Mr. Green Fool, I’ll admit there are probably some things in the movie that I missed. Like I said before, I’m not a fan boy. I liked the first three movies, and I think that Lucas is a good storyteller. But I don’t read the novels, buy the comics, frequent the web sites, etc. I’m sure there were subtle winks and nods in AotC that were really exciting to devotees. And even though I didn’t care for the movie much, I’m genuinely glad it floated your boat.
I think AotC had the potential to be a great movie. There are certain avenues I would have found fascinating that Lucas chose not to explore. One of these is the morality of building a clone army. I’d have liked more politics and less smooching, better dialogue and less planet-hopping, more moral ambiguity and no Jar-Jar Binks. But then I really liked Gosford Park, too.
Not like Pokemon? I admit the main characters are terrible, but Team Rocket rulez!! They are the only reason i watch that show. How come no one is complaining about Pokemon being captured in the wild and subjected to gladatorial type events?
Folks, this movie is made for kids. Kids like we were when the first three came out. Do you really think a movie about moral ambiguity and political intrigue would have entertained you as a kid? It’s a silly Space Opera, and on that level, I thought it was great, just like all his other great silly Space Operas. YMMV.
Okay here’s the scene that you wanted and asked for and it was there the whole time.
At the end of the movie when Mace, Yoda and Obi-wan are sitting around Yoda’s apartment. (I’ll paraphrase here because although I’m a big SW nerd, I have only seen the movie twice)
Obi-wan: I have to admit that without the clones this would not have been a victory.
Yoda: Victory? Not a Victory. ‘sumpin-sumpin-sumpin’ (I can’t remember, but I think Yoda actually calls it a defeat) Begun this Clone War has.
From that very brief scene you have the subtle build of what you asked for Burundi.
I can break it into a nearly word for word script analysis if you’d like, but the gist is:
The scene sets up the trepidation of the Jedi of using/having used the clones. And the for-sight to see the problem of using the clones in this way and what it means for the Republic and them.
“The Jedi aren’t soldiers” according to Mace Windu in AOTC …but in A New Hope Leia refers to Obi-wan as General so already you know something happens in or inbetween Epi 3 to change that.
You also have to realize that there is ANOTHER movie coming out. Decrying Epi. 2 for not dealing with the morality of the clones is like the people who were upset that Fellowship of the Ring ended without the ring being destroyed… the story ain’t done folks!
The other side of the coin is… How can the Republic NOT use the clones? They are being threatened by an ememy with a almost limitless military force of complete expendables (Battledroids) For the greater good I don’t see a problem with using clones who were bred for this purpose.
The problem is what do you do with the clones once the war is over… Hey didn’t ST: TNG… do an episode about that? I don’t know for sure… I’m NOT that much of a dork.
That ST:TNG episode wasn’t about cloning, but about highly-trained and conditioned soldiers who were unable to adapt to civilian life.
m-HEY, GLAVIN!
As for Obi-Wan becoming a general, it would surprise me not one whit if this gets tossed on the pile with the thousand-or-so other inconsistancies that Lucas doesn’t give a hoot about.
I just hope Anakin doesn’t whine quite so much in part 3. I’ve already had one pair of glasses shattered, thankyouverymuch.
And had the movie had a lot more of this, I would’ve enjoyed it more. Five seconds of dialogue does not a political intrigue make.
The fact that it’s a kid’s movie doesn’t excuse it, I think. Chicken Run had more political complexity, and Toy Story 2 had more moral ambiguity. And both had superior madcap-chases-on-a-conveyor-belt sequences.
Perhaps they’ll deal more with the moral ambiguity in the next movie. Considering how it was dealt with in this one (tw lines of dialogue that didn’t address the moral perils of fighting droids with clones), I’m not holding my breath.
Oh c’mon, there was no political intrigue BECAUSE IT WASN"T NEEDED! It served no purpose. Palpatine’s machinations worked because they were so simple on a macropolitical scale. He took advbantage of a painful split (which he helped along) There are a lot of minor parts to his plans, but they are not requirements. In the first ovie, its pretty obvious he didn’t want Amidala to arrive on Coruscant, but he was able to take advantage of what happened.
Wasn’t there another ST:TNG episode about clones that they rescued from some planet and at the same time they rescued some hillbillies from another planet? All I remember was the hillbilly leader’s daughter got down with Riker, and the hillbilly leader saying “Send in the clones”.
Yep, and the clones were about to die off because of replication errors and had to Interbreed with the Irish people. three men per woman. And the Irish like klingon drinks. The episode was Up the Long Ladder