A simple answer? Yes.
By instinctive I mean say… when you were 5 years old. Did all the girls tend to play together and all the guys together? You don’t realise little things like that are instinctive because they were just feelings to you. That is what being transgendered is about, feelings.
the clothes are the most obvious manifestation of tgness. i see them as external validation of internal feelings. speaking at least for myslef, growing up and being trained to subvert my gender means that i am not typically female, but neither am i typically male.
it goes much deeper than clothing. there are brain differences between men and women, and a study i’ve read says that transexuals have the brain difference of the sex they claim to be. [as opposed to their birth genital type.]
certainly there are many m2f tg’s that act like men in dresses, but a lifetime of socialization is hard to overcome. even so, they go against that socialization so far as to publically dress as women. [which is a very strong taboo in straight american culture.]
women socialize with others differently than men do. try dressing and acting as someone of the opposite sex for a day and see!!
Delphica: It seems to me that most people who would identify as M to F transsexuals place more emphasis on being a woman than dressing like one, if you know what i mean. I’ve never seen my trans friend Linda dressed up in evening gown and pearls or whatnot - I don’t even know if she OWNS any such outfit; she usually wears tshirtandjeans that I’ve seen her. So if fashion for women’s formal wear were to suddenly change, I doubt she’d really pay that much attention simply because it’s not really something that comes up for her. Of course, she should be answering this question, not me.
I hope I’m not beating a dead horse here, but I still don’t understand. Maybe that’s because I’m not in your shoes. How are feelings gender-specific? To me, feelings are just feelings. One instinct that is frequently singled out as a feminine one is nurturing. Me, I’m as much a pickup-driving, hairy-chested, tobacco-spitting redneck as the next guy, yet I still feel very nurturing towards my son, and have been complimented for it. Would you agree that nurturing is a feminine feeling or instinct? Is that, perhaps, my feminine side, or am I way off base here?
I just noticed recently that some of the social action groups, including some on the campus where I work, have tacked on transgendered to gay/lesbian, e.g., Gay/Lesbian/Transgendered Student Alliance. <shrug>
Some people get their undies in a bunch about nuthin’. But for the sake of argument, let’s turn this scenario around. Would you, presenting as a female, feel uncomfortable if a guy walked into the bathroom and took a leak in the stall next to you? I must admit, I’d be a little uncomfortable if I was dropping a load in a stall and a woman came in to use the stall next door. Even though it is all very natural, I can produce some unmannerly sounds and scents during that maneuver.
dixiechiq, you shouldn’t have to endure threats, or danger from cops or drunken folks, or anyone. Shame about that. Perhaps the pop-psychology notion that people most uncomfortable with gays, etc. are also the ones least comfortable with their own sexuality is correct.
Best,
Dev
I would think your way off base.
I think that nurturing is only thought of as feminine because guys don’t like to think of it as the masculine thing to do.
Just think of how you would act if you were female instead of male. Does this come out of nothing?
Asmodean and Dixie…I have to agree with some of the others…how do you really know you are feeling like a woman? I’m a perfect example…I played with boys mostly. Sure I played with girls, and to this day have some very strong lifetime friendships with other women. But for the most part I related much better to men. During my teen years I had many more male friends than women. Many of the other girls were jealous of me for it. Their problem not mine, I wanted to be buds with everyone. And the clothes, I prefer sensible shoes, tennies actually. I’ve always loved big boxy boy style jackets. Hell, I can remember twice in my fashion life when I wore men’s ties. About 10 years ago I wore a black and white one to a Prince concert and had strangers yelling “Love your tie, girl!”.
I guess you can imagine my SOs disappointment to find out that I did not own a garter belt, not even a silky night gown. If I don’t sleep naked, it’s in an old worn out tee shirt. My robe, even though it’s a Victoria’s Secrect is flannel and old as hell. I hate panty hose. I hate thigh highs even worse. And high heels are the pits. Sure they make your legs look better and you feel more feminine when you first put them on but after a couple of hours your feet are crying “uncle”.
