I wuz just wonderen what ya’ll thought of this group…last I heard it was still being run by Pat Robertson…How effective do you think they are? BTW, do you agree with McCain’s philosophy that they have too much influence in the GOP?
ETERNITY: SMOKING OR NON SMOKING?
Itchy the flea-filled beagle hound.
If their influence wasn’t in the GOP it would be in the Democrats. The thing that is more important to watch for with these narrow minded folk is local school boards. They get elected running on traditional platforms, and the next thing you know, they want Creationism put in science text books.
“And so he says to me ‘I don’t like the cut of your jib’. And I go, I says, ‘but it’s the only jib I’ve got baby’.”
Adam said:
Huh? Lost me there.
Anyway, to answer the OP, yes they have too much influence. They are the “squeaky wheel” and they get greased far too often in comparison with their numbers. They have been having money problems and have lost some battles with the IRS, but I would never count them out. Groups like this have a way of always bouncing back, like some pesticide-resistant insect.
freind jenkinsfan,
first, let me welcome you to the sdmb. i have enjoyed your posts elswhere.
you topic: the christian coalition does have more power on our national politics than i am comfortable with. it seems to me that on the local level, the support they give to grass roots candidates (county board, school boards ect.)is part of a long range christianization effort. i think their ultimate goal is to make our country a theocracy.
Trust the dreams, for in them is hidden the gate to eternity -Kahlil Gibran
I thought Pat Robertson had left the Christian Coalition, which was now headed by someone else. Gary Bauer?
Ooops, looks like Rat Pobertson is still the Prez at the Christian Coalition.
http://cc.org/messages/pat1.html
Quite an extensive site.
Hopefully, I can convince you to accept “hopefully” as a disjunct adverb.
Frankly, I would be lying if I said I were confident.
Perhaps this subject is simply too complex for me to explain.
Unfortunately, I would be lucky to explain my way out of a paper bag.
I knew when I read the title of this thread I’d be sure to find the usual anti-theistic vitriol normally spewed herein.
You folks are entirely TOO predictable.
::
Right, and the Christian Coalition never ceases to amaze us with their open-mindedness and willingness to change.
BTW, Boomer, did you mean “anti-theistic” or “anti-theocratic”?
I’m new here so I don’t know quite what to expect. Please be gentle with me.
The Christian Coalition has the right to preach, pray, congregate, sing, dance, and play bingo as much as they wish within their organization. And I will be the first one to respect their wish to do so.
The problem is, by becoming politically active, they loose my respect completely.
If it were not for the CC I would be Republican all the way.
As it is, I am forced to choose the lesser of two evils.
The reason? I just find too many of my liberties stepped upon.
antitheist \An`ti*the"ist, n. A disbeliever in the existence of Godthe·oc·ra·cy (th-kr-s)
n., pl. the·oc·ra·cies.
A government ruled by or subject to religious authority.
A state so governed.
Hmmmmmm. I mean antitheistic. But your comment is not lost on me. I think you may be a theophobe.
::
I, myself am a Rudyphobe, or possibly a Vanessaphobe. (Especially considering USA Tv’s “The Expendables”. . . . very disturbing)
Seriously though, why should the single largest religious denomination in the United States need a lobbying organization? The Christian voters should probably have no problem getting their message across to the House and Senate, right?
When the CC “invaded” the GOP, conservatism became synonimuos with religious fundamentalism.
Why does one have to be religious to be conservative.
I’m not liberal, I’m not religious hence I am not conservative. What am I?
Liberal-Conservative? (Bleeding heart Conservative…just doesn’t sound right).
Conservative-Liberal? (Capitalist-Liberal…as if).
Let’s face it I’ve become Neutral like Switzerland.
The biggest problem with the Christian Coalition and other like-minded radical right-wing Christian groups (other than they’re weaklings and their God is a damn liar) is that they have made it impossible for a Republican of national stature to avoid being a complete whore. Look at John McCain. How many years of a “conservative” record does he have? He’s more “conservative” and has done more to advance “conservative” positions than Dubya would ever dream of being or doing. What killed his campaign, truly killed it, struck the mortal blow? He called Robertson and Falwell out for the bastards they are. No national Republican candidate can get nominated without pandering to this fringe of the party, then once they secure the nomination they scurry back towards the center, because they can’t win appealing solely or even mainly to the radical fringe. And the amazing thing is, we fall for it every time! Do we really think politicians change their views that often and that quickly? Of course not! They say what the particular constituency they’re addressing wants to hear, then forgets it as soon as they’re no longer needed. Look again at McCain. He’s reversed his public position on the South Carolina flag issue. Why? “I feared that if I answered honestly I could not win the South Carolina primary.”
