I am sure we will hear soon enough that this is perfectly acceptable police behavior, and that the only terrible thing is that it was recorded and made public. That’s the egregious and awful act.
Actually, a more likely outcome if cops decide they aren’t going to execute warrants because they don’t like the laws is that they get fired and we get some new cops who will do their job.
This is stupid even for you, and that’s saying something.
Regards,
Shodan
You are probably correct. Cops don’t get fired for planting evidence, or for beating people, or even for killing them.
But they would get fired because they refuse to do something that puts them in danger, puts the public in danger, and lowers the public’s opinion of the police.
We are building the police state of your dreams.
So, you are saying that you don’t care about police safety? Why do you think it is stupid to care about the well being of cops?
That you want them to be put into dangerous positions is pretty disgusting.
I suppose I must have been wrong to think that the safety of our friends in blue was a concern to you.
Yes, I am correct. But this is really stupid - cops do, in fact, get fired for misconduct, and several instances have been provided in this thread.
You need, if possible, to say things that are less idiotic. Which is more likely to lead to a police state - police obeying the authority of judges and legislators, or police picking and choosing which warrants they will honor and which they will ignore?
I don’t think it is stupid to care about the well being of cops. It’s stupid to post as you do.
I guess it wasn’t possible.
Regards,
Shodan
And many instances have been provided in this thread of cops not getting fired after misconduct. So my point stands just fine.
Do you actually think that those are the only options?
Excluded middle fallacious arguments are for those who know that they have no actual credible argument to stand on.
Well, it is also a favorite technique used by trolls.
Well, you are the one who wants them to go into dangerous situations for no purpose other than to put the public into danger and to decrease the public’s trust in them.
We’ll just let that stand on its own to show your lie, troll.
And often, as cited earlier in this thread, they are rehired by that same department.
Well, more they are forced by the union to reinstate rather than rehire. But the effect is the same.
Others are simply hired by other departments. They call them ‘gypsy’ cops.
The police are the ones who obtain the warrants in the first place. It is a departmental decision, that situation X calls for a breach of Subject Y’s privacy. The chief, or whoever, grabs a bunch of uniforms and sends them out on a raid.
Which is to say, the local departmental administration is largely responsible for the terrible outcome in the Bartlesville encounter. The uniforms were, ahem, just following orders. They fucked up, but the prioritization and timing of the raid – most of the problem – was not their fault. Higher-ups in the department deserve some amount of pillorying.
That’s what I am saying. The lower level cops should be holding their superiors to account. They should question being sent into dangerous circumstances where they may end up having to kill someone else or risk their lives, when the situation can be resolved far more peacefully, assuming that it is a situation that really needs to be resolved at all.
So, cops, who routinely plant evidence, assault, beat, and shoot people, should be the ones who decide what warrants to serve and what ones to ignore. Oooookay then.
Regards,
Shodan
Man, you are pretty harsh on cops there. Why you so hate our friends in blue? No wonder you want them to have to unnecessarily go into situations where they may get themselves injured or killed.
My thoughts were more along the lines of them requesting to their superiors, that, rather than bust in the door and invade the house of some teenager who sold a dime bag at night, maybe instead, just go knock on the door during the day, talk to him and issue the appropriate citation and court summons.
But you go ahead and live among your own kind, in your world of an excluded middle, the land of trolls.
A big part of the solution is for the police to be fully responsible to independent civilian oversight. I have some hope that you might advance in this direction.
An even bigger part of the solution is to get serious about gun control so that the police will not be in as much risk so much of the time. Unfortunately, you are not capable of this, so even if you improve vis a vis civilian oversight, your police caused death rates will still be horrendous when compared with the first world.
The biggest part is to deal with your racism. Out of racism comes poverty, out of poverty comes crime, out of crime comes violence and death. Although you have made some steps forward vis a vis racism, you have such a long way to go that it is a generational problem that will not be solved any time soon.
Well, in the Bartlesville incident, the suspect was several decades beyond being a teenager. They shot his mother, who was 72. There are probably cases of teenagers who have parents in their 70s, but mostly not so much.
But the department leadership deserves some blame here. They got a warrant for something that seems very trivial and decided to execute it with the worst possible timing. The officers could have chosen to hold off or beg off, but then when their performance reviews come up, they might be looking at an insubordination strike on their records. Hanging an officer for doing something ill-advised should look also at who put that officer in the bad situation.
Having better quality officers would be preferable, but possibly more than most PDs can afford.
…while I agree that “no-knock warrants” are in most cases stupid, pointless, and dangerous, expecting police to all of a sudden decide to stop executing the warrants because “its the right thing to do” is kinda ridiculous. There are 18,000 police departments in America. Its just not going to happen.
This is a much more practical approach to the issue. But America being America, without overwhelming support from the public, this is unlikely to happen in most jurisdictions.
First round of closing arguments today in Baltimore.
The article has a decent overview of the whole thing for those that haven’t been following along.
Probably.
Don’t be ridiculous. That didn’t happen - police are never punished for wrong doing. I read it on the Internet.
Regards,
Shodan
Not as often as they commit wrongdoing, to be sure, but from time to time, despite the police being the ones to investigate, and their friends the ones to prosecute, occasionally, when they have at least a decade of criminal behavior of invading homes, staging crime scenes, acting as armed drug dealers, running interference on drug trafficking rings, and even defrauding of their own department, they end up actually facing justice.
No, police are never charged, always acquitted, and if fired, are quickly rehired by the same or another department. You could look it up.
Regards,
Shodan