Ask the child of money

Actually, I have some horrible nanny stories of theft and other oddness. My first nanny cared for me (and my younger brother, the youngest wasn’t born yet) from the time I was six weeks old till I was 6 1/2. She was an angel, I love her like a grandmother (she was 60 when she began caring for me). She was in and out of the hospital for a 12, maybe 18 months after that, until she fully retired. In the interim periods when my original nanny was in the hospital or recovering, I had a nanny who, months into caring for us, didn’t bathe me every day (it took my mom two weeks to notice, since little kids don’t sweat much), stole her credit card and slowly began charging her small items (like a few groceries) for a few months, exploding with her charging several thousands of dollars in random home good (bed sheets, towels, random decorations) that she strategically washed and put in our home, and justified to my mother as “gifts she couldn’t use”. Another interim one hit my brother repeatedly for having a potty training accident. Really insane.

I thought about the dating thing in high school last night, not responding till I’d thought it through. My initial reaction was no, I didn’t notice any oddness or discomfort in the two boyfriends I’d had (there was a third, but he lasted all of 6 weeks, so there’s not much worth mentioning). My first boyfriend, we’ll call him Sam, I dated from the fall of my sophomore year to the fall of my junior year. Sam was a freshman, newly transplanted to our town, going to a different high school. We met on the same sports club team. His father was the police chief, ex Navy SEAL, and his family had college degrees. His mother was a wonderful woman, someone I still talk to if I run into her while in my hometown. She is an optician or an optometrist, I’m not sure which. Money never come up with the two of us; we went to movies and largely hung out in our group of friends. He treated on my birthday or a holiday, we split the rest of the time (IIRC). We broke up after the novelty wore off, no hard feelings whatsoever. We remain good friends to this day - catch up on facebook, text each other on our birthdays. When we see each other in our hometown, we hug.

Boyfriend 2 was just a 6 or 8 week relationship. Nothing worth mentioning, at least on the money front. On the crazy and psychological issue front, there’s tons to tell.

Boyfriend 3 I dated from the beginning of senior year through the middle of my junior year of college, so 3 1/2 years. We thought we would get married eventually. He was a year ahead of me. He graduated first in his class, and “pinned” me into NHS. We’ll call him Ted. We were a dream match by the measures of our teachers and friends - both smart, both funny, both active in extracurriculars and the like. People sometimes joked they’d love to see how our kids turned out - not creepy, just good natured ribbing. His parents were both high school teachers, but both came from families that were working class (think postal workers and secretaries, etc). While Ted and I individually didn’t have many differences with money, in a larger group setting we did. I drove a brand new BMW my senior year of high school, so anytime there was a gathering of his family, I’d get teased about it when I drove up. IIRC, nothing was ever ill willed, it was always good natured. Especially after they got to know me, they made comments like “you’re two nerds in a pod”. They also ribbed me about being biracial. His extended family was certainly rough around the edges, but there was a lotta love - they were an escape from the pressure cooker of my parents’ home. Towards the end of our relationship however, there was tension because while in our little hometown there wasn’t much worth spending money on, I wanted to go to the theater and out to eat frequently when we were in college. Mind you, I didn’t want to go to steakhouses, but I did want to go to the nearby thai or indian joint a few times a week. His idea of entertainment was the half price menu after 11pm. This put strain on us because he wasn’t willing to plan other “cheap dates” - so money was a small factor in the bigger scheme. After a period of 6 or so months where we didn’t speak after breaking up, we began talking again. My goals expanded as I continued through college; I realized I wanted the lifestyle my parents have, complete with three homes and frequently eating out and lots socked in the bank. He’s going for his PHD in a hard science, and while he’ll do great things, had we gone on in our relationship money certainly would have been a touchy subject. Politically we’re now on opposite sides of the spectrum, but while dating we close to being on the same page.

The good friends I had in high school had one common theme, and that was that they came from families that valued education and were educated themselves. My two closest friends in my graduating class had parents who were professors and engineers, that sort of thing. Friends on my sports teams had parents that were attorneys or professors or software engineers. Since most were dual income and the area’s super affordable, that made them easily upper middle class. I remember once going to a friend’s house that I’d never been to (we always spent time at mine or working on after school activities) and being utterly horrified at their clutter - I think they were between Stage 1 and 2 hoarders. That’s the only time I’ve felt totally out of place and worlds apart, but that had nothing to do with money, as they were professors.