I also realize that it is much easier for women to break these kind of rules and no one thinks anything of it. Hell some guys think it’s sexy for their girlfriend to wear their shirts and boxers. (I wore the SOs out for a drink one night under my jeans. Little did I know then that he would have loved to been wearing mine.) And a few years ago Victoria’s Secret catalogs had their sexy models wearing long button down dresses with work boots.
That is a good question, tell me how you know you are “feeling” like a woman. Because I can tell you that sometimes I’m not sure if I know myself how a woman should “feel”.
Needs2know
i worked at a school for 5 years that had one bathroom for the staff. to use the urinals one had to walk through the first room, but otherwise everyone shared one area. i was never aware that anyone was uncomfortable with this arangement.
that’s a hard q to answer. how about i duck it and say this instead: i hid from and supressed my desire to look like and act like a woman publically/socially for nearly all of the first 35 years of my life.
somewhere around age 8 or so i learned that wearing dresses was taboo. taboo for me anyway, plenty of others were allowed to wear them. you know, my mother, my sisters, etc. i wore the clothes and stuff just about every day in secret. i continued to wear them in [mostly] secret until at age 35 i decided that was enough. i began to wear them in public. the first day i did that was to attend an crossdressers’ support meeting. at the end of the day i felt a serenity i had never known in my life. a peace i didn’t know could exist. from that time i have continued to evolve that part of me that i had so strongly repressed, and it has made the difference from not wishing to continue living. i have not solved all my problems, but i’ve begun to like other people, take pride in my appearance, and even look at myself in the mirror.
so am i woman, or do i at least “feel” like one?? i don’t honestly know. i know only how i feel, not what other women feel like, or what men feel like. but making the assumption that i am a woman, and acting on it does fulfil me in some way.
i am not particularly girly. i don’t remove all traces of manliness from appearance and manner. i am somewhat butch. i’m not trying to conform to a stereotype of femininity.
does that help??
Hey Dixie girl… yeah it helps a little. I was beginning to wonder myself if maybe you knew something I should have! It’s good to know I’m not the only one out here stumbling around in the dark! Ouch, someone stepped on my foot!
It’s a little ironic. I end up with this seemingly really good relationship for the first time in my life and the poor fellow has a thing for women’s lingere. Not just for him but me too. He wants me to wear the stuff too! Teddies, garter belts, high heels, push up bras are just not my thing. I’ve been trying to accomodate him but I feel like an idoit dressed in that stuff. Mainly because I have this body image problem that a lot of women have, I always hated mine. Even though now that I’m older I know intellectually that there is absolutely nothing wrong with my body. I have an average to better than average woman’s body. But somehow I “feel” like I’m not entitled (for lack of a better word) to be wearing that kind of clothing. And there he is standing there 6’1", size 13 feet jammed into size 10 shoes, mustache, thinning hair, covered with scars and hair wearing the same damned thing! Maybe the experience will be benefit me somehow. At least we’ve both developed a sense of humor about it. He says he was never able to laugh and joke about it with any of his previous relationships.
Needs2know
Needs2know its very simple:) I don’t “know” I concluded it logically from the evidence presented. Sure I can be wrong, but I really don’t see how its possible.
Think about evolution, how do I know evolution exists? Its not something that can be tested right now.
It would just be as easy to question you. How do you know that your a woman mentally? How do you know that the sun will rise tomorrow?
The problem is personal experience, I have spent a large part of my life trying to piece together other peoples personal experience and find out why I was so diffrent.
Asmodean my sweetie…I understand completely. I grew up without the benefit of a male role model in my life. You know they say that for a girl that situation can be every bit as damaging as for a boy. The clincher is that my mother was a critical bitch, even now. And most of her critisism (did I spell that right? Oh well) was directed at me. To this day she claims that I am “different” and always says it with such contempt. So most of my life I have tried to be “normal” not really knowing exactly what “normal” should be. So now I just say screw it and try to be myself. I do guilt really well so that means that it’s usually harder for me to live up to my own standards than it is everyone else’s.
