I think the OP hangs out with a bunch of losers. Why the hell would you not at least have a on ID?
In my experience, a lot of the things I listed coincide with the desire to save money. And I don’t see how living with your parents is more “scared of other people” than living with your BFF since high school or your college roommate or your sibling or any number of ways people find “safe” roommates.
Dear Public Transportationistas/Bicyclers/Walkers:
When those of us who drive talk about those asshole moochers who refuse to get a license and/or buy a car as asshole moochers, we are really talking about people we know who are real and do exist and do ask us for rides.
We KNOW there are MILLIONS AND MAYBE BILLIONS of people who do not have licenses or cars and never ask anyone for a ride once even if they are dying on the sidewalk they would rather wait for a bus to take them to the ER thankyouverymuch. And it is very easy for them because a bus comes right by here every 10 minutes and they only paid $10 to ride the bus 28 hours a day 12 days a week for a year while insufferable suburbanite boobs must be paying THOUSANDS per year in insurance.
When we say “people who are too lazy to drive themselves” that is who we are talking about we are NOT TALKING ABOUT YOU and your bike helmet or your bus pass or Zipcar. We are talking about people who really should be driving and not asking us for a ride.
Ok? We’ve gone over this I think 3 times in the past month and I’m getting really sick of it. We KNOW places exist where there is good public transportation. Our lazy neighbors do not live there, they live next door to us.
Love,
ZipperJJ, suburban driver
Your last post refered to the people who are living with their parents because they are more financially secure than their parents. That is clearly not what the OP is attempting to address, nor what MOL is adressing.
My point is that they don’t contradict each other. These days, especially, it’s not uncommon to have parents who need help with the bills, because they are overextended on a mortgage, and kids who would save substantial amounts of money by living at home. I am talking about grown children and parents who form a mutually beneficial single economic unit. These are not uncommon, and not always dysfunctional.
If people are going to make sweeping statements about how people who don’t have a car or a licence are nothing but childish moochers, then expect that those of us who take care of ourselves and live our lives according to what is required to get around without relying on the goodwill of our friends and families exclusively, are going to come back and remind you that not everyone who doesn’t have a car is just like the lousy spongers you decide to associate with.
You’re right, I didn’t “have” to live at home for a year after college. But I did, because I was an IT major who graduated in the mid-2000s (you may all point and laugh). What that means is that I graduated alongside thousands of other IT majors and we were all looking for jobs in an industry that had just contrated itself quite heavily. So I was underemployed (I hate the term too, but it fits).
But like I said, I didn’t “have” to live at home. Two friends from high school and I discussed getting our own place, splitting the rent and scraping by (we were all underemployed). We decided against this.
So I lived at home with my mom for a year. I saved money. I followed job leads. I did chores. I ferried my grandmothers around to the grocery store and doctor’s appointments so my mom didn’t have to. I fixed her computer when it broke. I drove a shitbox car because it’s what I could afford at the time. I kept up on my student loan payments. I met my future wife.
Then, more or less a year to the day after I graduated, I got a full-time job. I moved out before the ink on my employment contract was dry. Was I a moocher for that year? Or was I smart because I didn’t drive myself further into debt just because my mom gave me a better option than living in a rat-infested apartment with some friends?
PDQ. But reading this thread, I think my expectations are askew.
How about I share my data on these things?
car- Ready to go in my last weeks of being 15.
DL- I flunked the driver’s test the first time I took it! :o It took until my 2nd week at 16 to get it.
job- Mowed lawns from age 12 for money. Got a paycheck job at 15, the legal minimum. Was unemployed my freshman year of college, but after 15 literally never unemployed more than a few months aggregate. I should not have worked during college, big mistake.
sex- tend to have sex, but didn’t get started particularly early. Yes/no on sex doesn’t really define a person’s identity, unless they’re doing something crazy…
own place- 19. Only lived with my parents for a few months after this. My biggest mistake was not getting my own place sooner. I should’ve ‘disappeared’ the day after I graduated High School!
I think I am more independent that average though. I’d rather spend money than lose autonomy.
I should add that I might as well have lived in Peoria. Not too many people are going to mow lawns in NYC.
Thank you. Sometimes I honestly wonder if I was clear, or if people are purposely responding to their own agenda, rather the discussion being offered.