My younger brother is a freshman in college, and dated extensively throughout middle school and high school. I vividly recall a few instances of him bringing a new girl to my parents’ house and her getting bug eyed at the size of the house, the cars in the driveway, and the size of the kitchen. My mom angrily recalls some of the girls’ parents commenting on how “nice” it would be if the kids “stayed together and had kids” - when they were all of 16. Often the girls were gold diggers or their parents were. Some of the girls would drop brazen hints of wanting to visit our lake home. They expected to be financially taken care of - one girl picked out a bunch of clothes at a store at the mall, had them rung up at the register, and turned to my brother to pay for them. WTF? This made me incredibly uncomfortable, and I worried the girls would poke holes in condoms, crap like that. Some were certainly crazy enough to do things like that. My brother’s changed a bit in the past year, and he he’s now dating a girl who comes from working class family, but she’s studying to (eventually) get her masters in nursing, and my parents just love her. Looking back, their resentment (and mine) was geared moreso to the girls’ aspirations and their attitude (that they wanted to “marry” into money) rather than have a career of their own.

Hmm, interesting question. I did a little digging, and confirmed that my scholarship was from a pool that is strictly for academic scholarships. It’s not like I was taking $ away from need-based ones. If I were offered the opportunity to give my scholarship to someone need-based, I would have had to run it by my parents first, but otherwise I personally would have done so. But that wasn’t the case, and I certainly wouldn’t have given up the scholarship just to have it go to another academic scholar. I was near the top of the smartest kids at USC (assuming academic scholarships go to the brightest, of course, there were those who had full tuition scholarships ahead of me).

I see you’re still struggling with your English, China Guy. You should really spend more time on Rosetta Stone and less on the 'dope. Here’s what I said many posts ago in post #61:

So I would have been a manual laborer. If you want to know where I’d be if I were middle class, you’ll have to define the parameters first.

I hope this thread isn’t totally dead. I’ve found the thread interesting, but I was hoping to perhaps share why some people seem a bit bristly towards you or what you’ve said about taxes, libertarian leanings, etc. This is at least what I’ve noticed, anyway.

From you:

Here’s the part that I want to know:

Are you aware that, by luck of the draw, you were born into multiple safety nets? Your parents are very hardworking, they are very skilled and intelligent, they have prestigious jobs, they make a lot of money, and they have business and social connections. All of these give you advantages that most people never can have. You know that, obviously (as you’ve said in this thread), but why are these not safety nets to you? Yes, you are intelligent and hard-working. But I know of many people who are just as intelligent and hard-working as you but are stuck in retail or service industries.

If someone else doesn’t have those above safety nets, what is wrong with the other safety nets they may have to use? Why is it okay for you to use your safety nets (your parents’ money for the apartment or to go to dental school; your family friend who would sell you his practice) but other safety nets that others would need to use are bad?

Now, I’m not saying that everyone needs safety nets or that it’s impossible to be successful without them. But you have yours that you have put to good use; why can’t others do the same with the ones available to them?

Of course it’s not dead—As long as people keep telling her she really IS from a background of fabulous, unimaginable, Midas-like wealth (instead of a middle to upper middle class family like millions of others in this country) so she can somehow keep believing it herself, this thread will keep going strong.

What color have they chosen for the Bentley (or Porsche)?

How is the $500,000 “mansion” holding up?

If you’re so rich, why don’t you get a new computer?

If you read this in 10 years, Lindsay, it’s going to be painful. The naivety is deafening. I haven’t ready every post, but the one where you mention that someone has been planning to sell you a business since before you went to dental school… ouch. There are so many, many things I can see going wrong with that that you don’t appear to know or have simply dismissed.

It hurts to read this thread. Aside from the whole coming-from-money part, I can hear my own youthful arrogance echoing in my head. Ouch. Ouch. Ouch.

My parents were refugees. Let me repeat that so that it sinks in for you they were fucking refugees. It wears on me when people say “your parents had so many advantages, so you do too.” Yeah, I do. And I’ve said as much, over and over. But it’s not like it’s been like this for generations and generations. I live with the scars, the way they raised me in several ways too. My mom darns Hanes socks; she, in my mind, wastes loads of her time doing menial things that people on this board who are middle class don’t do. And in a lot of ways, I look at the world, fear, and react the same. They both went hungry at times; my dad basically lived in a war zone. Both had food give to their families by outside sources. So clearly, I wouldn’t be alive today without safety nets. But they made it, by chance, by luck, whatever. The cream will always rise. It’s always better to be lucky than good; I almost was hit by a 10 pound icicle last week; I’d be in the hospital if I had been. I already admit in post #61 that I would have been a manual laborer had I been born blue-collar. I believe in unemployment and welfare very short term, and I think health care tied to your job is absurd. But just like you know people who are bright and work retail, I know people who abuse it . By my own professor’s admission, his wife works on set design on various movies and collects unemployment several times per year. This is beyond bullshit.

I’ve spent it all on Japanese sex dolls.

That’s all I needed to hear - that you haven’t read the whole thread. Also I’m sorry you wasted your youth, but I haven’t wasted mine.

:confused:

IMO, these are 2 very different ideas.

