Because you have the technology does NOT make it ok to use it, asshole.

[Chimera]

@MandaJo

Do we really want “looking stupid in public” to be an error?

This isn’t something you or I get to vote on except by failing to participate.

[Diogenes_the_Cynic]

The only people who are going to laugh at the cell phone pics are those who would laugh in meat space too. It isn’t really that large a percentage of people. Most people looking at a site like that DO roll their eyes and think people are being dicks.

The only “acceptance” of it is that it’s tolerated as free speech. I’m not sure what “not accepting” it would entail other than making it illegal.

[MandaJo]

@Chimera

This isn’t something you or I get to vote on except by failing to participate.

I’m pretty sure that Stoid’s point is that decent people ought to fail to participate, and in this case I tend to agree with her.

[Stoid]

@Chimera

Wait a minute. THIS poster;

I’m for truth, no matter who tells it. I’m for justice, no matter who it’s for or against.
-Malcolm X

Is telling me that I’m in the wrong her because I’m saying that it isn’t ALL BAD that some people get pointed and laughed at in public for things that are clearly in their control (at least to some degree) they but are apparently oblivious about?

People learn by making mistakes. They learn most by having OTHER PEOPLE point out their errors. If they look silly in public and do not realize it, having people laugh at them is a rather direct way of telling themu that there is something wrong and maybe they should notice it. Posting pictures on the Internet is merely our modern method of sharing information with our social groups, which are much wider spread than in previous eras. There is nothing inherently wrong with this.

Sure, some people are asses. Hell, most people are, and EVERYONE is at some point or another. We can’t legislate this and social pressure is unlikely to make any dent in it given the psychological pressure (leftover herd mentality animal behavior) not to show any kind of weakness. Being a jerk gets you ahead in life and let’s face it, doesn’t appear to have all that many downsides, even if that isn’t how you or I may choose to live our lives.

So my take on this is that you can laugh at the people in the pictures with impunity, because they are funny looking, or you can choose to sympathize or empathize with them. You can also do both. Neither preclude having the thought that the person posting the pictures is a major jerk.

Man, I SO hate when I zap a carefully worded post… FUCK.

I dont’ have time to redo it right now, suffice it to say this: your fundamental assumptions about pretty much everything are wrong, starting with the idea that humiliation is an effective tool for helping people change, especially when it comes to fat people. That is a fiction people tell themselves to feel better about participating in humiliating others. And it’s not a matter of opinion, it’s a matter of reality. If humiliation were effective, America would be a nation of supermodels.

[Stoid]

@MandaJo

I’m pretty sure that Stoid’s point is that decent people ought to fail to participate, and in this case I tend to agree with her.

I think we should do more. The quote from the article I posted described a girl who only “failed to participate”. I think we should actively, vocally speak against it. Don’t just leave the comment section to the people who want to pile on board with the rude remarks…speak up and say “you guys are being assholes”.

Silence isnt’ enough.

[Kimstu]

@Diogenes the Cynic

Both things can be true.

Way to dodge the question. If somebody you care about is being made fun of for their looks, is it important to point out that making fun of someone for their looks is mean and rude asshole behavior? Or is it sufficient simply to put the responsibility on them for being funny-looking or unattractive in the first place?

Yes, it’s true that being funny-looking or ugly will make a negative impression on others, and people should take the responsibility to at least make an effort to reduce their unattractiveness when they go out in public.

However, there is no situation in which publicly mocking somebody else solely for their unattractive appearance makes the mocker anything but a mean and rude asshole. And that, ISTM, is the more important issue in such situations.

[Chimera]

@MandaJo

I’m pretty sure that Stoid’s point is that decent people ought to fail to participate, and in this case I tend to agree with her.

I would also agree with that point.

I spent about a half hour at Peopleofwalmart.com one day at work because we were all bored and it was going around. Pretty much just shrugged my shoulders and moved on after that. People are stupid and clueless and some people enjoy dressing funny. Also, people’s tastes vary wildly* Nothing new there, nothing I wanted to waste any more time on.

And I dunno, Stoid, humiliation works better than a lot of other things at changing behavior. If fat people (and I myself am overweight) walked out their door and got laughed at and pointed at by every person they encountered, there would be HUGE pressure to lose weight. For the most part, morbidly obese people are not subject to very much in the way of overt humilation.

