The horror of the shooting of those kindergarten children and the ensuing investigation is what prompted this question.
I just saw a news conference where they implied they were awaiting the medical examiner and said outright the scene would take another day to process.
I cannot imagine anything more disrespectful to the families of the victims, than knowing that 24hrs later their child lies still on the floor of that school. I am mortified to consider that such a thing is even possible.
I get that crime scenes need processing, things take time. But there is no one to convict here, no one to sleuth out. What the hell is taking so damn long here? Yes, it’s 28 people but they can all be identified, 100% I’d reckon, pretty simply.
I get that it’s not a huge community, and this is a large crime scene to process but it’s not like there are a lot of mysteries or unknowns, and how is this not ‘top priority’ for every first responder for a thousand miles around?
Colour me very confused, it seems the ultimate horror upon horror.
I feel the same way, even though the children can no longer be helped if it were me I would want to be with my child, at least to say goodbye. The bodies will change rapidly, hopefully they have turned off any heating.
I’d like to think it is out of an abundance of caution.
Really, the worst thing authorities could do is hurry through the investigation. You’d be much more outraged if they goofed something up due to haste. It is unfortunate but the right thing to do.
Recall that early reports had two shooters and the wrong name was leaked so you can see what happens in the confusing hours immediately after the incident. The stories I read this morning mention that it is still unclear whether the mother worked at the school, something that seems easiy confirmed or disproved.
They also had various Federal agencies respond and it would take time for each team to perform their evaluation of the crime scene.
But it is no longer ‘confusing early hours’, is it? No, it’s fully a day later. And what’s to bungle? The dead all had their photos taken in Sept, remember? They are on file in the school very likely.
There seems no mystery to solve that would require those children’s bodies remain exactly where they fell. What’s to learn? Who died first, second, third? Who fought back? Do you think any of that trumps the tender feelings of families who have suffered such a loss?
I just cannot fathom what’s left to decipher that requires those little bodies stay where they lie for a full 48hrs. Were I a parent I think knowing my child was just lying there would unhinge me. 48hrs? I’d never make it! You’d have to restrain me, I’m pretty sure.
I’m sure they have reasons, I just need to hear some that make sense to me, is all.
No answers to offer, but I can’t make sense of this either. News footage last night showed parents asking officers if they could go be with their child* , only to be told that they could not cross the tape as it was a crime scene.
*you could not hear the parents’ words—only a recap by the reporter. But the devastated faces of those parents was awful. Can’t even imagine
I hate to say it but they’re doing the right thing.
Obviously, at this point, it appears they know the basic facts of the crime and know that the shooter is dead and won’t be facing prosecution.
But the investigators cannot simply assume the case is closed. They have to work on the assumption that the investigation might produce evidence of undiscovered crimes or suspects and they will need that evidence to find and convict somebody.
This is their one opportunity to investigate the crime scene. If they leave and later find out they were mistaken, they can’t go back and re-do the investigation.
You don’t know you’re finished until you’re finished, that’s the trouble.
We even have a term for it: bungled crime scene investigation. There are any number of examples. Many believe OJ Simpson was acquitted due, in part, to crime scene errors.
Here’s a recent one: Tennis Umpire. “Police, paramedics and loved ones filled the home and trampled through the alleged crime scene, which police “did not cordon off,” attorneys say.”
This is probably a naive question and I am sure they are following protocol, but why can’t they just take photographs/video of the victims and then send them to the morgue where their parents can be with them? I’ve got no problem with them leaving the shooter there–might be some evidentiary value in that, but can’t imagine how awful it must be for those parents knowing their child is lying on a cold floor in a pool of blood. I can’t think of any good reason why they would need to do this.
I understand that they can’t just say “Shooter’s dead, nothing to investigate, case closed”. Sure their could be accomplices and other aspects of the crime that need to be thoroughly investigated, but why the need to keep the children’s’ bodies where they fell? What evidence can be learned from that?
Well if they find a surviving conspirator and put them on trial, a crafty defense lawyer might be able to claim that the crime scene investigation was so sloppy that the prosecution can’t establish who shot the children with legally admissible evidence beyond a reasonable doubt, and so they can’t prove that the person the defendant is accused of conspiring with actually pulled the trigger, so how do you know that the “conspiracy” wasn’t in jest and that the killing was done by someone else? Remember that the defendant doesn’t need to prove their innocence - if the jury believes that the defendant probably did it but that there’s still room for a reasonable doubt, they can’t convict.
Not to be difficult but why are the choices ‘sloppy’ or 48 hrs? And shouldn’t 24hrs be enough to secure or detect any hidden details like a co conspirator?
Your scenario is possible, maybe. I’m still not seeing 48hrs though. I was hoping for some hard facts not just wild conjecture, to be honest.
What specifically are they possibly doing, in the next 24 hrs, that couldn’t and shouldn’t, already have been completed in the first 24? There were clearly dozens of techies on the scene, you could see them during the press conference!
All the bodies were removed from the school overnight. Presumably some are still with the medical examiner, awaiting autopsy. That’s less than 24 hours. Are you upset because the victims need to be autopsied? That’s standard procedure in homicides.
This was a horrorshow, no doubt, but this particular detail isn’t worth fretting over. By all means, let the crime scene investigators have the time to determine this monster acted alone.
How do you know this? Is it a fact? Because it seems contrary to what the head guy said, at the news conference.
I hope you’re right.
I don’t believe you’d feel that way if it was your child, to be honest.
What are they hoping to learn from 28 autopsies, that they don’t know right now, if you don’t mind me asking? Yeah, I know ‘standard procedure’. Surely, if ever there were a circumstance that required varying from ‘standard’ I should think this is it.
An abundance of caution is occasionally the smart move, but there are time when the humane thing would be an abundance of compassion. Just my opinion. Thanks for your post, I am to relieved they are not still lying on the floor where they fell.
Here’s the official release from the state police. “The deceased victims have been transported to the Office of The Chief State’s Medical Examiner where a post mortem examination will be conducted to determine the manner and cause of death.” The release was posted at 9:31am, so the bodies were removed within 24 hours.
They need to know beyond a shadow of a doubt that every bullet that entered those victims came from the weapons which they found with the shooter. If even one of those bullets doesn’t match the ballistic patterns of the weapons which they found, then there is a missing weapon or a second shooter. You understand that, right? [I’m not being sarcastic, and I fully appreciate your upset, but law enforcement can’t just throw investigative procedure out the window because it’s an emotional case.]
What would you like them to put on the death certificates? Same as above? They need to know how each victim died, that takes time. They also need to know how the crime happened, which might make it easier to prevent future, similar crimes. I hope you’re not suggesting it would have been kinder to just open the school doors and let the parents in to sift through and find their own dead children?
I assure you I was never suggesting any such thing.
Thank you for your post. This is more the sort of answer I was seeking.
I wasn’t suggesting this either, and your explanation shows me the importance of every autopsy in a way I hadn’t considered before.
An autopsy on your kindergarten age child seems the ultimate indignity and offensive on some level. Especially if your child is the 15th or whatever. I cannot imagine the toll this will take on the poor souls charged with that grim responsibility.
Again, thanks. It is at least somewhat comforting to know there is a reason beyond the vague, ‘an abundance of caution’.
There is definitely going to be a lot of secondary/vicarious trauma from this. I’m a newly graduated mental health counselor, and the website for the American Counseling Association immediately put up links to all their trauma resources. It’s so overwhelming.