not present for the confession. Maybe this person, (a Thai official) who has no real knowledge of the case, is making stuff up in order to get camera time? He is pretending to be “in the know” when really, he isn’t? I have not seen any video of Karr saying “I used chloroform on her” or words to that effect. Has anyone else seen such footage, or do all we have is a second hand source? I believe I will wait until Karr is in the United States, and a more official report on what he did, or did not confess is given.

At this point, that’s just as possible as Karr being a crime junkie and confessing to get himself some camera time.

You have to remember that Karrs ex is saying right now that Karr may not have even been in Colorado at the time. That’s not some thai official seeking face time.

[Zabali_Clawbane]

@Harborwolf

At this point, that’s just as possible as Karr being a crime junkie and confessing to get himself some camera time.

You have to remember that Karrs ex is saying right now that Karr may not have even been in Colorado at the time. That’s not some thai official seeking face time.

Read all of my posts in this thread.

[duffer]

@Harborwolf

At this point, that’s just as possible as Karr being a crime junkie and confessing to get himself some camera time.

Just to restate, this is what I was trying to imply in a previous post in this thread. I added in the angle of trying to avoid charges in Thailand as speculation.

I heard the guy’s AP interview, and it still seems fishy. Then I saw video of him answering questions and it still doesn’t quite add up. He’s clearly not a loon, which in itself would make him even scarier. he looks like the guy next door. Paging Mssrs Dahmer and Gacy.

It’s been 10 years, I’ll wait a bit longer to learn the truth. But the guy being a glory-hound is a thought I can’t easily dismiss.

[Fat_Chance]

@Harborwolf

Here’s a link to the current crop of doubts about the confession. Whether or not he drugged her is only part of the problem. The confessed sexual assault may not have taken place and the suspect also claimed that he picked her up from school which wouldn’t have been possible as Jon Benet was on christmas break at the time. Also, Karr may have been in Alabama when the crime was committed.

He didn’t really say he picked her up from school “that day” and took her home. He could have done that another day, thus giving him a chance to learn the home and how to get in/out.

[Fat_Chance]

@spoke-

As for the alleged drugging:

It would not be unusual for authorities to withhold details of the crime from the public so as to weed out false confessors. That way, if a confessor knows something about the crime that the general public does not, the police know they have their man. Wasn’t there an early report that the guy who has confessed knew details about the crime which have not been publicly revealed?

I think we have to assume that the confession is truthful until we know something more.

Read the autopsy report - no drugs in system. The police are not hiding that at all.

@Martin Hyde

Then murdered with a garrote, the cord of the garrote and the duct tape used to bind her were never found…

Again, read the autopsy report - the ME describes finding and cutting the cord from her neck, so it most definately was found.

Not to be a big jerk here, but with first source documents like the autopsy report available, lets try to not spread incorrect info just cause you read it on some blog somewhere.

[Diogenes_the_Cynic]

@Fat Chance

Read the autopsy report - no drugs in system. The police are not hiding that at all.

Do we know for a fact that chloroform would turn up in an autopsy?

Again, read the autopsy report - the ME describes finding and cutting the cord from her neck, so it most definately was found.

It’s the longer cord and the duct tape from from which those items were cut that were not found in the house.

Not to be a big jerk here, but with first source documents like the autopsy report available, lets try to not spread incorrect info just cause you read it on some blog somewhere.

Again, do we know for a fact that chloroform would necessarily be discovered by autopsy?

[rock_party]

Does anyone know who actually found her body in the basement? Was correct procedure followed in the initial handling of her body or was it contaminated by someone and if so by whom?

[Diogenes_the_Cynic]

@rock party

Does anyone know who actually found her body in the basement? Was correct procedure followed in the initial handling of her body or was it contaminated by someone and if so by whom?

Her father found the body. From what I remember he did pick her up to examine her. I don’t know exactly how much evidence was disturbed. I do know that if I saw my own six year old daughter lying on the floor with a cord around her neck (and I do have a six year old daughter) there’s no way I would be able to avoid the same impulse to try to pick her up and revive her.

[Zabali_Clawbane]

rock party, read the coverage here at The Crime Library to answer your question.

[Fat_Chance]

@Diogenes the Cynic

Do we know for a fact that chloroform would turn up in an autopsy?

It’s the longer cord and the duct tape from from which those items were cut that were not found in the house.

Again, do we know for a fact that chloroform would necessarily be discovered by autopsy?

Read more carefully please:

1. The quote that I responded to was suggesting that the police were hiding info about drugging from the public. I was pointing out the autopsy report indicates they did not. The original quote and my response was not talking about cholorform that would not be detected

2. Again, the quote I responded to said that the actual garrote was not found, when in fact the autopsy report indicates it was. The original quote and my response was not talking about the rest of the rope

[Fat_Chance]

Diogenes,

Just a note after reading your reply to me, and some of your other posts in this thread.

You may have some real good points and some great arguments for all I know, but I think you need to step back and take a deep breath, and stop resonding to everyone and everything as if is a personal attack on you or your side. Your response to me was one big giant strawman.

[rock_party]

Wow. John Ramsey found the body during a second search of the house. He contaminated the body, potentially ruining the evidence.

[Guinastasia]

@Martin Hyde

Finally, the fact that a garrote was used in my opinion has cleared the son from day one. A child his age simply would not know how to create or use a garrote, at least in my opinion.

I thought the son under suspicion was JonBenet’s half-brother, her father’s older son from his first marriage? He was in his late teens, early twenties, IIRC. Not that I’m saying he did it, mind you.

[duffer]

@Diogenes the Cynic

Do we know for a fact that chloroform would turn up in an autopsy?

I’m sure you’re the first person to think of that. Of all the people that have dedicated themselves to forensics, they should herald you as the one that clued them into this. Maybe now they’ll start looking at whether or not chloroform can be detected in a corpse.

For all the talk of the media leading us to thinking the family had something to do with her death, we seem to be getting to the same point of convicting based on what the media is reporting about Karr.

For all the talk of those that mistrust the MSM, I’m vexed on finding a better example than this case. It’s a decade later and here we go again. Months of rehashing what happened, months of whether or not Karr is guilty, months of why he did it, months of why he didn’t do it, months of why the parents did it, months of why the brother did it, months of why the Kennedy’s did it, months of why Halliburton did it, months of why those damn meddling kids in the magical Mystery Wagon did it.

Then when we get a verdict, months of why he was convicted, months of why he wasn’t convicted, why he should have/shouldn’t have been convicted.

And Og help us if he’s convicted and gets a life sentence. What would be the opening over/under line of the number of follow-up stories about him, just to see how he’s doing?

Anyway, bit of a tangent there. But if he actually did have sex with her, I’d like just 2 minutes alone with him. I think 90 seconds would be enough time to clean off the blood from myself.

[Diogenes_the_Cynic]

@duffer

I’m sure you’re the first person to think of that. Of all the people that have dedicated themselves to forensics, they should herald you as the one that clued them into this. Maybe now they’ll start looking at whether or not chloroform can be detected in a corpse.

I don’t know what any of this is supposed to mean. I’ve asked in a couple of different threads if chloroform can be detected by an autopsy because I don’t know. All I was doing was seeking information.

What is the “MSM?”

[Starving_Artist]

Mainstream media, you tyro!

[Diogenes_the_Cynic]

“Tyro?”
Is that good or bad? Do I want to know?

[tomndebb]

tyro