• For example; some people like those square, boxy cars in really sick colors and think those are really cool. If someone gave me one of them, I’d be forced to wear a bag over my head while driving straight to the dealership to trade it in for something else.

[Diogenes_the_Cynic]

@MandaJo

I’m pretty sure that Stoid’s point is that decent people ought to fail to participate, and in this case I tend to agree with her.

Are there currently lots of decent people participating?

[MandaJo]

@Diogenes_the_Cynic

Are there currently lots of decent people participating?

More than some of the other things we have recreational outrage threads about, I would think.

[ToborAton]

@Stoid

I’m not going to give a link, because I’m not going to participate in perpetuating it.

You are a moronic spineless coward and I really don’t like you.

You didn’t even consider that many people here might agree with you and that they might have enough spine to call people out on their idiocy? Your reasoning just froze up at the hint that something bad might happen. I may seem irrationally pissed about your not providing a link so I will admit that I was already pissed at you giving me the TSA checking for shoe bombs, liquid bombs and now underwear bombs.

@Stoid

Then there was a photo of a fat woman wearing a very unflattering outfit. Not a weird or wacky outfit, just an outfit that was not attractive on her figure, profoundly so. She is sitting in what looks like it might be some kind of waiting room.

She is fatter than you think she should be and you don’t like what she was wearing. You may not have realized it but there are some guys that love big women and she probably knows that better than you. I am guessing she was wearing a sexy shirt when you think she should be hiding her body because you think she should be ashamed of it.

I personally find Charlize Theron, “The Italian Job,” attractive but there are lots of guys who really really like big boobies and some guys really love a big ass. It sounds like she knows some guys want her and some don’t. It might hurt her feelings a bit to hear the biting things some people might say but she I say it probably isn’t anything she hasn’t heard before. I bet she might even pull this off: Roxanne.

@Stoid

And it was obvious from the photo, because of the angle and the text in the border, that the picture was taken with a camera phone, surreptitiously.

I contend that she was a paid model and the photographer was trying to make it look like an amateur shot.

@Stoid

But what that picture says about you is much more profound. It says that you are a nasty, cruel, mean-spirited sleazeball completely disconnected from the most basic understanding of what is acceptable.

Your anonymous pitting says the same thing about you to me. Human up and find the backbone to actually call them out on it by sending feedback to the website.

[Uzi]

@Kimstu

…, and people should take the responsibility to at least make an effort to reduce their unattractiveness when they go out in public.

Uh, why? Is it offending someone that they don’t dress in the latest fashion to go to Walmart? It isn’t a job interview, after all.

What should be illegal, if anything, is posting some stranger’s picture without posting one of their own right beside it. That way we’d all have something to laugh at.

[Stoid]

@Chimera

And I dunno, Stoid, humiliation works better than a lot of other things at changing behavior. If fat people (and I myself am overweight) walked out their door and got laughed at and pointed at by every person they encountered, there would be HUGE pressure to lose weight. For the most part, morbidly obese people are not subject to very much in the way of overt humilation.

You are very much mistaken, both about how much humiliation fat people experience and about how effective it is at motivating change. And that is not my personal opinion, it is a fact.

If you don’t believe it, then I invite you to open a GD thread, and post in the OP all the research you can find demonstrating the effectiveness of humiliation at motivating positive and long term change in people who are obese.

What I think you’ll learn if you really look is that the overall effect of humiliation is to make it worse, because it makes fat people ashamed and afraid to participate in the world, so they isolate, and then they use food to make themselves feel better and end up fatter.

The idea that humiliation will help is a fiction people tell themselves to make their behavior ok, whether it’s husbands angry about their wife getting fat, or frustrated parents who don’t know how to help their kid, or just garden variety assholes who don’t want to step up and completely own their assholery.

[Stoid]

@ToborAton

Y
Your anonymous pitting says the same thing about you to me. Human up and find the backbone to actually call them out on it by sending feedback to the website.

I did before I posted this, publicly.

As for the rest of your post, I don’t feel comfortable that I understand whether your position is genuine or not, so I will decline to reply.

