Wow, there were a lot of replies since I started laboriously typing on my iPod Touch’s tiny screen!
So, what you’re saying is that Christianity is fundamentally incompatible with supporting gay rights?
Somebody should find that guy in post 5 who was asking who these videos are for, and tell him we found his answer!
I’m not talking about Christian individuals, I’m talking about the religion’s teachings. I don’t really get why people identify with religions that they disagree with on major points, and yet so many people do it. And everyone knows they do it…so that was just my point. I thought everyone knew there were tons of non-homophobic Christians.
After seeing photos of Chicago’s Gay Pride Parade with Christians holding signs along the route saying things like “I’m sorry for how you’ve been treated” and marchers coming over to joyfully and tearfully embrace them - I’d say obviously there is a deep need for messages like this. Because the homophobes are always willing to make braying asses of themselves for hateful people to repost, claiming they’re just concerned that someone doesn’t go to hell - so having lots of countermessages is a valuable thing.
Religions are made up of individuals. The more non-homophobic Christians there are, the less homophobic Christianity becomes. Which is a good thing.
What I don’t get, is atheists who insist that Christians who aren’t fundamentalist assholes are somehow not “real” Christians. I can’t imagine a better example of shooting yourself in the foot. Why would you want to re-enforce a dichotomy between being Christian and supporting gay rights? How does that help the gay rights movement at all? If someone is highly identified as Christian, and sympathetic to gay rights, how do you think he’s going to react to hearing you tell him, “Pick a side?” Do you think he’s more likely to abandon his religion, or decide, “I guess they don’t want me helping out, so I won’t bother.” If you want to talk about picking sides, think about this for a minute: There’s only one other group out there, aside from people like yourself, who complain about “cafeteria Christians.” And that’s the aforementioned fundamentalist assholes. Why would you want to be on their side on any issue?
I do see your point and agree to an extent. It just really depends on the person too though. There are a lot of people who consider themselves Christians just because of inertia, basically, and it makes sense to ask them what exactly their beliefs are and how they line up with those of the religion they identify with. Almost all the Christians I know are very, VERY pick-and-choose, so sometimes I do just want to ask them WTF (I don’t know, though, if they’re not using their religious beliefs to justify being assholes. If someone believes homosexuality is wrong because of their religious beliefs but is all for premarital sex, I’ll say something. If someone is for marriage equality but is Catholic, I won’t).
Thou paintest with a very wide brush. I don’t think you have a clue about how many different flavors of Baptist there are. Off hand I can think of Southern, Northern, Free Will, Independant, Missionary, Full Gospel, Fundamental, Primative, Regular, and Old Regular. And that’s just in the US. All “baptist” means is that they follow the practice of believers baptism, generally by full immersion. You can draw very few theological conclusions that apply to all of them.
“Evengelical” is not even a denomination, but a description. It describes any religion or denomination that actively seeks to convert others to their religion. There are evangelicals in almost every Christian denomination and most other religions.
Really, outside of Roman Catholicism, few “major Christian denominations” have an official spokesperson that can speak for millions.
Check out Unfundamentalist Christians.
One of my closest Christian friends has taken a lot of comfort in this site because she’s a deeply kind, tolerant person who’s felt continually pressured to reject homosexuals. There are absolutely plenty of deeply intolerant communities out there, and such communities can be very good at convincing their members that the world outside is a smaller place than it really is.
It’s a gamble, really. A number of atheists came to their belief because they realized that Christianity (or whatever), taken to its logical conclusion, is both contradictory and hateful. The whole edifice collapses at once. If instead you tell people that they can ignore those parts of the Bible that are inconvenient, then you end up in this eternal struggle with convincing them that one more part of their belief system was bogus (slavery, sexism, racism, homophobia, transphobia, etc.).
Still, it’s probably wishful thinking to say that most people will just give up their religion if you can poke one more hole in it. It works on some people, though.
Another angle is that if you’re just going to pick and choose based on your internal moral compass, why do you need religion at all? Answers vary.