Needs2know
Thats one problem with the current ideas towards being transgendered. The categories don’t really fit. Mostly because being transgendered is still looked at as a disorder. That turns it into a disorder because people then try to “correct” it. Its also considered mostly by its extreme form and while I happen to fit that extreme form pretty well most don’t.
One thing I also want to mention is that I don’t have your average amount of naturally occuring horomones either. I said I wasen’t androgenous looking, but I have found that I actually am. I actually have a figure mostly like a woman. You might wonder how someone can miss something like that, but really I am just skeptical by nature and generally wont admit anything without just about irrefutable proof.
I know several transsexual Navajos who prefer to call themselves “Two Spirited.” The Indian Health Service here even provides hormones for them.
It’s nice to know that I’m not the only “out” transsexual here. FTR, I’m male-to-female, on hormones for about six months, full-time since January 1. I’m slightly “closeted” at work (the director of human resources knows, nobody else does as far as I know). I plan to have surgery as soon as I can afford it, which will probably be some time in 2003 or 2004 (I’m eligible for it under the SOC beginning in 2002; my current doctor has indicated that he will clear me for surgery as soon as my year is up.)
As far as I’m concerned, I’m a woman with a birth defect. I have no interest in “transgendered society”. I don’t deliberately hang out with other transgendered people and do not attend support groups (I get that from my lover and my friends, very few of whom are, AFAIK, themselves transgendered).
Feel free to email me with questions. I try to answer politely asked questions and queries to the best of my meager ability.
Here’s hoping that, some day soon, the medical insurance establishment will drop the bar on payment for reassignment surgery. And if anyone happens to see John Money wandering about, kindly castrate him for me.
I live and work in an area with a large gay/lesbian/tg community. During October of every year, I work as a wardrobe mistress in a costume shop that has an equally large percentage of g/l/tg clients. Since I am the eldest of the employees, and therefore presumably the wisest, the owner has requested that I deal with these customers to make sure they are appropriately treated.
Here comes the tough part. As wardrobe mistress, my job is to dress people. Suggest costumes, get size information, zip them up, lace the corset, recommend different underwear under the gown, rearrange akward body parts, all of it.
I have no issues or concerns with sexual preferences - my own sex life is tough enough to deal with, thank you. However, for a number of these customers, gender is anyone’s guess. This makes my job a real bitch.
Generally when I talk to them, I ask for a name - and then call them by it, rather than err with “sir” or “m’am”, since that could be insulting. I use the name clue to help me select costumes - but god help me when a Jesse or Chris shows up. Also, I think it’s a good customer service idea to at least once in a while say “yes, sir” or “yes, m’am” - it gives some respect to the person you’re serving.
Does anyone have any ideas how I can gracefully ask for a gender preference without being a complete asshole?
Well seawitch, I would just ask them wether they want male or female clothes. If you don’t act offensive I don’t see why they would be offended by a question that might be necessary(and I am sure they already know it).
Okay, physiological question for TGs who are on hormone therapy (or what have you), or who have already completed surgery…
When I hit puberty (wham), and my breasts started to grow, the flesh around them FELT different. I can still remember vaguely how different the actual skin on my chest felt before I grew ta-tas. When you’re on hormones and your breasts start to grow, does the flesh on and around them FEEL different, or is it still just your old chest in a different configuration?
I can’t say whether what I experienced was anything like what you experienced. But shortly after I started hormones (say, a couple of weeks or so) my nipples became much more sensitive, softer, and “poofier” (for lack of a better term). I can’t say that I’ve noticed any real difference in the skin over my breasts generally. Also, the milk glands (which were tiny) almost immediately grew a bit and got very hard, tender, and warm to the touch – much like they did years ago when I did my first puberty, except even more so.
Does that help any?
Nodnod, that helps. I guess it’s a sort of different feeling then. I felt as though there was new skin…entirely new patches of nerve endings. Interesting.
Would it be rude to say, “Do you prefer ‘sir’ or ‘ma’am’?” Would this be different in some way from asking a businesswoman whether she prefers Mrs., Ms., or Miss?