I understand where you’re coming from, believe me. It’s not like The Black Legend revisionist BS doesn’t irk the shit out of me – sure, no saints were we, but neither what said Legend portraits as being. OTOH, I’m fully with BG on this one. I humbly admit I can’t top what he wrote.
Don’t even go there or I’ll derail this thread to no end! THE GOAL in Glasgow that won us our 9th CL Title will forever be stuck in my retina.
Likely THE most graceful player I’ve ever seen – and I’ve been watching football for over forty years.
Weirddave, you are exactly what is wrong with America. A fuckin’ nut frothing at mouth at the site of more blood and conquest while pleasantly seating and getting grotesquely obese on junk food in front of your 'puter’s monitor.
(This post can stand in reply to everyone who wants to put words into my mouth.)
I have no problem with political dissent. It is the rock upon which our democratic republic was built, and the concept of a loyal opposition is the hardest thing for new democracies to grasp. I am not a my country right or wrong guy, nor do I clam the U.S. has never made any mistakes, I’m an historian, I bet I can name more of them then most of you. No, the reason BG is a traitor is not because he holds a political opinion that I disagree with, the reason he is a traitor is because he wants to tear down the entire foundation upon which our country was built and replace it with one where the government steals from the capable to subsidize the lazy and does it in the name of the “common good”. THAT is what I take issue with and that vile, disgusting, warped philosophy must be opposed whenever it rears it’s head in America, with utmost vigor. Someone who seeks to destroy the very thing they falsely claim to venerate is no type of patriot at all.
Oh, I see. The reason he is a traitor is not because he holds a political opinion that you disagree with, the reason he is a traitor is because he holds a political opinion that you REALLY disagree with. Well, that makes sense.
PS-As fpr being a “'noob” pay no mind to anyone that brings it up against you. Simply irrelevant – only thing that matters to me is your bytes on screen. This board’s become rather stale (quite the understatement) presicely because of the lack of new blood. Might and will not always agree with what you have to say, but AFAIC, when you joined has nothing to do with what you write. All else is sheer snobism and faux pretentiousness.
Yeah I don’t know what you’re on about Weirddave. America is what we make it–the fathers recognized that, and that’s why we can amend the constitution. If BG somehow convinces enough people that socialism is the way to go, well–that’s America now. You can vehemently oppose him all you want, but to say–
[Quote=Weirddave]
BG is a traitor
[/quote=Weirddave]
This brings up an interesting question, though, one that I hadn’t though of before: is it possible to have a political position so antithetical to a country that to work towards it (let alone believe in it) is by itself treasonous?
Follow-up for those who don’t like the extreme: how mainstream can such a position be, if it exists?
Wow! Anyone who can seriously write something like this is a cunt. Fuck off, right now.
We seem to mistake fascism for patriotism in the US these days, and dullards like Weirddave and smiling bandit can only drool and pick and wonder what the hell is keeping the jackboots from coming to clean out the riff raff.
Why should I stop Cid? And I understand exactly what I am saying Richard, I don’t think you quite grasp it.
OK, look at it this way. This board abounds with criticism, both warranted and unwarranted, against the Bush administration. The left constantly trots out the mantra that Bush is a traitor because they do not agree with many of the things that he is doing. Fine. It’s a debatable point, sometimes they are spot on and sometimes they are out of their minds, yet I can’t recall anyone here challenging the notion that “Bush is a traitor” is a legitimate viewpoint.
Contrast that with BG who fervently believes in a political philosophy that maintains the U.S. would be a better place if the government insinuated itself into every corner of our lives (like they aren’t already), took over all industry, distributed the wealth of America in anyway that it saw fit to, all in the name of, as I said, the common good. That’s not a dissenting opinion, that’s destroying what America is and turning it into something else. I would have the same reaction to a Fascist. A Fascist system of government is incompatible with the democratic republic we have in the U.S. The exact same is true of a Socialist system of government. Someone who wants to destroy the current system of government and replace it (no matter with what) is a traitor to the United States, and I have a hell of a lot more reasoning behind that then ANY of the traitor accusations that so casually get tossed about WRT the Bush administration. THOSE accusations are based, for the most part, on a dislike of an opposing political position, nothing more.
Pakistan’s nukes came from China? That’s news to me. Got a cite?
Well, of course. He’s a threat because he might be a threat someday.
Didn’t we already do this song-and-dance just five years ago over Saddam?
Are you going somewhere with this?
IYHO, he’s nothing more than a blowhard, but by Bush Measure, he’s dangerous. How about if I let you finish up that argument with yourself, and you can get back to me when you’re done. I quite honestly can’t figure out which side you’re arguing.
I think the label is equally stupid when applied to Bush. The president may be a simpleton, he may be operating from a ludicrously polarized view of international relations, and he may have initiated horribly disastrous things, but I do not believe he is not a traitor. If BG calls Bush a traitor (I am not certain if he has or not) I will say, “Hey BG. That’s stupid.”
See, no. As long as BG works within the confines of the American constitution while he is trying to change what America is, I’m not that worried about it. Nor does it make him a traitor. When he starts handing over classified documents to the Chinese, then you can call him a traitor and I’ll agree. As long as he’s advocating socialist positions, he’s just some guy you don’t like.
I find it sad that in the race to skewer Weirddave, every other poster let this post stand unopposed. To equate these two Socialist leaders to Roosevelt as patriots is sad to me. BTW: Debs was already a convicted criminal before even becoming a socialist.
Why is he a great patriot, for trying to keep us out of WWI or for helping to found Unions? He was a strong anti-capitalist. He was also no proud or patriotic American. By his own words, which while honorable are not patriotic by any stretch.
BG, I guess I understand why you admire this man, I do not and cannot, but you have a twisted sense of the meaning of Patriot to make the post you did.
Patriot: one who loves his or her country and supports its authority and interests.