Covid is the first time I've seen the far right sacrifice themselves at the alter of identity politics

The BBQ Pit
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My entire life I’ve watched the far right harm and mistreat people who weren’t like them. Christians treating muslims and atheists like garbage. Men treating women like garbage. Cis-het people treating LGBTQ people like garbage. Middle class people treating the poor like garbage. Native born citizens treating immigrants like garbage. Whites treating non-whites like garbage.

As that Trump voter who worked in a prison once said ‘He’s not hurting the people he needs to be’. The concept of intentionally inflicting pain and suffering on people who aren’t like them has been something I"ve seen my whole life.

But with the vaccine denialism and mask rejection, I think this is the first time in my life I’ve seen these far right types actively harm themselves in pursuit of identity politics. By depriving themselves of covid vaccines and rejecting masks they’re going to have a lot of illness, long haul covid and deaths that are unnecessary inflicted on themselves.

I don’t have a point with this, and I don’t even know if it this pitworthy. But in a weird way this makes me respect the far right a little more. Normally they only want to harm everyone who isn’t them (everyone who isn’t a native born, white, christian, cishet, generally male). I think this is the first time I’ve seen them actively harm themselves in pursuit of identity politics.

Its a nice change of pace. I hope to see more self destructive behavior on their part, it beats them treating everyone else like shit.

And yes I understand the far rights rejection of things like economic justice, universal health care, free college, etc harms them too, but they reject these things because they think they are not going to be affected because they’re too smart/hard working/authentic/self disciplined/etc to need those things. With covid denialism they’re really inflicting the same level of pain and suffering they normally inflict on everyone else onto themselves instead.

(and yes I know their behavior puts the immunocompromised at risk, and I agree that is unfair).

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You shouldn’t because,

a very large number of them, maybe most, do not believe any of the above is real . . . sometimes not even when it happens to them.

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The biggest disconnect from the conservatives (and it makes me respect them less) is the contradictory way the moderate and smartest conservatives are towards the far right.

The smarter ones were technically correct when they tried to shame centrists and liberals when they misinterpreted the declarations of Trump and others of this being a hoax. The reply from smarter conservatives was that the declaration of a “hoax” by the administration was not about the disease, but that they were talking about what the mean (and mistaken for them) liberals and Democrats were saying about the administration efforts to deal with the pandemic. That was the hoax according to them.

And yet, here we are. The former president and followers forgot about pressing hard for what the message was supposed to be, that the disease and the proper ways to deal with it were not hoaxes. And then the moderate and smarter conservatives also forgot about it, or their efforts to tell others about the danger were pitiful.

Just about half of the Republicans have said they will not vaccinate. And many times the reason is that the rank and file and many of their leaders (I think that they are not really leaders, but reckless followers of ignorance, not leaders at all) do think now that the pandemic and/or how to deal with it is the hoax.

I will have to also blame the right wing sources of information directed to the rank and file for the ongoing contradiction. The moderate and smarter conservatives are not happy to counter the contrarian and misleading information (or don’t want to rock the boat now) or they are happy to pour gasoline into the fiery misinformation out there, regardless if they know how damaging that is to the country. They need to keep their followers happy…

https://thehill.com/homenews/sunday-talk-shows/562453-fauci-horrifying-to-hear-cpac-crowd-cheering-missed-vaccine-goal

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What’s especially telling about all this, is that most of the right wing pundits have either admitted to having had the vaccine, or are refusing to say. (I say “most” but are there any that have claimed to have not had the vaccine?)

So, while they’ve always had contempt for their audience – treating them as rubes who’ll believe whatever they pull out their ass – this time it’s different. This time they’re actively harming their audience physically as well as mentally.
It shows, as clear as it could possibly be, that they have no principles beyond growing their personal wealth and status and/or power.

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I think you’re approaching it from an oblique angle. It’s not that they are harming themselves for identity politics, not exactly. That’s sort of a dressed-up way of describing the more fundamental thing that’s actually happening.

To wit: “I would rather die than give those people power over me.”

That’s all it is. That’s all it’s ever been. And that’s why current events are not surprising, and are of a piece with their past behavior.

Compare, for example, their complaints about politically correct language, and the social prohibitions on using, for example, ethnic slurs that used to be more common and (roughly) acceptable in mainstream vernacular. If you ask them why they want to use, say, the n-word, they will say they don’t “want” to use it, they just disagree with the proposition that there should be formal, generalized rules about it.

