Thanks to this thread’s title I will dispense with the spoiler tag.
[ol][li]Giles. Hell fucking yes. All hail Discordia: it was good to see that limey again. Him and Buffy laughing was so welcome to such a dark episode. What was awesome about this is that he wasn’t some deus ex machina, either. Well, not really. He came when his buddies were in trouble. And he did what he could. Still, his magibabble disappointed me slightly.[/li][li]The terrible [two leftovers]. I have always liked Jonathan. Don’t like Andrew and I am glad that Warren is toast. Either way, hopefully their pretty much out of the series.[/li][li]Anya. She’s been a favorite of mine, third after Giles, and Giles after Willow. I’m glad to see her and Xander discussing things without Xander talking down to her like she’s some kind of monkey and without her acting like a friggin’ monkey. I bet her and Xander work it out and get married next season. I will enjoy it.[/li][li]Xander. What can I say. Xander rocks. Of all the characters, he’s been second only to Cordelia at pointing out the obvious. Glad he made the obvious so obvious for Willow. Sometimes the truth is so clear you see right through it.[/li][li]Spike. Well. Who didn’t see that coming, really? Honestly, I suppose I didn’t… I thought he would just be mortal again. Still, I’m glad for it. I haven’t gotten all the way through season 5 yet, but if anyone could make me happier for Buffy it would be a decent Spike. Angel was just a friggin’ whiner, sorry to say, and not that great of an actor, either.[/li][li]Buffy. Yadda yadda yadda, realizations. As much as the show is supposed to be about Buffy, I’ve always thought of her more as a Seinfeld: the point around which the action happens, not much of a focus. Well, I guess that’s a little harsh. There’s been some episodes where I really felt for Buffy. Season One finale, for one, and Season (?) where she sends Angel to hell. But otherwise, yeah. She’s just this Slayer, you know? (shameless Zaphod reference) And I could have used a pun or two. She is good with the pun delivery.[/li][li]Dawn. yawn She looks good with a sword, though. Still wanna see what this “key” business is all about. But, to tell the truth, I’m just not that interested.[/li][li]Willow. Goddess, second only to Dru in goddess-ness (though still my favorite character anyway, just ‘cause she gets more play). She played the character so friggin’ well. And even disregarding Giles’ mumbo magi-babble (like technobabble, only buffy-verse) I like the way she was just on a crusade until Xander brought it home to her. “Get out of the way!” Why, Willow? You’re just going to kill him anyway? Ah, next season’s Willow will hopefuly be a synthesis of the mumbling schoolgirl and the “bored now”, assertive Willow. The best a fan can get.[/ol]MAN, what a great episode! I’m never gonna get to sleep tonight.[/li]
How the hell am I gonna make it until next season???
Addendum to number 5. [If] anyone could make me happier for Buffy than Riley it would be a decent Spike.
Yeah, that’s what I wondered, too.
Spike really seems to be walking in Angel’s footsteps.
I’m really happy for Xander. He finally got to do something important - Save The World!
I was right! I was right! I just knew that Spike’s quest was for his mortality, and I was right!
[SUB]Sorry, it’s just that this is the first time I’ve correctly predicted something in the Buffyverse… [/SUB]
One thing kinda bothered me… well, two, actually. All of this seemed to happen over, what, two-to-three days? How’d Spike get over to what was apparently Africa, and go through those trials in that amount of time? Also, how the HECK did Xander know where Willow was going to be? As far as I can remember, nobody ever told him.
Still, maybe Xander will stop being “Everybody’s Butt-Monkey” for real this time.
Spike’s quest wasn’t for his soul. He wanted the chip out of his head so he could kill Buffy once and for all, but he failed to specify when he made his “like I was before” request to the Shadowy Demon and poof he became a big fluffy puppy with bad teeth.
Damn you Joss! Damn you and your monkey paw!
Xander was standing above the hole when Anya showed up and told Buffy. He heard the whole tihng, than hightailed it where Willow was.
As far as Spike goes…I don’t know. I can speculate…perhaps the Demon slowed time down for Spike. Who knows?
I really liked this episode…I’m still trying to collect my thoughts.
