Can they fire me for this?

Ok, this is going to be pretty long, and sometimes I get a bit ahead of myself which leads to unorganized long-posts, so please ask for clarification if I fail to provide it at any certain point.
Ok, the players:

Cisco (that’s me!)
Bob (a good friend of mine for roughly 6 years)
Tom (Boss and friend for the last 3 and a half years)
Tweedle Dee and Tweedle Dum (lesser bosses (managers))
Cow-orkers

Note that all names except my own have been changed.
Ok, Tom is the owner of the company I worked at for the last three and a half years. A small resturant franchise, about 15 stores. Bob, as you know, is a friend of mine. About a year ago Bob decided to go into business for himself and bought one of these stores. He and Tom were previously friends but Tom basically started screwing him from the start, and it just got worse. To simplify things, the situation has started coming to a head as of late and Bob wants out. Tom has begun telling everyone that Bob is a theif and he has been stealing…etc, etc.

About 2 weeks or so ago, two cow-orkers were discussing the situation and going on and on about what a theif Bob was and, since we were the only three people in the store, I decided to throw my 2 cents in. I basically said
“Hey, wait, Bob is my friend, and he is supposed to be your friend too, and I don’t really think you should be talking about him like that, especially since you have no idea what you’re talking about. And now that you mention it, have you ever noticed that every single one of Tom’s business partners turns out to be a ‘Theif’?” I continued, “We’ll probably never know 100% of the truth from either side but I’m personally inclined to believe Bob over Tom” and that was the end of it.

Fast forward to the Sunday after Thanksgiving (one week ago today), I had been on vacation since Wednesday (had family in town, hadn’t had any time off in a really long time) so I called work to check in and see when I had to be back in. My friend on the phone immediately told me “I’m going to give you the heads up on something. Tom heard about all that stuff you were saying.”
My reaction was basically “Oh, whatever. When do I have to be back to work?”
He went back to check the schedule and came back and told me I wasn’t on it, and the reason was that Tom was extremely mad about “all that stuff I said.”
This is after three and a half years of loyal, hard work. I have called in sick twice in three and a half years. I have never declined to come in when they needed someone on my day off, and I have consistently picked up extra responsibilities just because I cared.

Every single person I have related this story to has basically said “They can’t fire you for that.” Well, can they? Any facts or details or elaborations would be greatly appreciated.

And now, I have another little problem. I don’t really want my job back (although I desperately need a paycheck from somewhere) because I’m trying to use this “opportunity” to get a job at a large software company, but Tweedle Dum was one of my references on my resume (which I submitted a few days before I found out about this.) He has always been a really good friend, but I found out from Tweedle Dee, that due to his overwhelming loyalty to Tom, he now hates me. What can he tell them when they call for a reference? Should I update my resume and say I got fired?

Sorry this was so long and unorganized and thank you for reading this far. Thanks in advance if anyone has any answers.

From the North Carolina Department of Labor:

Thanks Ringo.

So there’s no “freedom of speech” act where you’re garunteed not to to get fired for something your boss heard secondhand, huh? Oh well, what about part 2 of the question concerning Tweedle Dum?

First, two things.

  1. I’m not a lawyer, and maybe you should talk to one.
  2. My answer won’t have much to do with the fairness and/or ethics of your boss’s actions.

In many states, and probably yours, YES, he can fire you for any reason that strikes his fancy. “Employment at will” is the operative phrase, and it means the employer can terminate your job any time and for any reason. It doesn’t have to be a good reason. He can fire you because you like a certain sports team, or because of the way you spell thief. He has that right under the law. Now, if you have a contract, you may be protected. If you can demonstrate you were let go because of gender, race, or religion, you might have a case. Otherwise, you may be Simply Outa Luck.

However,…you haven’t heard from the boss yet. Go check with him in person. Your pal who phoned you may have been mistaken, or perhaps jumping to conclusions based on incomplete information.

–Nott, the large

I’m not a lawyer either, but

  1. Yes, he can fire you, and
  2. Tom sounds like a butthead, but
  3. I would suggest trying to talk to both Tom and Tweedle Dum in person to find out what is actually going on as well as making sure whatever they’ve heard reflects whatever you really said. Maybe the situation can be salvaged.