For most of them, I think, they’re actually honest about the first part. It’s the second part where they are, consciously or unconsciously, misrepresenting their beliefs. Because when you get right down to it, it’s not about the words themselves, it’s that these types don’t believe “those people” should have any power to impose rules on them. “I do not accept that a Black person can tell me what to do.” Period. Full stop. End of.

Pandemic skepticism is the exact same thing, wearing a different mask. The reactionary right rejects the authority of people over whom they have moral or tribal objections — in this case, scientists with their “anti-God agenda,” and lefty types who insist that we pull together as equals — and they refuse to allow their own self-perceived authority to be eroded or compromised by those enemies. That’s it. There’s literally nothing else. And it’s such an imperative that they’re willing to die for it.

Naturally, this leads to a whole secondary conversation about how these people’s perception of their diluted power is actually correct, but that it’s the result of economic concentration and they’ve been hoodwinked into blaming the wrong people, yada yada yada. But the key takeaway is that this is an existential conflict about power, period, and it always has been.

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If they were merely sacrificing themselves I would wish them luck. What they’re really doing is breeding stronger mutations that will kill those other than themselves.

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I agree with you, @Cervaise, that this boils down to “I don’t let THEM tell me what to do.” That is exactly the sentiment being exploited. However, I would argue that doesn’t make the OP wrong. You’ve just described the reason why they are willing to “sacrifice themselves on the alt[a]r of identity politics”—at least, as how the alt-right uses the term.

They’ve made COVID-denial into their identity, so much so that the “THEM” part doesn’t matter. Even their own push them to get vaccinated, but they don’t listen. Even Trump told them to get vaccinated, but they won’t listen to Dear Leader.

And I must agree with the OP that it is surprising how strong this denial is. For me, even the risk of the milder symptoms of COVID—losing your sense of smell and taste, being utterly fatigued, high temperatures—are enough for me to do what I can to not get it. But they’re seeing people around them get sick from it, and it doesn’t matter.

It’s not like the other stuff they denied. It’s right there in their face, but their denial is still resilient—almost like they’d been programmed by Big Brother.

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Oh, that is easy to explain, at that time the dear leader was no longer it. /s

Yeah, I know, many still think he is still the president, but they also explain statements like that as forced by the ones “stealing” the election, and many can themselves get an out by noticing that Trump there also said that “We have our freedoms and we have to live by that, and I agree with that also,”

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Not wearing masks is more likely to harm those around them than it is to harm themselves. A while back (towards the beginning of the pandemic), I saw a lot of people comparing masks to open/concealed carry. Suggesting that if these people feel the need to carry a gun to protect themselves, why do they shun masks. To me, it was obvious, the carry a gun under the guise of protecting themselves, but a mask protects other people. I still argue that if the mask meant you had, say, a 90% reduced chance of catching the virus (as opposed to a 90% reduced chance of spreading it if you had it), a lot more people would be on board with it. It’s a very ‘fuck you, I got mine’ attitude. (Note: the 90% number is entirely made up by me for the example, I have no idea what the actual numbers are).

WRT the vaccines, ignoring the anti-vaxxers and just looking at the far right that refuse to get the vaccine for no reason other than that they’re being told to get it. I have a funny feeling a lot of them, regardless of what they say, still got it. Fox and Friends got vaccinated. I have a WAG that Tucker has, but he refuses to say if he did or not, and because he acts like a 5 year old, he claims the only reason he refuses to reveal it is because people keep asking him about it. Trump got it, Ivanka got it.
And, to think, if Trump, Ivanka, Fox etc got it earlier instead of acting like assholes about it, they quite literally could have changed the course of the disease. I’ve said it before, I’ll say it again, Trump could have spun this pandemic into a second term if he took it on, listened to the experts and dealt with it. Many people would have ignored all his other crap if he handled the virus better. But he chose to do the exact opposite of what he should have done every chance he got (and explicitly stated that he was doing so). He lost that bet and instead earned the title ‘disgraced’.

That’s the difference, IMO. Fuck masks, those are to protect others, but I’ll be first in line to get the shot because the protects ME.