In fact, a lot of what is confusing to me about this thread is your inconsistent ideas. Your parents were refugees and you acknowledge that they had safety nets, yet you don’t believe strongly in safety nets. You tell us that you work very hard (and I am sure you do) and that we should not discredit you, but then you also say things like that you could only go to that swimming camp because you could afford it not because of your strength and talent as a swimmer.

FWIW, I do thank you for answering my questions and I am equally appalled (although maybe not surprised—it seems very Soprano-ish, the whole expecting your brother to buy the clothes, for example) at the attitudes of your brother’s girlfriends and their parents. I’m sorry if this thread hasn’t quite provided you with the opportunity to share what you thought you would be sharing when you started it.

I think you mentioned this before but how established were your parents when you were born? I had some friends in high school whose parents were a struggling immigrant family when they first moved to America. But the kids were born after their father had become a successful businessowner and their mother worked some other full-time job in a factory in a supervisory role.

Sure, they heard all the stories about how their parents and grandparents had little when they came to America, but they never experienced it. And it shaped them quite differently. They never had that “life is a struggle” experience. They had “my parents are a success, so I’m going to be a success”. And they all are.

But it seems like you want it both ways (“Ask the child of money” and “My parents were refugees”). It doesn’t work like that.

If you’re only going to make a comment every 4 years or so, better make it a good one. This cracks me up for some reason, that it’s your only post in 4 years.

The best part is that is exactly – exactly – what I was thinking as I read through this thread. It’s the *only *thing I’ve wondered reading this thread, actually, considering ms. bluth’s money situation is pretty much like everyone I went to college with, except she’s less rich. The kid’s not eating sardines for dinner, and it’s considerably more money than I grew up with, but it’s not wealth that is so far removed from anything I’ve encountered that I’d have to ask about it, so I’m not really curious and have nothing to add here. Well, no, there’s one thing.

Keep up, linds. No one is saying your parents had a bunch of advantages. They said YOU do, because your parents GAVE them to you.

So will hot air.

But it has a “rec room” !!!

I never thought I would meet anyone that grew up in house with a rec room !!!

And her parents once wrote her a check for 5000 whole dollars and it cleared and they didn’t need to go to a loan shark or anything!!

My mind is boggled by this glimpse of the “Lifestyles of the Rich and Famous”

I once wrote five thousand dollar check that cleared and I still had money for food. Should I start a thread about it???

My parents are also both immigrant doctors from a poor country (India) and, unlike your parents, they didn’t even come from the middle class! They were freaking poor as hell! AND my mom’s dad died when she was fourteen, leaving her to raise her younger siblings and get good enough grades to get into medical school in an incredibly competitive country!

Anyways, all that being said, my bestest friend in the world comes from a lower-middle-class white family who tends to spend money in unwise fashions. For quite some time, this made me feel quietly superior to her because my parents came from nothing and scrimped and saved, blah blah blah, American dream, etc. At some point I foolishly began uttering my internal monologue outloud, and mentioned that my parents came to this country with no advantages, just their MDs.

She snorted and said, “That’s a pretty big advantage right there.”

And she was right . . . as much as their are all bootstrappy Horatio-Algher prototypes, my parents were also lucky. They came from families that valued education, they had some natural intelligence, and at some point they also just plain got lucky.

So did your parents.

This is the first post of yours that makes me think you’re an actual person. Success is both the result of hard work and some random chance, and people are filled with contradictions. It’s okay to be inconsistent in your attitudes, because that’s how people are. One of the things it took me a long time to figure out is that people are very complex, society is very complex, and that there is a long, complex story behind everyone’s life decisions.

The main continental divide in North America is an imaginary border, wherein rain falling on one side will drain to the Pacific. Rain falling on the other side drains to the Atlantic. (Okay; there are more continental divides that would segregate water going to other places, but the big one is the Atlantic/Pacific). One simplified view of economic life in the US can be thought of as two populations on either side of that divide.

Just for kicks, say the west coast is abject poverty and the east coast is economic security. Some people start way off in Oregon, barefoot, walking towards the divide. They have no money, so they walk a bit, find a few odd jobs to save up a couple of hundred dollars, then take a bus ride as far as they can make it, then find a few odd jobs at the next destination to repeat the sequence. Some people get into accidents and sit by the side of the road; if someone happens upon them and gives them a lift to the hospital, they can get healthy, maybe work some odd jobs to pay the hospital bill (or maybe pay them in cash because they’d saved up for situations like these) and get back on the road. Some people, sadly, don’t get picked up, because they’ve gotten onto a road that isn’t used very often by buses or people with cars. So, they start crawling on their bellies until they can find a place where they might be able to heal, eat food and begin again from scratch.

Some people, quite early, decide that they’re going to stay put for awhile, get a steady job that might pay more, and save up for a reliable car and maybe enough to buy gas for the rest of the journey. Regardless, they all want to get back to the road.