Obviously it’s not always 100% black or white case of home living = loser, and living alone = winner, but what percentage of adults who live beneath their parents’ teat are autonomous adults, or are caring for sickly, elderly parents? What percentage of folks who have never left home, purchased a car, or gotten laid aren’t pathetic little babies? What we’re driving at here is typically, how much time should we give adults to get their shit together and lead self-sufficient lives that don’t involve mowing their parents’ lawns for room and board?
In short, my answer to the OP is you should have most of this down by 25. By 30, you should definitely be on this. Yes, I know, exceptions, exceptions, exceptions. Generally speaking, seriously, get your own damn place to live, a job, and driver’s license before 30. Seriously.
Hey, I graduated in the mid 2000s, with a degree in English (:eek:) so I know all about under-employment immediately following school. Talk about a useless sheet of paper. I use my degree as a place mat! Seriously now, a year out of school, and at presumably 23 years old, living at home for a bit isn’t a big deal. I’m talking about people who take many, many years transitioning into adulthood, and seem to be on a needlessly prolonged (if any) track toward independence from their folks. At some point I’d say most people draw the line and say “Come on now. Get the hell out of your parents’ house.” I would not say staying at home one year out of school has reached that point yet.
But anyway, this isn’t about you, and is not personal. I hate when people bring their anecdotes into this discussions because it turns into a study of one person’s circumstances instead of focusing on the big picture. In any event, I’m glad things worked out for you. Things worked out for me as an English major, the most useless major ever, which means there’s hope for anyone.
All the best.
I’m not sure how to make this more clear, you are not the person that the OP is talking about. Honestly. It is the perpetual child that refuses to live below his or her means. It is those who refuse to pull their own weight due to a sense of entitlement. These are the people that the OP is trying to understand.
The OP specifically mentions that he’s talking about people in their early 20s (and presumably fresh out of college). So yeah, he was taking a shot at me, when I think my post-college year at home was pretty damn reasonable. Christ, I’m Italian and the old ways die hard. I would have been encouraged to stay until I was 30. Leaving at 22 was considered early by some of my relatives.
And I realize it’s not about my personal situation and no one was actually taking a shot at me. But this board has a habit of snacking on people that haven’t moved out before their mortarboard hits the ground at their high school graduation. It’s tiresome.
Oh, fer crissakes. Really?!? You think this is directed at you? Your momma should have put some of the Italian blood that you claim to have and put it into perspective. Again, you are not what the OP is about. However, given the way you react, maybe there is some introspection that you need to undergo. Maybe she coddled you a bit to much. You seem a little delicate.
I’m sure you know that there are some cultures where you are expected to live with your parents until you get married. Living alone is frowned upon. – it’s a little bit sleazy.
So it really depends on whether the OP is talking about what would be strange in the US, or globally.
Seeing that you are apparently taking yet another avenue to derail the conversation, the OP is talking about the US. It shocks me that you all-the self proclaimed smartest people on the internet cannot read even the tiniest little context clue.
Without an ID, how can you make banking transactions? You need to have some kind of ID, even if you don’t have a car. If you are an adult and part of mainstream society, you MUST have one. If you are among the people with a bohemian or transient lifestyle or who live “off the grid” and outside of mainstream society, you probably don’t need one, as you will be dealing with cash or bartering.
Don’t drink, don’t smoke, don’t drive, and live near decent public transportation. I got a state ID once I started going to clubs in my mid-20s, and I got my driver’s license in my late 20s when it became easier to drive to work than bus.
I may have been a loser, but it wasn’t because of the lack of ID.
So you read what I wrote (where I specifically said the OP wasn’t talking about me) and decided that I must have been coddled? Read for comprehension cupcake.
She was significantly dysfunctional, but less-so than my insanely-dysfunctional father. And after being born to significantly dysfunctional parents, you view normality as dysfunctional instead.
In other words, I haven’t repaired my relationship with her. I don’t care to right now, I have enough on my neurotic plate as it is. I’m avoidant, though (since avoidance is the only effective tactic I’ve yet found against their particular brand of insanity). Also, she moved an hour and a half away and bought a house, and with gas so expensive I have a built-in excuse not to spend time with her. Anytime I go there, she puts me to work around the house. And my friends and boyfriend, too, when they visited with me. blah
I might make an mpsims thread about it someday.
I tried, once. Once, because standing outside the bus drop off in -25C with snow for 20 minutes wasn’t worth it. I could have warmed up my car and been home by then. At least you wont get shanked in Regina’s downtown bus station, as opposed to Saskatoon’s.