Oh Scylla, I see you’re at it again. And you’ve got some live ones, who weren’t around when we had that train-wreck of a “Veganvegetariansim” thread a while back. And so you’re going to go through the whole rigaramole with them, and spew out all your anti-vegetarian crap, all over again. You know I love ya, Scylla, but maybe it’s time to go back to ranting about the Almish?
Good grief. I’ve never seen someone have such a hard-on about vegetarianism. What is with you? If you want to eat meat, go ahead. Leave the rest of us the HELL alone. You seem far more obsessed about who should be eating what than most vegetarians are. It’s a little weird, that’s what it is.
Yeah, this thing is about to degenerate into the same state of affairs we seem to get in every thread concerining vegetarianism…
“I hate militiant vegetarians/vegans!”
“Yeah, well, we hate militiant meat eaters!”
“Yeah, well veg*s are more militiant than meat eaters are!”
“No we’re not!”
“Yes you are!”
"No we’re not!
Both: “Why can’t you just leave us ALONE?!”
“Vegetarian/Vegan diets can never be as healthy as diets with meat! such-and-such cite says so!”
“That’s not true! such-and-such OTHER cite says so!”
“Yeah, well, my cite’s better!”
“No, mine is!”
“No, it isn’t”
“Yes, it is!”
“No, it isn’t!!!”
and so on. Maybe somebody should just compare meat eaters/vegetarians to Hitler and we can just get on with our lives. :rolleyes:
Scylla, you are just wrong on this point. If I eat meat and plants, I am an omnivore. Period. If I occasionally eat meat, I am an omnivore that sometimes adheres to a vegetarian diet. If don’t eat meat now and never intend to in the future, I am a vegetarian.
Using your logic, unless you are physically eating meat right now, we could consider (gassp!) you a vegetarian until your next meal. I am a vegetarian when I cease to eat meat. When I take my next bite of meat, I am no longer a vegetarian. I WAS a vegetarian, but no longer am. Doesn’t add up.
Scylla’s a vegetarian.
Scylla’s a vegetarian.
Scylla’s a vegetarian.
One of my favourite wacky syllogisms is the one that Nostradamus fans use to assert that he predicted Hitler’s rise to power:
[ul][li]Nostradamus wrote “A thin man will nearly subdue Europe” (or something to that effect.)[]Hitler was a vegetarian.[]Vegetarians are thin.Therefore, Nostradamus predicted that Hitler would menace Europe.[/ul][/li]
My brain hurts.
That’s kind of rude. I had what was supposed to be humorous rant once (what? 6 months? A year ago?) similar to this topic, and you show up and belittle my arguments and accuse me of having a hard-on for vegetarians because of that?
I guess it’s easier than actually debating, but I really do think better of you than that.
I also think I deserve. Based on that thread my arguments and my thinking has changed to a degree, and that’s reflected here.
I’m surprised you’d just me off like that (although I’m not surprised Lezler took the opportunity to run away from the hole she’d dug herself.)
And no. I don’t have a hard-on for vegetarians.
Macro Man:
I’d get a cite for you, but this is my work computer and I can’t look at multiple screens at the same time.
In the American Dietetic Association’s position paper on Vegetarianism, and in the FDA website, they categorize people who describe themselves as vegetarians/vegans.
They say a vegetarian is somebody with a meat restricted diet. Some vegetarians will eat eggs, dairy products or fish. The FDA, the ADA and the people in question theselves all use the term “Vegetarian.”
Vegans on the other hand, don’t consume animal products. There are degrees in this as well. Honey is an animal product, but I know of at least one fairly strict and self-avowed vegan who consumes honey. Perhaps others may have Jello.
I may be wrong, and that’s fine. People can call themselves whatever they want. The only thing that’s important is that we agree on terms for purposes of this discussion.
So again. My, the FDAs and ADAs definition of vegetarian = meat restricted, and covers different preferences. Vegan = does not consum animal products.
I should think not. That’s not my logic. That’s precisely one of the flaws of the True Scotsman fallacy that I pointed out.
(BTW, your consuming flesh with every breath and swallow you take, so if we want to pursue this (which I don’t,) it is logically consistent. Nobody ever is a vegetarian. Every bite of food contains animal organisms, as does every breath. One is always a carnivore. Not that I want to argue this silliness, I’d just point it out.)
I thought it was ulcers. The funny thing is, he was a pudgy little bastard, too, speed-freak or not.
Macro & Scylla – don’t you think it’s a bit tedious to argue over definitions of terms? It’s a bottomless pit. You can hash it out until we get into existential problems. Blame Aristotle- he’s given us very poor tools to describe things.
Maybe you should both sit down and read up on General Semantics or the Tao Te Ching, or something. Sheesh.
I haven’t run away from anything. Unfortuantly, I am at work and this is a workday so I do need to be somewhat aware of the time I spend actually doing work.
What hole have I dug for myself? I think your argument blows chunks. It’s utterly ridiculous. Anyone who would actually claim that vegans should “supplement” their diets with meat occasionally has absolutly no grasp whatsoever on nor respect for the concept of veganism. Macro was right on in shooting that one out of the water.
cercaria was right on and said what I was trying to say much more to the point. With any evidence you can show me, I can show you evidence to counter. The difference between you and me is I’m not sitting here insisting my way is the only way, as you are.
And all of that bullshit about breathing in animals and everyone being a carnivore? Are ya KIDDIN’ me? Nitpicking can be a sign of desperation in an argument.
If you didn’t want to argue the “silliness” you wouldn’t have brought it up.
But alas, we really are steering away from my original question for you, which was WHY DO YOU CARE? Seriously, why do you care what I eat? Why do you feel the need to preach that your way is the “right” way? Are you so closed minded that you cannot grasp the concept of there being alternative practices/diets/ways of life that may not be right or wrong, but merely different from yours?
If I were to eat meat, I would be violating a VERY MAJOR personal ethic. And for no good reason. And after 16 years, the idea of meat makes me queasy. I’ve spent over half of my life without meat and I’ll spend the rest of it that way as well, regardless of how much Scylla flops around like a headless chicken.
Clueless people abound. I know a nice, middle class mother who needs a good dose of common sense. Junior is in the 10% weight class. The reason is because his entire diet consists of squeezable yogurt, juice pops and apple juice.
Heh - I’ve been a recidivist omnivore for a couple weeks after nearly 10 years, (convenience, economics).
I’ll tell ya, the idea of eating animals still makes me queasy, but that ain’t nothing compared to the act. (TMI: digesting beef is a goddamned horrorshow when you aren’t used to it.)
Can’t wait 'till my budget can fit fresh produce again.
What is this? Scylla-amnesia? It may have started as “humorous”, but it didn’t end that way (after how many pages? 5?) and that was in no small part because of you.
I’ve debated with you enough already.
Ask any veggie Doper who has been here a while if they believe that.
Sorry, carry on. You have some new people to debate, after all. And the same question is being asked of you that I asked of you - why do you care?
Scylla, you’re dancing around the question of why you care. Of course you care about the people in the OP, everyone does. We want to know why you care about proving that a vegetarian diet isn’t healthy in your world. Why you refuse to accept the fact that neither party may be right. You haven’t answered that question