Some people start off in Arizona in an air-conditioned car, and there’s enough cash in the glove compartment to buy gas for the whole trip, which is really less than a day’s drive. They might be just as fiercely independent as another person walking barefoot through the badlands, but that’s really just luck; it doesn’t make them a bad person or anything.

As people get closer to the divide they see the Colorado Rockies, which are steep and treacherous (or not – what do I know?) What the hell; I’ve just added fierce, tornado-like winds that swirl around them, mostly pushing them back towards the west. With time, perseverance and, yes, a little luck, they can eventually get to the divide.

Once people get to the continental divide, they find out that it’s really a bizarre place where my analogy starts falling apart. There are a few paths that will easily lead them down the other side to “economic security.” But some, because people are all different, seem to hover on the border; maybe it’s exciting there, or maybe they’re playing with fire. Some accidentally fall and tumble backwards; if they catch themselves in time, they can get back to the border without trouble, and some fall into a downward spiral, having somehow gotten on a magic bus that has no doors and travels non-stop back to the west.

And there are certainly cases of people born on the wealthy side of that divide who seem to make odd decisions that rush them quickly back over the divide and onward to the west. (Of course, this analogy is about economic security, and to some, life isn’t just about that). Regardless, there are many paths that people can take from the wealthy side back to the poor side.

But by and large, when you get to that divide, if you have your wits about you, stay the course and don’t catch some unlucky breaks, you can probably stay on the wealthy side with some moderate effort, though it’s generally easier than trekking through the badlands. For some, it’s easy to stay on that side, and for others, there are pitfalls and the high, swirly winds, and I’ve just added large pterodactyls that swoop down, pick people up and drop them in the badlands of Utah after chomping off their legs.

I have the view that there are many people who, because that’s the way the economy works, earn just enough money to be able to eat and pay rent and have enough money to take a bus ride just 25 feet to the east. Unfortunately, there are some who don’t make enough money to even do that, and by the way, I’ve added an infinitely moving sidewalk that’s always moving people slowly to the west. I also think that there are a hell of a lot of people crawling on their bellies, just trying to make it through the day without dying of sun stroke. Some of them have been out there so long that they’re actually crawling in the wrong direction and don’t even know it.

When someone who seems to have been put in the car with the glove box full of cash says something like, “I also find it amusing that people find 80 hours a week to be slave labor,” people who have gone through their own version of slave labor might react negatively to that statement. You don’t know why they’re staying with that job, you don’t know what road they’ve taken or what choices they encountered, and you don’t know what decisions they made. Your choice of words implies that you’re content to judge them instead of talking to them and finding out what fascinating journey led them to their current situation.

I assume you’re a good person, an intelligent person and hard-working, but some of the things you’ve written make you seem like someone who hasn’t gotten an appreciation for the diversity of experience that many people encounter. I know I’ve just presented a rather tortured analogy of peoples’ journeys toward or away from wealth, but I’d like to ask that you consider whether this journey is more complex than I’ve described, just about as complex, or more simple. Is it just, “wake up, stand up, work hard, walk 25 feet east, and repeat until you’re there”? Or do we have the moving sidewalks, magic buses and pterodactyls? From my perspective, though I’ve lived an odd life in some ways and a rather mundane life in others, I assume I don’t know even one percent of the odd things that other people have encountered in their journeys.

You know, as I’ve gotten older, that has probably been the realization that has hit me the hardest. No matter how much I can talk about how hard I worked (and I did too) there is always a factor of luck. I didn’t see it then, but I have come to see it now. I am not nearly as well off as the OP, and my parent’s were first generation off the farm, and didn’t pursue higher education. But I was still raised middle class (lower compared to the OP, but they worked their butts off) but there was still plenty of luck/karma/whatever involved.

Thanks for another chance to reinforce that thought Gestalt. Sometimes I forget how much luck went into it and its always nice to be reminded…

ETA: groo I liked your analogy!

I’m also still confused about this. If money were no object, why would a half-tuition scholarship persuade you? Surely there are other schools with better departments in chemistry and international relations?

Yes, why not choose Stanford or Cal?

groo, that was beautiful.

Question: why do you use the word still?

Question: speaking of Rosetta Stone, how many foreign languages do you speak fluently? By fluent, let’s say business level (opps, sorry that’s probably not a fair benchmark) or University level (could you pass a regular curriculum non-language learning class in a foreign language)?

Question: why do you think the fact that you’re parents were refugees allows “A Child of Wealth” to carry that mantle?

Question: what term do you think better describes your parents “hubris” or “humility”? What about you?

Question: Did you give up your academic scholarship and transfer to USC in part because the grade inflation there and less competition (than say a public university like UC Berkeley) will make it easier to get into dental school?