Cut-off for cutting off enablers?

Say you’ve got someone who holds aberrant views to your mind. A hardcore QAnon Proudboys Nazi white supremacist, if that’s your personal anathema, or a Biden Democrat, if that’s yours.

Most of us would probably decide at some early point that this repellent person cannot be a part of your life. No more arguing, no more disputation, no more debate. Just go, never darken my door, etc.

What do you do with his spouse, if he/she is not an obnoxious idealogue of the aforesaid ideology? Just an enabler. “Yes, dear, whatever you say, dear, ok, I’ll vote for your candidate” and so on.

Cut her/him off? Okay, what do you do with his/her sister, who is disgusted by that ideology but still invites his/her spouse and him/her to parties where you’re invited? “Hey, what I can do–they’re family!”

How about a friend of the party-thrower? Say if you’ve decided that attending her/his parties is too much for you to bear, but this friend cheerfully (or not) attends said parties?

In other words, how far outward does the circle of “Gotta cut this person off” radiate?

I ask because my patience is growing very thin with enablers of all sorts.

I think many enablers are people who just aren’t willing or able to stand up to someone they disagree with, either out of fear or for some other reason. If they are a spouse or child they may just not want to argue and fight all the time because it’s exhausting and the enabled person’s mind will never change.

I know a few of those kinds of enablers and I remain friends with them because I can point out what they are doing and encourage them to stop enabling and stand up for what they believe in. It’s their choice, but if they see the impact their enabling is having they may decide to stop and fight back against whatever it is. It may take months or years, but sooner or later they’ll see how their passive enabling does more harm than good.

I’d say I’m somewhere just above or below this point. I suppose it would depend on the ratio of deplorables to normal people at the party. I’d be of the opinion that no one should invite the deplorables, but I could understand someone attending a big family event despite That One Guy being there.

But if it were a smaller event, or there was more than just one of Those Guys, it gets harder to justify. At some point you’re not just putting up with a deplorable for the sake of other family members, at some point, you’re actually socializing with Deplorables.

What about funerals? Are deplorable permitted?

No matter your beef, it’s breadth or depth, I’m thinking we’d all ‘make nice’ seeing them at a funeral for a neutral party.

( I sometimes have used this scenario, to remind myself, before I beg off, if it was ???’s funeral, I’d def suck it up and make quasi nice as required, how is this any more challenging than that would be? If I could do it then, I can do it now! )

Yeah, if they stay put in the box.

I wouldn’t see any good reason to cut off any of the ‘enablers’ based just on your description. I would make it clear to them why I’m done with ‘patient zero’ though. And, try to talk about the reasons, if at all possible. I wouldn’t pick a fight with ‘zero’, but might state explicitly why I can’t be around them anymore (although probably never actually say something like “I never want to see you again”, just make it known why it was I made myself scarce).

If I came to the conclusion that the cut-off radius would better grow, I would have to make those decisions on purely individual basis. I suppose it might depend on what exactly the enabling meant, but people in those kinds of situations could kind of be looked at as vistims of unfortunate circumstances. It’s very easy to tell the spouse of an alcoholist for example to ‘just leave’, but things are rarely that simple. I’d imagine perhaps even less in a situation like you are describing, of course depending hugely on specifics.

All of this of course depends on a lot of factors. Just to make an analogy, what if ‘patient zero’ had commited one of these: cheating on their SO vs. stealing vs. drunk driving vs. embezzeling vs. murder? Depending on how big of a moral failing you saw each of those to be, you might hypothetically cut off the relationship based on more than one, but you would still feel differently about the person in all cases.

From your description I couldn’t really tell what your criteria for defining the cut-off point would be.

Oh and sorry about your situation. I can sympathize, but I would still say understanding might go a long way, and it’s always good to remember people can change. There have been some in my life, that were gone before I had the chance to try, or even really realized what was going on.

No need. I find it strangely liberating to apply a very broad definition of “people I won’t talk to anymore because they hang out with people who hang out with people who hang out with people who hang out with people who hang out with people who hang out with people who hang out with people who hang out with people who like Trump.” Cuts back on my social life a bit, but in these pandemic times I’m willing to make all sorts of sacrifices.