It was, um, OK. Some very nice moments to be sure, especially Giles’ return, Spike’s commentary on the tests, and the Anya/Xander interaction. And of course Xander saving the world, but that was pretty predictable based on his earlier feelings that he was useless. Still, handled very well.
But, pretty much everything with Willow left me cold. I really hate the end-of-the-world, super-powerful, amaze-o wonder witch thing. Of course she wasn’t going to end the world, somehow her humanity would re-assert itself. I guess I’m sick of that sort of plotline. Destroy the world by channeling power through the effigy on a demonic church that was destroyed in the earthquake of 1932? Pu-leeze.
Let’s hope the Magic Box will finally shut down. How many times has it been destroyed now? Maybe Dawn will finally become a character, that was promising. Xander and Anya, I still have hope for their relationship and that’s one of my favorite parts of the show. Giles, it’s amazing how much I missed his presence, the show is much better with him around. Probably just a one-shot unfortunately. And how much handwringing will Willow have to go through. Everyone pretty much gave her killing the fist geek, but drew the line at the other two. Never mind all the pain and suffering she caused her friends, the cops, and anyone else who got in the way.
And finally Spike. I can honestly say they really saved this plotline and made me interested to watch next season. Finally, I’ll be looking forward to see what happens with Buffy and Spike. Up til now it was not very interesting, now it promises to actually mean something.
I’ll give it a 6. A solid effort, hampered by a lame major plotline.
I have to disagree. It’s already been established that Spikey has the ability to hurt the Slayer. So why would he need the chip removed to kill her?
It seems more likely that’s Spike’s intention was to have his soul restored. Remember that at no time did Spike ever say anything about wanting to kill & destroy again. All he said was that he wanted to “be like he was before” in order to “give Buffy what she deserves”. Now looking back at all of Spike’s dialog in the previous few episodes in light of his soul restoral, it makes sense. Spike has been madly in love with Buffy & this is the only way he thinks he can attain her love.
Now for my questions on this excellent episode:
[ul][li]How did Buffy know to go to Rack’s pad? And how did she find the entrance?[/li][li]Xander was looking for rope to pull out Dawn & Buffy…so why did he end up at the Satanic Chapel?[/li][li]Was that really Michael Jordan playing the role of one of the Sunnydale cops?[/li][/ul]
Yeah, you’re right about how he can hurt her. He just kept repeating all that stuff about “what she’s done to me” and “I can’t be a monster and she won’t let me be a man.” That leads me to believe that the chip is very much tangled up with the love/hate thing he has going with Buffy. Maybe he wanted the demon to take it out so he could channel his Buffy-loving energy into terrorizing humans again, thus doing something to really piss Buffy off and make their relationship something familiar and defineable. I think he went to the demon hoping to become fully a monster again, but the demon went the other way on his request and made him a man.
My thought? Spike is next year’s Big Bad. He can hurt Buffy – but now he has a soul, so can she hurt him? She only killed Angel to save the world… can she kill a soul-full Spike? He can hurt her…
I had a final tonight, during Buffy. Terrible dilemma: final or finale. <rimshot>
Just watched the tape, and wow. Giles coming back was awesome. Since next season is the apparently going to be the last season, I hope he sticks around. Maybe that’s why Ripper has been put on the back burner.
So, uh, how many times did Buffy lose consciousness in this episode? Thirty? Forty? She’s like a weeble.
About Spike: I wonder if he originally went there intending to get the chip out, and changed his mind while fighting for his life in the test. In the beginning of the episode, he sounds spiteful when he talks about what he wants. At the end, he sounds more… I dunno, wistful? Resigned? I think Spike’s been in denial about how evil he really is, which is why he’s been so ineffective. He tries to do evil, but his heart isn’t in it. Or maybe I’m just reading to much into all this.
My only real criticism is the temple thing. Why throw in another doomsday device, when the Hellmouth is right there? Plus, you get extra bonus poignancy points, because it’s in their old high school, a scene from their innocent youths. Other than that, all aces.
I have to disagree that Spike is now like Angel- a vampire with a soul. The demon agreed to made him “like he was before,” right? He never had a soul as a vampire. The last time he had a soul was when he was mortal, so now he is one again. I don’t think that’s what Spike had in mind, but now he’s no longer in no man’s land between monster and man…I think his new mortality will be a major issue for him the beginning of next season.
