Cities Without Snow Plows

Factual Questions
21

Around here, the schools and most businesses close, and the city goes out and dumps sand on the bridges. I can only think of once in the last 30 years that the ice/snow hadn’t melted by that same evening - it doesn’t stay below freezing very long around here.

Most southerners could probably drive in the snow, but are not prepared for it. Usually, snow means the roads and bridges around here get a pretty good glaze of ice - the snow itself doesn’t accumulate directly on the asphalt. Driving on ice is nothing like driving on snow. Driving on snow doesn’t compare to driving on gravel roads, because there aren’t 100 other cars on a gravel road going every speed from 10-65 all around you. When we get the snow and ice, the traffic report is a long list of accidents.

Since it’ll be gone in 6-8 hours anyway, it’s easier just to shut down and wait it out then deal with what quickly becomes a dangerous situation.

22

Memphis, to my knowledge, does not have snow plows.

But we probably have plenty of backhoes and front-end loaders.

No one wanted to do anything today anyway, and the sun came out and cleaned up the streets pretty quickly.

The kids are having a great day, and that is super!

.

23

In South Carolina, you panic. Then the sun comes out.

Seriously, everything shuts down - hospital workers are stuck there, the rest of us are stuck at home. There are no plows and never a need for them, as the snow that has shut the city down is at the absolute most, in my lifetime, five inches. Usually much, much less.

ETA - a few years ago we got, like, two inches of accumulation. Businesses let everybody go at 2, and it took people six hours to make it home. Since then they have developed a staggered release plan but we haven’t really needed it. An inch of snow is extremely serious here.

24

Back in about 1990 I was in Sylmar California on business for a week. One afternoon (I think it may have been a Friday) about 1:00 pm, a storm blew in.

I guess it doesn’t snow there much at all. By 2:00 pm, they were announcing that everyone who could should go home. In another half hour the place was just about empty. I headed back to the hotel expecting to find a blizzard outside, and to my surprise found a very light snow falling and the roads barely covered.

I had no problem at all getting around, but the town seemed deserted. But I’m from Salt Lake, and I’m used to more snow than that falling off my boots on the kitchen floor. I don’t remember if I heard the schools closed, but I’m betting they did. The city basically shut down until the next morning when everything melted away.

25

[QUOTE=enipla]
I’m serious here. I know about ‘black ice’ believe me. But wouldn’t a couple of inches of snow disappear pretty quickly?
[/QUOTE]

One of the things that tends to be the problem in southern Britain is a freeze-thaw-freeze-thaw process, so that rain or a previous melting snowfall develops into patchy black ice. Have fresh snow land on that and things get nasty.

I recall an observation from a Canadian here a couple of years ago on seeing a couple of inches cause chaos, they pointed out that half the drivers were going 30mph too fast for the conditions and the other half 30mph too slow. That’s just asking for trouble.

A further issue is how much money local authorities are going to invest in having equipment stored and ready for use, if it might see no use over whole winters. They’re much happier to lower taxes or spend the money elsewhere.

And no, we don’t have gravel roads!

26

When I lived in Denver, of all places, side streets never got plowed; only the major snow routes. The city called it “solar snow removal”. If it snowed an inch, no big deal; it’s not going to tie up the city. More than a few inches, and it’ll melt in a few days.

Las Cruces, New Mexico gets about four to eight inches of snow every year. There’s a few plows, but they’re for US 70 over San Agustin Pass and the Interstates. Anyplace else … wait for it to melt in a day or two.

FWIW, snow in Buffalo is removed somewhat differently than other “winter cities”. Salt is spread on the roads before the snow falls, . After the snow accumulates a bit, the street is plowed. The brine layer underneath the snow slows the accumulation, and makes the streets easier to plow.

27

[QUOTE=elmwood]
When I lived in Denver, of all places, side streets never got plowed; only the major snow routes. The city called it “solar snow removal”. If it snowed an inch, no big deal; it’s not going to tie up the city. More than a few inches, and it’ll melt in a few days.

…
[/QUOTE]

Denver has a bit of a dilemma. I lived there for a few years. Most winters the city itself gets small amounts of snow, which melt away rapidly, but sometimes they get dumped on. If the city maintains snow removal equipment adequate for the every-few-years “hundred year blizzards”, they get castigated for wasting money on unnecessary snow plows most years. If they don’t, they get roasted for not being able to respond to the blizzard when it comes. I was there for “the blizzard that stole Christmas” in 1982 (I think they had another one in 2006). It was a major factor in mayor Bill McNichols not getting reelected. It was several days before they even got a backhoe down my residential sidestreet.

28

[QUOTE=elmwood]
<clip>

FWIW, snow in Buffalo is removed somewhat differently than other “winter cities”. Salt is spread on the roads before the snow falls, . After the snow accumulates a bit, the street is plowed. The brine layer underneath the snow slows the accumulation, and makes the streets easier to plow.
[/QUOTE]

That’s the way it’s supposed to be done in most parts of the UK also. The gritter trucks are out before the snow starts.

