The goals are many and have been articulated clearly. The fact that MAGIVER can not understand them is no shock. There are sympathetic OWS demonstrations in Egypt. Their posters are calling out for social justice. People in Egypt can understand.
When the arab spring marches started, many on this board were shocked at how the government them with brutality. I knew we would do the same . we always have.
Your brutality of your citizens is wrong. Our brutality is just giving them what they deserve. It is not very different.
I’m sorry but comparing the way the various Arab governments responded to the Arab spring to the way several local governments reacted to the OWS movement is utterly moronic.
I’m not going to defend either Tony Baloney or the way the Oakland police handled the situation, but the Egyptian protesters would far, far rather have dealt with them and most of the OWS protesters would never have even shown up if they’d had the Egyptian authorities to deal with.
Yeah, it’s not very different if you ignore the death count.
Arabs: Well into the thousands. Maybe Tens of thousands.
Americans: Zero.
Other than that, you could hardly tell the difference between how the governments responded. Although I did I hard that in Syria, two people were hit on the head with tear gas canisters, so I guess they’re a little worse than Oakland.
So you need deaths to see brutality. The Iraqi vet in Oakland came close. But those countries were dictatorships. We expect them to brutalize their citizens. We pretend to be much better. We don’t have to kill ours to be hypocrites. All we have to do is not live up to the standards we pretend to believe in. They don’t have that hanging around their governments neck.
We are much better. There are hundreds of protests in various cities around the country, and one got out of hand, yet you don’t see much difference between that and what’s going on in Syria. There is absolutely no comparison between the two situations, and all your emoting isn’t going to change that.
But you keep telling Americans how terrible they are. That is bound to make them sympathetic to your cause.
You give Congress WAAAY too much credit. Given the credentials required to do the job (none) and the general background of most Congressmen (lawyers) It’s not hard to understand why stupid shit goes sailing over their heads on a daily basis. They are not held to any level of accountability. Not only are they not held to any level of accountability but they have a great number of people convinced they can do no wrong.
As I said before, they were told about problems with both derivatives and government sponsored mortgages. they willfully did nothing.
It’s easy to spend other people’s money. It’s even easier when nobody asks you to be accountable. A retarded monkey could do that. Put a lever in front of him and every time he pushes it money is spent they get a [del] vote[/del] banana.
No it didn’t. It wasn’t even remotely close. Long before their illegal occupation of public lands they were politely asked to leave. After that the police used tactics designed to minimize harm to people. The Canister that hit the Iraqi vet wasn’t aimed at his head. If he was stupid enough to stand there when they were warned of the consequences it’s all on him. He’s nothing but a Walter Mitty martyr and a clueless one at that. He has an infinite number of ways to express his view point that are exponentially more efficient at getting the word out. He could write to his representatives, write a letter to his newspaper editorial page, start an internet web site… He chose to ignore a lawful order to vacate the area.
Absolutely correct. He should have his life in jeopardy because he did not snap to the orders of a cop. It was terrible how much peril the occupiers put citizens in. They should expect tear gas, beatings and maltreatment. The parks must be kept quiet enough for your listening pleasure.
You do not know how successful the occupations will be but it is another risk of perforating your bowel for you to state there are “infinite” better ways. Actually there are not. The poor have no communication with their congressional and senatorial overlords. This one is obviously getting their attention. It has you ululating endlessly.
Yes Gonzo, that’s exactly it. He was doing something illegal, asked to stop, refused and was dealt with accordingly. In a society with rules you don’t get to do whatever you want. Even a child understands this (and most drunks).
Yes, Gonzo, when you break the law and deliberately continue the behavior you’re arrested.
Yes, actually I do know how successful they will be. Chasing windmills solves nothing. Not only are they wasting their time they are wasting other people’s time as well as resources that could be going to the poor as well as tax money spent babysitting them. They are not just worthless in this regard their efforts have a negative effect. If these people applied their free time toward virtually any other activity they would make more of a difference.
As for the poor not having communication with their representatives that’s nonsence. They can write them via the internet at any public library. They can sign petitions online. They can create petitions online. They WH has a site just for that purpose. The avenues of communication are greater than they ever were.
Yep, on line petitions will go very far , but occupations will not. Strange reality you inhabit.
Snow storm coming into NYC and the police confiscated the generators claiming fire hazard. I suppose you have to believe that is why they did it, because the American government and police never ,ever mistreat people. They just get what is coming to them for annoying you and people like you.
Actually, that is one of the primary purposes of parks, particularly in cities. They’re public places we set aside to offer a bit of respite from the general hubbub of city life. They’re also legitimate places to hold protests and such, but they are not there for people to “occupy”. The cops should clear them the fuck out. And the second a new tent or encampment of any type goes up, confiscate it.
The occupations are not loud. The NYC occupation is on private land a private park. On what basis do your rights supplant those of hundreds of occupiers?
On the basis that that is not the primary purpose for parks.
So you want to curtail the constitutional right of the protesters to assemble because that is not the primary purpose of parks? Maybe we should create a zone for them to assemble. Somewhere where they can protest to their hearts content without bothering anybody. This would fulfill the letter of the law, which let’s face it, is all that matters.:rolleyes:
How about we do both: allow parks to serve the function they are intended for and let people protest? I’m all for that. Go get a permit for a day or three, protest your ass off, then go the fuck home. How about that?
Great idea! Let’s extend that idea to all the amendments, like, you can buy three guns, but no more, three is enough. Who could object?
Maybe we could a special zone to stay in for when you don’t want to incriminate yourself.
The strange thing about this is you have nonviolent people obviously very commuted to getting the country to to think about its problems. and all the conservatives here can do is whine about them not going home.
Why is that? Is it those conservatives know the solutions are going to be something they don’t like?
Do they just like the poor and out of work being economically violated?
Who knows.
The NYC protest is on private land, so unless the cops can come up with a credible health or safety issue, or unless the owner wants to kick them off, then they have every right to be there as long as they like and for whatever hours they like.
Public parks generally have set hours and require a permit for a protest. If the cities want to kick out the Occupiers who set up a tent city, that is perfectly within the boundaries of the 1st amendment. Someone cited the SCOTUS precedent on that in one of these threads. If the Occupiers want to turn this into an issue about whether or not they have a right to camp in the parks, they are surely going to lose on the bigger issue, because then they’re just coming across as a bunch of entitled assholes.
I know this varies by city, but SF has decided the Occupiers can stay and set up tents, so they’re good there.
Your analogy fails. With parks for public use vs parks for protestors’ use, you have two competing sets of rights. Not so with you gun analogy. There is a right to own and bare arms. There is no right to not have people own guns. Unless you live in a town that is trying to do that. In which case, I’ll take your compromise. You in?
That is generally correct. But I’m not sure about one thing. I would think that the city incentives companies to include public spaces in their building plans. And there are probably financial breaks for doing so. If that is the case, then I’d argue that the park must be kept in a state that it can be used by the general public. If not, then the company has to forfeit the incentive.