Which is not to say that the CC is the only group which is pandered to or the Repubs are the only ones who pander. I can’t offhand, though, think of a single group to which the Democrats prostitute themselves to anything approaching the degree of the Repubs spreading them for the CC.
CalifBoomer said:
And, as usual, you’re wrong. We are against the CC not because they’re Christians, but because they are trying to impose their religion on the rest of us. I’d be just as against a Satanic Coalition doing the same thing, or a Jewish Coalition, Muslim Coalition, Wiccan Coalition, etc.
Please show any “anti-theistic vitriol” posted in this thread before you posted your claim. Or admit you were wrong.
Boris, if memory serves, Pat turned over directorship of the CC to somebody else (whose name escapes me, but it wasn’t Gary Bauer – he’s with the Family Research Council or something like that). That guy ran it quite well, and then decided to go out on his own as a political consultant. So it went to somebody who didn’t do as good a job. There may have been one more not-so-good director, and then Pat took over the direct control again.
Randy Tate and Don Hodel ran the joint for a while after Ralph Reed left, I think Tate was the front-man in DC, and Hodel actually ran day-to-day. Roberta Combs, from the South Carolina group, is now Executive Director, and reports directly to Pat.
When things get really weird, the weird turn pro. H.S. Thompson
I don’t know where anyone got the idea that religon has nothing to do with politics. EVERYTHING has something to do with politics, at least in this country it does. Just because you’d like to keep these things separate doesn’t make it so.
Needs2know
Otto said:
First: For the record, I’m a conservative Republican who has no interest in the agenda of the Christian Coalition and actively opposes much of what they say.
But, Otto, you can’t blame the CC for McCain’s defeat. McCain lost for two reasons:
1.) Not enough money. W had plenty of money to spend on ads and photo ops, and had been acclaimed as ‘front runner’ partially for the fact that he had raised so much money (which, interestingly, made it even easier for him to raise even more money).
2.) Not enough message. Or at least not enough conservative message. McCain went out and campaigned largely on campaign finance reform, and his stance on the issue is heavily opposed by most conservatives.
McCain’s candidacy was completely buoyed by the combination of a liberal/reformsit stance on campaign finance reform and an open primary system. Among Republicans, Bush handily and easily beat McCain in every primary. But adding Democrat and independent supporters of McCain into the primary allowed McCain to win a few primaries and seem like a viable candidate.
Yes, McCain ‘broke’ with the CC by attacking them just before Super Tuesday. But his break with the CC wasn’t what buried him; what buried him was that nearly all of the primaries on Super Tuesday were closed primaries, and because McCain focused so heavily on promoting the liberal parts of his ideology, he never convinced regular Republicans that he would be nearly as good a representative of their views as Bush was. McCain lost most of those primaries because they were closed, and his major support (independents and Democrats) weren’t allowed to vote.
I despise the CC, but I don’t think that you can blame them for McCain’s failure.
JMCJ
“Y’know, I would invite y’all to go feltch a dead goat, but that would be abuse of a perfectly good dead goat and an insult to all those who engage in that practice for fun.” -weirddave, set to maximum flame
You’ve got a point, Needs. It’s not like Democrats distance themselves from any religions whatsoever.
Still, the CC is arguably the largest and best-funded religious lobby group in the country, heads and shoulders above the rest. It’s not a matter of them just simply getting involved (recommending candidates, lobbying for their ideas, whatever), but I think the OP goes further and asks, are they TOO involved; that is, OVERinfluencing politics, specifically the Republican party?
I’d say yes.
Esprix
Evidently, I rock.
Ask the Gay Guy!
Esprix says:
Hmmm. I have to disagree that they’re OVERinfluencing politics.
The CC has a proven track record for the past twenty years of being able to raise lots of money and bring out lots of votes for candidates it supports. Therefore, they’re very influential.
By that same token, labor unions have been able to raise a lot of votes and guarantee a lot of votes for Democrats. Would you consider labor unions as OVERinfluential?
If what you mean is that you dislike the amount of influence the CC has, I can understand and agree with you. I don’t like their agenda either, and I’m annoyed by how much power they can wield to enact that agenda.
But I don’t think the CC shows a disproportional influence over politics when compared to the amount of money and voters they can raise.
JMCJ
“Y’know, I would invite y’all to go feltch a dead goat, but that would be abuse of a perfectly good dead goat and an insult to all those who engage in that practice for fun.” -weirddave, set to maximum flame