[Rand_Rover]

@Stoid

The idea that humiliation will help is a fiction people tell themselves to make their behavior ok, whether it’s husbands angry about their wife getting fat, or frustrated parents who don’t know how to help their kid, or just garden variety assholes who don’t want to step up and completely own their assholery.

Or we think it’s just funny, fatty.

–Rand Rover, garden variety asshole.

[BottledBlondJeanie]

With respect to overweight people, isn’t there an exception i.e., that individuals can genuinely make a choice about their weight? Certainly exceptions could be made, including inability to afford clothes that fit or, goodness forbid an actual contributing medical condition. However, if a 300 pound woman is out shopping with a half-shirt, short shorts with writing across the ass, preferably “Juicy”, but “Pink” will work, I reserve the right to giggle a bit.

[Kimstu]

@Uzi

Uh, why? Is it offending someone that they don’t dress in the latest fashion to go to Walmart? It isn’t a job interview, after all.

No, it’s certainly not offensive if you don’t take any pains to look reasonably tidy and non-tacky when you go out in public. It just makes the world a slightly nicer place if you do, and other people are likely to perceive you more positively.

[Kimstu]

@Rand Rover

Or we think it’s just funny

If you make fun of unattractive people just because you think it’s funny, then yes, you’re just being a mean and rude asshole.

But Stoid was pointing out that if you make fun of unattractive people and justify it by pretending that it’s somehow beneficial to them (by helping them become more self-aware or bullshit like that), then you’re being not only a mean and rude asshole, but a hypocritical or self-deluded one to boot.

[ToborAton]

@Stoid

I did before I posted this, publicly.

I’m glad to hear that and I suppose I should apologize for assuming you didn’t.

@Stoid

As for the rest of your post, I don’t feel comfortable that I understand whether your position is genuine or not, so I will decline to reply.

I can’t say I blame you as I am not entirely sure how much of it is genuine.

[Stoid]

@BottledBlondJeanie

With respect to overweight people, isn’t there an exception i.e., that individuals can genuinely make a choice about their weight? Certainly exceptions could be made, including inability to afford clothes that fit or, goodness forbid an actual contributing medical condition. However, if a 300 pound woman is out shopping with a half-shirt, short shorts with writing across the ass, preferably “Juicy”, but “Pink” will work, I reserve the right to giggle a bit.

You giggling to yourself, or even nudging your friends and directing their attention, then giggling in a way that doesn’t make it obvious, is not the pinnacle of niceness, but it’s relatively benign, of course, and I think you know that. I think you also know the difference between that and what the person who posted the picture did.

I take issue with your general position, though, if I understand it correctly. It seems to include the following parts:

1. Fat people choose to be fat.

2. Because they choose it, it’s ok to be unkind to them.

3. Some fat people don’t choose it, they have some underlying biological reason for it, so they don’t deserve to have people be unkind to them about it.

4. People with bad taste choose bad taste, so they also deserve mockery and derision.

5. People who are wearing clothes that look like crap because they have to for some other reason don’t deserve to be mocked because they can’t help it.

If we accept without question that all these things are true, (I don’t, but for the moment…) the default position seems clear: the existence of persons who fall into categories described in #3 and #5 preclude indulging in mockery and derision of fat people or people with hideous outfits, because you have absolutely no way of knowing why they are fat or why they are wearing a hideous outfit. And if you consider yourself a decent human being, your belief that more people than not fall into the choose/deserve category makes no difference, since your desire to indulge in mockery and derision does not (among decent people) trump the need to be respectful of people who do not deserve mockery and derision.

[Rand_Rover]

@Kimstu

If you make fun of unattractive people just because you think it’s funny, then yes, you’re just being a mean and rude asshole.

Oh noes!! I has a sad.

But Stoid was pointing out that if you make fun of unattractive people and justify it by pretending that it’s somehow beneficial to them (by helping them become more self-aware or bullshit like that), then you’re being not only a mean and rude asshole, but a hypocritical or self-deluded one to boot.

If someone is willing to let themselves become a fatty, then I doubt anything will be beneficial to them. They are too far gone. Which gets us back to “it’s just funny.”