What does that have to do with your previous statement, “The very idea that traits are passed on by genetics, not culture, not upbringing, but something in the very nature of humankind, in the code, is a real problem.”?
Hmm. Let’s assume each gene is a straight 50% up-or-down expression. For a person with parents A and B, they’ll have a 50% chance of expressing the A or the B group, 10 times over.
So, 1023/1024 times, the hybrid will express an IQ of X. 1/1024 times, the hybrid will express XXX.
So, (1023/1024) + (3/1024). Or, 1.002 Xs expressed IQ for the hybrid group, in the case of a 50% admixture between A and B, functionally indistinguishable from group B by any test social science can muster.
Which is my point. I don’t think this toy model with this set of genes is anything close to accurate, but because genes don’t interact addatively or linearly, the above study proved a heck of a lot less than some people thought it did.
It’s a huge “problem”, in that we both know that so many things are absolutely a matter of inheritance. Nobody argues about the obvious and well known things. The science involved in the fox breeding is fascinating, because while they were going for one thing, they found all these other traits are connected to the genes that they were selecting for. And being scientific about it, they know it’s absolutely not a matter of upbringing, you can’t make a tame fox into an aggressive one, and you can’t make a mean one gentle. It’s in the genes.
We know so little about these foxes, but the lesson is pretty obvious. Natural, or un-natural selection is a real thing. We know this extensively with all kinds of animals. There is no doubt about genetics being a major factor, in intelligence as well as all kinds of other traits. Ancient beliefs, religions and myths about humans are absolutely rooted in these concepts as well. To try and sweep it all aside as racism is to not only throw the baby out with the bathwater, it’s to insist the babies parents don’t matter as well.
It’s a real problem because while for every last creature and plant we know genetics is usually the most important factor. But when it comes to people, we want to pretend it has no effect at all, in regards to things that we consider human traits. In essence, humans are excluded from what we know about all other living things.
He’s misrepresenting what he wrote in the article in response to the criticism he received. (Carefully read his third and fourth paragraphs.)
But even in his revised version he falls short in 1) attacking a strawman, i.e. the notion that the entire measured gap is due to genetics (I should note that he also did this a lot in his original article too, though I forgot to mention it initially) and 2) ignoring that children of immigrants have acculturation advantages over their parents which tend to offset the regression to the mean.
So IOW there are indeed advantages that are not genetic. I think the overall point stands and it has to be noted that the strawman you are talking about came from the infamous Bell Curve book.
Non-racist: You know, we really are still learning how genes interact with all the non-genetic factors with regards to intelligence. And we don’t really have a good definition of intelligence yet. And we haven’t found any clear way to map genes to social constructs of race. So, we can’t make definitive statements about how genetic factors related to intelligence break down on socially constructed racial lines.
Racist: Why are you claiming that everybody has the exact same traits? Why are you claiming that genes don’t influence intelligence?
Non-racist: Um, I didn’t actually claim any of those things.
Racist: Why are you claiming that everybody has the exact same traits? Why are you claiming that genes don’t influence intelligence?
Non-racist: No, see, I didn’t claim any of those things. You just keep repeating that stuff as if I claimed it.
Racist: Why are you claiming that everybody has the exact same traits? Why are you claiming that genes don’t influence intelligence?
Repeat ad-naseum.
Except maybe for FXMastermind. I can’t really tell what his position is, since he refused to answer my questions, so I’ll just put his posts off to the side.
I would add: therefore, when people make statements about racial groups, like blacks are dumber than whites, but they’re better at Jazz, we find those statements racist. When there’s a pernicious history of racist posts, we find the poster racist as well.
Good times. Which is why we’re in the Pit, and we can just call bullshit.
He’s just stirring the pot. Troll, in other words.
This seems to me to be part of the methodology of allowing non-blatant racists to post their stuff and be subjected to mockery and ridicule in order to demonstrate their failings to participants and, more importantly, readers.
This is something that I think has been present from the beginning of the board or came about during its early years. The point, aside from what I said above, is that it fosters conversation and discussion in areas such as this if you have people on the other side, so long as they don’t reveal themselves to be too vile.
Conversation and discussion is, of course, the lifeblood of message boards, with manageable hot-button issues an extremely important constituent. Thus, as long as trolls, racists, et al don’t get too nasty (and have a relatively thick skin), they are, well, I certainly don’t want to say welcome. Perhaps “needed” is a more accurate term.
Reading your posts is like peering into the mind of a foul mouthed retard. Fascinating and scary at the same time. Probably the best argument for eugenics is the slim hope that science, even imperfect, can weed out of humanity that which plagues you.
In your language “fuck dim IQ racist racist racist slobber.” I ought to make a Brightnshiny post generator. A database of 20 words and an RNG shouldn’t be hard to cobble together.
You don’t even know the words you use. That’s the sad thing.
Whatever, you lying, racist sack of crap. It’s pretty clear that you didn’t read the entire thread before you posted. But if a racist like you wants to cry about my posts, so much the better. Evil assholes like you deserved to be called out on your racist bullshit.
You are a pig-ignorant, racist asshole who doesn’t know the first thing about genetics. You are a lying, racist piece of shit. And you deserve all the invective that is hurled at you.
