I just started my new federal government job. This first week is taken up with training, everybody sitting at tables formed into a U. To my right at the adjacent table sat a young woman who is 24 years old but looks younger. On her right, sharing her table, sat a man well over twice her age. At the end of the day, when he got up and walked away, we got to talking; she confided to me that he had been leaning onto her chair all day, rubbing up against her, and stroking her hair. EEEWWWW! :mad:
I said I would have slapped him. On second thought, I would have said in my iciest low voice, “Listen, sir. Touch me one more time and I will slap you.”
She said that was why she had bumped against me, trying to move farther away from him. She asked me to share her table tomorrow to keep him away from her. I asked her why she doesn’t report him and get him fired. She said since we’re now federal employees, she’s covered under Title VII.
I urged her to settle his creepy hash but then she said she didn’t care that much. I was disappointed she didn’t decide to file a harassment complaint, but didn’t think it was my call to intervene, it’s up to her. If he isn’t stopped he’ll likely continue to inflict his creepy harassment on other women. I don’t think our fellow Americans would look very kindly on their tax dollars being spent on this guy. I hope she’ll change her mind and get him fired. It would serve him right.
Another nice girl not making waves. Any chance you can pick her up by the lapels and shake some sense into her? 20 years from now, taxpayers will be wondering where the lawsuit came from.
I guess because she’s too chicken to do anything else. Women like this make me crazy. Some strange guy is STROKING HER HAIR and she doesn’t care enough to put an end to it?
She doesn’t deserve that because nobody does, but honestly I find it hard to feel terribly sorry for her; she’s an adult who should stand up for herself. Tell the guy to take a hike; how hard is this?
She should have said something to him at the time. Its not actually sexual harrassment until she tells / asks him to stop.
And also, “stroking her hair”? WTF seriously? He can do that and nobody notices, she doesn’t say anything? this makes me wonder if she might somehow be over-reacting, reading things into the situation that aren’t there. I would expect that anybody that does this on a regular basis isn’t going to reach 40+ before he learns better (especially in the US).
This is not to say she’s lying, or oversensitive, merely that I would want more information before condemming the guy.
Why “politely”? If some creepy older woman whom I most definitely didn’t fancy was infringing my personal space, I’d shoot for “politely” as the first option. I don’t believe in unnecessary escalation and I wouldn’t reach for impoliteness until politeness had been tried and found wanting. YMMV (and apparently does).
I would have spoken up if I’d personally observed it happening, but since I didn’t, I don’t see how I could take the initiative. I can’t make accusations based only on secondhand say-so. I will be watching out from now on though.
Switch places with her and if tries it on you, punch his face. If he doesn’t like it, simply explain that your experience and your friend’s information lead you to believe he liked inappropriate, and unsolicited contact with near strangers.
In an office setting being polite is taking the high road. You never know who might be a witness and being polite will make you appear in a better light than being unnecessarily rude. (Not that the guy doesn’t deserve it.)
Odesio
That’s one approach, but since Johanna’s nearer my age (late 40s) than the girl in the OP, that would put her out of his target demographic straight away.
I’m with the camp of people that are thinking she’s either overreacting to an innocent accidental bump up against her, or she’s making the whole thing up. The part about him “stroking her hair” sounds completely fishy to me. I don’t see how he could even do that without someone else noticing. Constantly rubbing up against her seems a little far fetched too. Again, I’m not outright calling her a liar, just that she’s either mistaken about someone accidentally turning their chair and bumping her leg, or you work with some of the most inattentive people on the planet to have not noticed him “leaning on her chair, rubbing up against her, and stroking her hair” all the way through a training class. But you work with the government, so either option sounds equally likely.
Are you a worker or a budding detective? At the moment all we have is the version of one person which is not corroborated. The OP has just started a new job and has found out about this allegation. Why hasn’t the complainant told other co workers?
I am not defending anything but to say there is a creepy sexual harasser on a Govt wage seems a bit far fetched at this time.
If he’s right up against her an “casually” has his arm resting behind her… I can easily see where he could stroke her hair (if it’s long enough). And if everyone is paying attention to the trainer, or their notes, and the trainer turns her back…
Yes, some men will be that bold. Ladies, raise your hands if you’ve experienced something along this line.
On the other hand, her first responsibility is to tell him clearly and directly to knock it off. And then tell the trainer if he doesn’t.
That’s what I was thinking. I doubt that he was fully fondling her tresses from scalp to split ends. Probably more like he was running his fingers lightly along the ends.
While I certainly do not think there is any excuse for the bahavior he is accused of, I don’t understand why she would react as she did.
Some guy or woman bumps up against my leg either intentionally or un-, and I say “Excuse me” in a manner that clearly conveys that I do not wish it repeated. To date, they have never failed to get the hint - tho if they did - I would have no difficulty saying it louder the next time, perhaps adding, “Please do not invade upon my personal space.” In an office setting you could say, “I know it is cramped in here, but please try to respect my space.” Something like that.
It happens a third time, all bets are off. A loud - “Will you get away from me/keep your hands to yourself?!” would be perfectly in order.
Stroking the hair - I’ve worked in a fed office for 25 years, and have never beein in a situation where I accidentlaly stroked a co-worker’s hair. I think it pretty safe to say you skip step 1 - and possibly step 2 - above.
IME, the feds take charges of sexual harrassment - um - somewhat seriously. What I mean is they will respond quickly to an accusation. But they will tend to reassign the offender, making him someone else’s problem.
It sucks that some people take advantage of other people. But some people allow themselves to be taken advantage of - which lessens the sympathy I feel for those particulr people.
raises hand I have, when I was too young to know to stick up for myself, and what’s worse, is one of our board members was getting all oogy on another board member not too long ago.
And what do other people think? I’l tell you what other people think, if you don’t stand up for yourself. They think you’re complicit, and that you have a relationship going on with this fellow, and they talk about you behind your back.
Polite but firm is the way to start. “Stop touching my hair. I don’t like it.” Then you escalate from there.
Oh, and my sympathy depends on how old she is. A 20 YO girl? Ok, I understand being a little afraid. 40? Grow up and stand up for yourself!
Respectfully, there really is a lot of pressure on girls and young women (hell, even middle aged women) to be nice and avoid a scene or potentially upsetting a man. I do understand that it’s hard to fathom, becuase few men would react as many, many women have been trained all their lives to. Just as it’s not ok for boys to cry, it’s not ok for girls to assertively get what they need. Especially for a certain subset of pretty girl, there is just no way she’d talk to an offensive person the way you would above. Just as a young man would not cry in public or even in front of his wife.
It’s not right, it sets back the cause of feminism 20 years, it drives assertive women nuts, and it ultimately hurts the woman in question. Not to mention it perpetuates the creepy guy problem.
Johanna, if you wish to, you could do this young woman a great service by teaching her how to set and defend her own boundaries. You don’t have to chastise her, just open her eyes to an alternate reality where it’s ok to tell an asshole to stop it.
