Congress Should Approve Additional Funding for Military Pay

Great Debates
1

Inspired in part by this thread, which wonders how much of the war’s price tag will get passed along to the grunts in the field, I think now is a great time for Congress to recognize how deplorably underpaid our soldiers, sailors, airmen, and Marines are, especially those in the junior enlisted racks.

I spent six weeks TDY with the National Guard in Iowa. I met several guys who were on active duty (Title X, a way for guardsmen to be on full active duty) who couldn’t make ends meet with their salaries and took second jobs - sometimes in violation of the local regs. But it was a choice between this and not paying rent or buying food.

I have no idea how much it would cost to give an across-the-board pay hike to all pay grades, weighted towards compensating the E-1 through E-5’s and the O-1 through O-3 ranks. But surely that would be a good way to spend money - better, some might say, than the expenditures for effecting a regime change in another country.

Not to say we shouldn’t spend money to effect that regime change. But we should pay the men and women who are willing to put themselves in harm’s way more than we’re paying them now, and that should be of higher priority than bombing the crap out of a presidential palace.

  • Rick
2

Hear, hear!

<< thunderous applause >>

Yo, what’s to debate? :smiley:

3

Apparently nothing to debate. That’s good.

:slight_smile:

4

Good point Bricker It irks the hell out of me that The Merchant of Death TM corporation presidents make ten of millions of dollars in salary every year. I am talking about corporations that have billion dollar Department of Defense contracts.

It’s a crying shame that these Merchants of Death TM are picking the pockets of the soldiers, sailors and airmen that are doing the actual fighting.

5

The military pay charts don’t include such extras as free housing, free food(seperate rations), free medical, and extra pay based on the size of the military family.

The average serviceperson is very well compensated. Especially considering that most of them joined up right out of high school and have little education or real world job experience. I recall that when I was a lowly E-4 back in the mid-80s, I was taking home about 1500 per month. All that with meals paid for, free housing, free insurance,and no other bills to speak of. Yes, life was good for this Specialist.

Even now, I work on a Marine base and know lots of Marines. They all drive nice, newer model cars, even the lower enlisted. When you see 19 year old kids driving around in brand new Mustangs and Impalas, you know things can’t be all that bad for them.

6

And thats why every Airman I knew (myself included) who had kids was on WIC and a few on foodstamps. Of course the lower ranked enlisted people should get paid more. Why it hasn’t happened yet, I have no idea.

7

I say a across the board pay raise is definatly a good idea, though given that I am in ROTC I am biased slightly. ** Hermann Cheruscan **, given my experience growing up in a military family, and my father having to council some of those privates and seamen about their finances, I believe most of those 19 year olds with new cars are going to be in a world debt for years to come, and are living beyond their means. That, and some lower enlisted ranks families actually have to go one food stamps, which I think is a disgrace that the fighting men and women of this country should be paid that poorly.

8

I’d have to see actual numbers, including benefits, before I bought the OP’s premise. If you’re getting subsidized housing, meals, etc. it doesn’t take a lot of takehome pay to make ends meet.

9

The money Bush asked for is not for raises. It’s for combat pay. Which for the average grunt, is about $200 a month.

10

As a soldier who works in Finance, I always laugh when those points are brought up.

Free Housing - depends on where you are stationed, when I was at Bragg, I was told to buy a house it would be faster then getting housing on post. At Sill it took 18 months to get housing. I did get housing here at Drum, but it is small with thin walls and some of the base housing is up to 30 miles away from here. If the soldier has to get a place off post, then the soldier will be paid Housing allowance. This is based on rank, location and if the soldier has dependents (spouse and/or children). If the soldier has a spouse or a spouse and children, the soldier gets the same amount of BAH. Soldiers are paid on ability, not fertility.

Free Food - for those who are authorized to mess seperatly (don’t have to eat at the mess hall/DFAC) it is about $212 per month. If the unit goes to the field for training, then part of money is collected to pay for field rations. If the soldier has a meal card, then the soldier only gets about $30 a month.

Free medical - for the soldier only. When I first came in, the spouse and children had full free coverage, but now we have to pay a monthly insurance premium and co-pays.

Extra pay for family size - see above, remember soldiers are paid on ability not fertility.

As far as the new hot cars, how much in debt is the soldier. what is the soldier not buying or saving to pay for that car.

Those of us in the service do need a pay raise, but don’t forget about those who have retired from the service. They need a raise and concurrent entitlement (retired pay and service related disability pay). should I start a new thread, ask the finance guy?

11

Here’s a military pay scale.

http://www.dfas.mil/money/milpay/pay/2003paytable.pdf

It clearly shows that servicepeople are very well paid.

12

Does congress determine the pay scale, or do they just approve the funding and leave it to the military to decide how many people they can employ with that money? You can’t just hire more people than you can afford and then ask for more money.

13

Its all decided by Congress.

14

And the single Servicemembers shouldn’t get paid less for the same job as the married Servicemembers either.

I don’t see either situation changing in the near future.

15

Hmmm.

I have to admit that the pay doesn’t seem that unreasonable. It isn’t great for a young private, but for a job that requires the applicant have basically no education, no job experience and no skills, you could do a lot worse.

Could it be raised? Sure, but the money has to come from somewhere.

16

I agree with Hermann that military members are, in general, very well paid.

I’ll use myself for an example. When I got out of the Navy last year as a Lieutenant (O-3), my (taxable) base pay alone was over $50,000. In addition, I received untaxed housing and subsistence allowances that pushed my gross pay to over $70,000.

Officers and sailors in certain specialties can also receive bonuses. (Scroll down Hermannn’s chart.) Submarine pay and sea pay for my rank would add another $20,000 per year, and nuclear retention pay ranges from an additional $10,000 to $15,000 per year, depending on the degree of commitment.

When I went job-hunting last year, entering a new field with a fresh master’s degree in hand, I quickly learned to avoid the issue of my previous salary. At first I answered the question honestly, and added “But I don’t expect to earn that much, as I am, after all, undertaking a career change.” It still scared most prospective employers off.

I eventually was hired by my current boss, an ex-submarine officer. He asked my current salary, and I felt comfortable enough with him to be honest. He was astonished that military folks were getting paid that much, and frankly told me that there was no way he was going to match that. Instead, he paid me a fair rate for my experience and qualifications in my new field.

With respect to enlisted folks, I believe most are also very well paid. The ones that you hear about on food stamps are generally low-ranking enlisted personnel with large families. Considering the education/experience level of an E-1/E-2/E-3, I think they are also fairly paid.

All that being said, I do think Hostile Fire Pay should be significantly increased.

17

Source: http://www.cnn.com/2003/ALLPOLITICS/03/27/sprj.irq.taxes.ap/index.html