I am sort of sad that Tara is gone, but…she was my least favorite Scooby. Last week, while Willow was raging to “bring her back” I was hoping she’d add " with a personality this time."Maybe I’m still a little bitter that things never worked out between Willow and Xander, though I’ve grown to like Anya a lot.
How is “The Ripper” (or “The watcher” whichever is the actual title) going? If it isn’t successful, do you suppose Giles will be back for next season as a regular, again? I sort of got the impression from him saying that he wished he’d never left that he might be back for good.
I can’t wait for next season.
Hm. I’m surprised nobody mentioned it before, but in either case with Spike - souled vamp or plain dude - I think it would be appropriate to start calling him William more often. Sorta like the difference between Angel and Angelus. Buffy has called him William in the past, too.
Eck, anyway, yes. Fantastic. End-of-the-world stuff is getting annoying, but still an excellent installment. Everyone did something important.
I wish I could watch it again tonight. 
Willow mocking Dawn was priceless. ::sniff::
Put my name on the list under “Spike is still a vampire” category. Buffy kept rejecting him because she said he didn’t have a soul. Well, now he does. A vampire with a soul is just as good as a man, acc. to Buffylogic.
Sooo good to see Giles. Like others, I wish he’d stick around or at least have more cameos.
I’m getting a sneaking feeling that they’re setting up Dawn for a spin-off. The Scoobies are aging rapidly and they need someone young to draw in the younger audience. It was good to see her take action and smile once in awhile. In fact, it was good to see Buffy smile, too.
Wonder how they’ll all heal their relationships next year. How do you forgive someone after they are so hurtful? The last time someone called me an annoying ball of energy…
Was thinking that Tara’s fetch would come back from the dead to stop Willow. But in retrospect it had to be the hapless, mortal Xander.
Entertaining show. Hope next season follows suit and remembers how to laugh at itself.
I felt let down only because Xander is, and has been for two or three seasons, my least favorite character on the show. His characterization has been such that he had not earned the right to play that role in this drama.
If anything, he’s treated his friends like crap all season, and he almost never gets called on the carpet for him. And his behavior towards Anya since he left her at the altar has been atrocious–what, you wanted her to sit there and pine for you? Grow up.
More importantly, assuming that “Once More, With Feeling” is part of continuity (and I have no reason to assume it isn’t), Xander summoned a demon “just to see what would happen” that resulted in the deaths of several Sunnydale residents, and he has never been made to account for it! Buffy has always insisted that humans in Sunnydale be accountable when they’ve called on dark powers that – intentionally or not – caused human suffering. Why should Xander get off all easy?
And is Willow going to have to account to the authorities for murdering Warren? Whether he deserved it or not isn’t the question. Buffy and Angel insisted that Faith be answerable for her murders; is Buffy going to let Willow off easy, too?
Giles was totally badass here, like he was when he killed Ben last season. Almost as good as Yoda in AOTC. 
I have to totally agree with the above. Spike went there to get his chip removed-he had been blabbing the previous episodes that he couldn’t think right with it.
I definately don’t think he will be Angel part two-it doesn’t make any sense as far as the “like he was before”, not to mention if he was another vampire with a soul it would totally F%#K up Angel because of the prophecies that say “vampire with a soul”.
So to sum up: Spike didn’t go there for a soul.
Spike is no longer Spike-he is William.
William=Human.
Willow (Allyson Hannigan) is HOT.
Of course this is all my opinion. Except for the the last one. It is established fact.
Very good episode overall.
The only thing I had a problem with was the Stupid Dialogue Tricks they were playing with Spike. We must make him talk about “getting what he wants” in a manner that sounds like he’s talking about getting the chip out, but avoids saying so at all costs. At this point I knew he was going for what’s behind curtain #2. (Actually I knew before hand, buit it’s still damn annoying).
I have to say, I really liked Anya this episode. For someone who’s gone back to being a demon, she sure is fighting strong for the good side. And she was so sweet with Giles. I’ve really got my fingers crossed for her.
Didn’t earn the right to save the world from his best friend? He didn’t go there to save the world, IMO. His life went to shit, he realized the stupid things he did, and now his best friend was hell bent on destruction. “Just kill me, Willow. You owe me that much.” Or something.