29

[QUOTE=PaulParkhead]
That’s the way it’s supposed to be done in most parts of the UK also. The gritter trucks are out before the snow starts.
[/QUOTE]

Trouble comes if the snow starts during rush hour, and the gritters can’t get around efficiently before traffic starts slowing down. Also I’ve heard it said that simply gritting frozen roads overnight is ineffective because most of it is knocked off to the side, and there’s a need for it to become mixed up with snow (or frost).

30

[QUOTE=Zsofia]
In South Carolina, you panic. Then the sun comes out.

Seriously, everything shuts down - hospital workers are stuck there, the rest of us are stuck at home. There are no plows and never a need for them, as the snow that has shut the city down is at the absolute most, in my lifetime, five inches. Usually much, much less.

ETA - a few years ago we got, like, two inches of accumulation. Businesses let everybody go at 2, and it took people six hours to make it home. Since then they have developed a staggered release plan but we haven’t really needed it. An inch of snow is extremely serious here.
[/QUOTE]

What she said. I remember that snowfall a few years ago - we got about 4-6 inches on the coast. It was also the same day I had to fly out of Myrtle Beach.

I’m from MA, so I just left about an hour earlier than usual for my 40 mile trek to the MB airport (I lived in Georgetown at that time), thinking "Hell, they’ve got plows, don’t they? Nuh-uh.

I had the road pretty much all to myself, thanks to the “panic” that the snow forecast had instilled on the non-snow-driving South Carolinians, but that road was covered in 5 inches of new fallen snow, with not a plow in sight. Everything was covered. Some places you couldn’t even see the curbs.

I think one of the main reasons they didn’t plow (besides the fact that they DIDN’T HAVE ANY PLOWS) was that they have those little reflectors stuck into the pavement everywhere down here, and plowing would just che those puppies up. So, I just straddled the reflector line in the center of 2 lane Rte 17, and corrected my course whenever I felt the bumpity-bump-bumping. I was in a FWD Blazer, so I made pretty good time to the airport.

I also HATE that SC doesn’t have a lot of streetlights, so I was subjected to what I call the “hyperspace effect”, caused by my headlights, being the only light around, illuminating the falling snow in front of me.

Then I walked into the airport. Guess how many snowplows MB Int’l Airport has? Nada. So of course, they CLOSED the freaking airport! All flights cancelled for the WHOLE day, even though the snow was completely GONE by 11am. I had to catch a flight out of Charleston (which only got a dusting) later that day (another 2 hour drive).

Since I didn’t go to work that day due to the flying, I later found out that of the 35 employees we had, only 2 actually showed up for work, and we had shut down until the night shift showed up at 7pm.

31

[QUOTE=Athena]
Even places that get snow every winter (I’m looking at you, Boulder) often don’t spend the money to really take care of it. <snip>
Boulder and other cities in Colorado’s front range, however, take short cuts. It generally is more treacherous to drive there in the snow, because you can’t count on the roads being properly cleared/sanded/whatever.
[/QUOTE]

I’m still appalled at the plowing (or lack thereof) here! Especially last winter, when it snowed AND stayed cold, so none of the side streets melted. We had to have chains on the ambulance for 2 solid weeks, just to get onto neighborhood streets- huge pain in the butt! It was pretty much everywhere in the metro area, too.

32

[QUOTE=NinetyWt]
I’m not sure gravel road = snowy ro{. . .}
[/QUOTE]

You were in Oxford for the great New Year’s Eve snowfall of 1963, although you probably don’t remember it. It snowed sixteen inches, and the The End Is Near nutcases were out in the town square yelling (you guessed it) The End is Near!

.

33

[QUOTE=enipla]
Sounds to me that they just call a snow day. If it’s not going to accumulate since the ground is warm, there is really no reason to plow it.

DC is probably a better example of this.

And later: It still astounds me. Can these folks drive on a gravel road? Do they no nothing about the dynamics of driving?(snip)QUOTE]

“…just call a snow day.”!!! What does that mean. In the mid south that would mean only that the schools would not be open.

DC is an example of THIS - A very few years ago two feet of snow fell on the DC/VA/MD area. MD and VA roads were plowed clean, right up to the DC border, whose roads were not. so there was a two-foot drop-off or pile in front of you at the border, depending on your travel direction.

As for the OP, in the southern part of the next state further south, they had no snow plows when they got some routine 3-inch storms and the rare 12-inch snowstorm. They used their road graders on the main roads and let nature take care of the rest. When that got enough complaints they used the graders (in December) on other roads where in September they had installed the raised reflective markers and scraped them all up for several miles at a cost of tens of thousands of dollars. Some cities now have bought plows that they mount on heavy garbage trucks that have had their frames supplemented to carry them.