It’s been my experience that unless you either fall into a protected category or have lots of money to spend, it’s not likely that a lawyer is going to be interested. If you are going to be fired anyway, make them fire you, DON’T quit, so you can at least get unemployment to tide you over.

Would Tweedle Dee give you a reference?

Tweedle Dee is probably my best bet for a reference but, like I said, I’ve already turned in my resume. As for unemployment…I really don’t want to be on it but what if it’s going to be 2 or 3 weeks until I get another job? Can I be on it for 2 or 3 weeks (note that I wasn’t full time, only about 30-35 hours per week)? How much will they pay me?

And yes, Tom is a butthead/lowlife/used car salesman/fast talker/con-man.

First of all, “Tom” sounds like a douchebag and yes he can fire you for pretty much anything. If nothing else you can be fired for “not being a good fit”.

Second…You don’t really know whats going on with Tom and Bob either

And finally…there aren’t any real “friends” at work. You may have some “work friends” who you gab around the water cooler withor go to happy hours with but I certainly wouldn’t badmouth the boss to any of them.

Assuming you have been fired, I’ll reiterate what others have said: You can be fired under the circumstances you stated.

But as for your question #2: Your resume should not include reasons for leaving a position in the first place. But if the one you submitted did, IMHO*, I would wait until they call you for an interview. HR depts. receive way too many resumes to check the accuracy or references of any of them other than the ones they select for interviews. So before that is done, you would likely first get a call from them notifying you that they are interested. The interview would be a better time to explain the situation.

To be honest, an applicant’s disagreements with past management are often a red flag for many recruiters/HR Depts. They will often see this as a sign of not being a “team player” or being disruptive, so you should be carefull not to speak negatively of any past employer and should explain the situation in the fairest possible way.

However, the above is nowhere near as bad as not being truthfull about what happened. Asking for a reference to be replaced shouldn’t be much of a problem.

Of course, this all depends on the type of people in their HR Dept. I once had a guy confess a drug conviction for possesion of methamphetamines! He explained what happened and since it wasn’t (IMO) relevant to the position (Firmware Engineer), it didn’t count against him. Ironically, he did not get the job because of a fear he wouldn’t be a team player and for bad-mouthing a previous employer.
*Speaking from my experience as an in-house recruiter and HR dept personnel for tech companies.

I’m afraid I don’t know much about unemployment, having never had to use it myself, but you can probably get answers from NC Dept. of Labor. All I know is you can’t get unemployment if you quit, because that happened to a friend of mine that allowed herself to get aggravated into quitting. I think unemployment is only something like 30% of your base pay. But it’s better than nothing.

If you’ve given Tweedle Dum’s name as a reference already, he can say anything he wants to. If you hadn’t given his name, and he is a manager, he can only confirm or deny the fact of your employment status (at least in Texas). Hopefully you can salvage that particular relationship.

Good luck!

Sorry…but you really screwed the pooch by offering your opinion in that situation. I too, have been burned in the past by opening my yap at the wrong time/place/situation, but it’s difficult for to see a skewed perspective not to want to “set things straight” which of course invariably tips you into the 'gator pit .

Anyway… legalities are sort of beside the point at this juncture, as you have the stigma of being a dis-loyal SOB and your days are most likely numbered in your current employment. You should hurry up with your exit strategy and vow to yourself to be more circumspect in the future.

I never said I did. I specifically said “We’ll probably never know 100% of the truth from either side, but I tend to believe Bob over Tom.”

[quote]
there aren’t any real “friends” at work. You may have some “work friends” who you gab around the water cooler withor go to happy hours with but I certainly wouldn’t badmouth the boss to any of them.

[quote]

These are guy that I knew for years before I worked with them but…lesson learned.

Oh, and AskNott: LOL. I don’t know how I did that twice in one post but clever way of point it out :slight_smile:

Ths answers no queston you pose, but when are you appearing as the star witness in Bob’s slander suit against Tom? :smiley:

[sub]I’m not a lawyer and of course such a civil suit would probably need Bob to show actual damages to be particularly effective?[/sub]

AmbushBug