I think you are misreading the OP. He’s asking at what point do you stop socializing with Suzie because she still goes to Bob’s parties and Bob is deplorable. Obviously you aren’t at Bob’s party, but should you cut everyone on the guest list out?

I tend to have a very high tolerance for people with “deplorable” views, though I do make sure to assert that I think they are wrong every time they bring it up. But if they are willing to keep their mouth shut, I am generally not going to cut them out of my life, and certainly aren’t going to make anyone else chose a side.

The phrase “cutting off your nose to spite your face” comes to mind. You cut out Bob because maintaining a relationship with Bob is detrimental, and cutting it off saves you grief. Sensible. But if you enjoy your relationship with Suzie, then cutting off that relationship is a cost and causes you grief. What would be your purpose in ending that relationship? What justifies that cost to you?

Well if they’re married you can’t cut one off and not the other. Or at least, I wouldn’t be friends with anyone who had such a low opinion of my would be wife.

Even when my ex and I were at our lowest point. I didn’t put up with people telling how awful she was.

But after the divorce,I vented and my friends vented with me.

Well, I’m fortunate. I don’t like people very much to begin with. Mostly they waste my time and drain my energy, so I’ve decided (with the help of Covid) to shoot for quality over quantity, and the Trump people are doing me a great service. I don’t need to do any work, really, to suss them out–they just open their yaps and start blathering stupid offensive nonsense designed to show me how well they understand the universe and I can cross them off my list of “People worth spending time with” tout suite. Very efficient. I can’t see why others remain so bent on giving people second chances–all that happens, in my vast experience, is that they will waste more of your time. Better to take them at their word, decide as quickly as you can that these offensive imbeciles are indeed both offensive and imbeciles, and move on with your life.

The only hard part is figuring out whether the obnoxious BS I just heard is truly a DQ, or if that was a decent person having a brainfart.

Also there are those I’ve become long habituated to enduring, most family members who I’ve had to put up with in the past. Out of my laziness, I’ve nurtured the bad habit of ignoring the stupid shit that extrudes out of their mouths. but in the past few months I’ve gotten better at realizing “Oh, hey, my cousin Jerry is genuinely dumb–and loud, consistent dumb, too! Best to add him to my ‘exile’ list ASAP.”

Sure, I get that. But the OP’s question isn’t about being friends with Trump people, it’s about whether to continue being friends with non-Trump people who maintain relationships with Trump people.

True that.

But the enablers of Trumpists are very often themselves Trump-friendly. And their enablers are often excessively tolerant of Trump BS. And their enablers are usually willing to let bygones be bygones with Trump BS, meaning they’ll overlook the crap that Trumpists said about me, personally, yesterday (“Traitor! Scum! Jew! Communist!” etc. none of which is actually true) if they haven’t said anything nasty today.

So better to adopt a hard cut-off, I think. Works for me, anyway.

No, I understood it. If Suzie was attending a party of 100 people, one of who was Bob, I’d probably be okay with it. However, if 90 of those people were Bob-like, then I’d serious have to re-evaluate my relationship with Suzie - why is she okay with that level of being Nazi-adjacent? Perhaps she’s not quite as anti-Nazi as I thought she was, and as I expect my friends to be?

I do not associate with Deplorable, no matter how far back we might go. Nothing constructive will come to either of us from the association so why make us both miserable.
I do not willingly associate with those who associate with Deplorable, no matter how far back we might go, because I have a difficult time believing they are not more morally flexible than I am comfortable with. Again, my fault or not, nothing constructive will come to either of us from the association.

I have plenty of people in my life with whom I have no qualms, morally. It would be wrong of me to waste time I could spend with them by hanging with people I simply do not respect or value. If that makes me an asshole, well then we both know one more person we don’t need to waste our time on.

Like the saying goes:
" if there’s a Nazi at the table and 10 other people sitting there talking to him, you got a table with 11 Nazis"

My cut-off would definitely include people who go to the same house parties as a known Nazi, so as wide a circle as the OP extended to.