We forgave the Germans.
While they still fought?
Did we forgive the ones that never atoned, that never quit spewing hatred?
…And then we were friends
Though they murdered six million
In the ovens they fried
The Germans now, too
Have God on their side
Trump had no real ideology. He threw out a bunch of idiotic ideas and when they resonated with the crowds he repeated them. The positions he takes are the fault of his voters. He is not Hitler, or Stalin, or Mao, he is a giant mirror that reflects the views of his supporters. Fuck every last one of them.
No, it doesn’t. I’m not anti-conservative. In fact, I think that a well functioning society needs both liberals and conservatives. However, in my view, Republicans are no longer rationally conservative. So, in my mind, any rational conservative should not be supporting neither the Republicans nor Donald Trump. In the midterms, the best thing any conservative could have done would be to contact their local representatives (Congress and/or Senate) and tell them, I’m a Republican voter and I’m not voting Republican again until you normalize the party and get rid of the extremism. So, to sum up, I absolutely think somebody can be both right-wing/conservative* and rational, and such a person should not be supporting Donald Trump is they care about their country.
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- From a Canadian political perspective, I am slightly conservative. Although, with the conservative movement pushing further right at the moment, I’m sure if I were to take such a test again I would come up as slightly liberal as the center for Canadian politics has likely shifted.
Do the Japanese have statues to their WWII generals? Do the Germans have swastikas on their state flags?
Nixon declared war on his enemies. By which I mean us, anybody who wasn’t a Nixonite. Sound familiar?
No, I’ve never forgiven him or the Silent Majority that actively aided and abetted him and are the progenitors of today’s Trumpettes.
We lost that last battle. But we seem to be learning some lessons about how to fight this one.
If by “Forgiveness,” we mean we forswear recompense from or punishment of the offender, then I suppose we must. I deeply wish that every liar, conspiracy theorist, Alex Jones listener, racist, hypocrite, and Trump voter could be punished for it. But that’s not possible.
I won’t forget, though. I absolutely will not forget.
Let’s not put all the focus on Trump; let’s recognize that Trumpists were Trumpian before Trump even arrived as a major player on the political scene. He tapped into what was already there. Maybe instead of Trumpists we should call them Foxists. I think it’s a generation of Fox News propaganda that paved the way for a right wing populist like Trump.
What’s different if you forgive a Trump supporter vs. not forgiving him or her?
Regards,
Shodan
BeepKillBeep:
So, a rational conservative should support candidates who will appoint liberal judges and justices? (Just one example of how it makes sense for them to continue to support Trump but probably the biggest.)
Never forgive, never forget. Harry, harass and harangue them unto the third generation. Let them all be sent swordless to Palestine.
Vendetta doesn’t even begin to cover it.
The same difference it makes if you forgive anyone else, I guess.
What difference does it make to you when you forgive others?
Since this is not one of Mr. Zimmerman’s more famous songs, I’ll link to YouTubes for the Generation X’ers and Y’ers. Joan sings that stanza. And so does Bob himself.
Yes, in my opinion, given what Trump and the Republicans currently represent. Making a political choice is always going to be about balancing wanting something and having to give up something else to get it. I don’t think there is anyway to rationalize away just how awful what the Trump and Republicans currently represent. Now, of course, some people might believe otherwise, but as I said in my first post in the thread, this is where I do not understand his current support from any rational conservative. To me, if a person cares about the country as a whole, then they cannot support Trump and the Republicans as they are right now. Now, without question, there are single (or few) issue conservatives (and liberals of course but we’re talking about conservatives) for whom their issue is simply worth any cost. I do not consider this to be a rational stance. There has to be some cost that makes temporarily losing, as your example, the judiciary worthwhile. Trump and the Republicans have, in my opinion, clearly crossed that line and are waving it goodbye as it crosses over the horizon.
I would love it, if a rational conservative could explain to me how Trumpism is worth any single (or few) conservative issue(s)?
Missed edit window. As an example, let’s take the SCOTUS. What is the fear here with respect to losing control of the court? What is it that a rational conservative fears is going to realistically happen? Alternatively, what recent rulings have been so abhorent from the SCOTUS that mandates having control of it at any cost?
Your post’s repeated abuse of the word “rational” gives me little hope that you’re actually willing to listen to your political opponents and consider their viewpoints, but anyways …
Conservatives dislike all sorts of SCOTUS rulings: Roe, Obergefell, King v. Burwell, etc.
I don’t know of any conservatives that argue that we must have control of it “at any cost”, I think that’s probably a figment of your overactive imagination, but it’s certainly a priority for conservatives, as it is for liberals, precisely because it has the power to make sweeping rulings that affect broad swaths of society.
You obviously perceive the “cost” of a Trump administration as much higher than many conservatives do. Perhaps you should start there, trying to convince more of us that the “cost” is high. So far we’ve got an economy that’s humming along, ultra-low unemployment, ISIS is largely defeated, etc. What’s the “cost” I should be concerned with? That President Trump and Acosta occasionally have spats?
I’ll think about forgiving them if they ask us to forgive them. I don’t really think that’s ever going to happen.
It is things like (along with your posting history in general) this which prevent me from considering you to be a rational conservative. Sorry.
Apology not necessary because I don’t consider your posts to be rational either. 