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Exactly. Be it Covid, or trans rights, or separation of curch and state, content of school curriculum, climate change, or if you go back enough desegregation or suffrage rights or secession it boils down to “I won’t let Someone Not Like Me tell me what to do and what to teach my children to believe”. Academic intellectuals, scientists, LGBT people, Urbanites, minorities, people from non-evangelical religions or no religion… no, we won’t let THEM tell us that how we’re living is wrong. Never mind if it would benefit them, never mind if the “people like us” are the ones ripping them off.

Again, because Nobody tells us we have to do what we don’t want to.

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The problem is that ‘our freedoms’ only apply to what they want it to apply to. We all have the freedom to not get the vaccine. But when a privately owned business says you can’t enter without a vaccine or a mask, suddenly they’re freedoms are being trampled.

They seem to forget that freedom cuts both ways.

Did you see the protestors outside the vaccine only Foo Fighters concert. Holding up signs meant to look like ‘whites only’ signs? How fucking stupid. Talk about not understanding the difference between racism/segregation and a voluntary vaccine.

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But you have to remember, when it comes to trans rights, separation of church and state, school curriculum (can’t have those 6 year olds getting indoctrinated with CRT), desegregation, women/minority suffrage, etc. None of those have any real effect on the people pushing back on them. A straight, white, middle/upper class male isn’t going to benefit from or be harmed by two men getting married, but doggone it, it’s not happening on my watch.
Covid, on the other hand, by actively pushing back, has the very real possibility of making them dead.
Climate change might kill/harm them in a few dozen years (or decades), Covid could literally kill them next week.

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Is there a point at which the deaths of right-wing nutjobs becomes politically significant?

I doubt it, though sometimes I read these stories and tell myself, “Good! The more of them drop dead, the fewer there are to vote rightwing nutjob pols.” Also since this phenomenon is strongest in RW NJ sections, MS. AL. LA. etc, maybe some of these areas could become politically contestable.

I suspect the number of deaths, however appalling and however localized, is just a blip on the radar of political outcomes.

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No, fortunately. It’s not THAT devastating.

And that’s part of the response to the first quote. Some of them will suffer. Not all. Not a majority. Oh, some congregation out in Hootenany County got 20 out of 100 members wiped out… that was there, and that’s terrible, but that’s not me, that’s not here.

And among the groups in which there is high precautions resistance, the upper middle class segments thereof are probably getting vaccinated – but not doing much to help change the perception down the other social tiers. They get vaccinated but make a huge point of loudly proclaiming “this is what I think it’s best for me, but YOU decide if it’s for you”.

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Well, sure, I agree with you. I thought I was pretty careful to say the OP wasn’t wrong, exactly, but rather was looking at the behavior at a higher level of abstraction, which obscured its connection to past actions. Rather than considering the self-harm of pandemic denial as a strategic expression of ideological belief, I suggested to peel that back and look at it as an existential tantrum. Same behavior, but a more fundamental root cause, which makes it easier to recognize the holistic worldview. That’s what I was trying to illuminate.

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“It is better to die you your back than to live on your feet.”

Stranger

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The reason, AIUI, is that the far right still doesn’t believe they’re harming themselves. If this were something like Ebola, they’d be scrambling to protect themselves. But some respiratory illness like Covid still doesn’t scare them.

And I agree with the others, this has very little if anything to do with identity politics. It’s all about “don’t believe the liberal media/experts.”

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For a good chunk of the 20th century, American towns offered grand community swimming pools as symbols of leisure and civic pride. They were testaments to public investment.

But then desegregation happened and the pools had to be integrated. Rather than open them up to everyone, town after town simply shut them down. And not only did they close the pools, they nuked their parks departments and effectively abandoned public investment altogether. So in the end, Black Americans didn’t get to enjoy the pools, but neither did white people who were motivated by self-destructive racist ideologies.

This, McGhee argues, is the story of American politics in microcosm. The entire country is now one giant drained pool. Too many Americans have too easily accepted the lie animating so much of our history, namely that politics is a zero-sum contest in which one group’s gain must be another group’s loss.

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One ironic aspect is that they’re not believing the vaccine is safe, despite Operation Warp Speed, an achievement touted by their deal leader as the most amazing accomplishment ever.
There is a right wing guy on Seattle talk radio every day railing against the dangers of mRNA vaccines.

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Trump was forced to say that by the “Deep State”. Either that, or Anthony Fauci give him a swirly in the Oval Office bathroom until he agreed to it.

Stranger