Depression - again

Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share
41

I’m trying to figure out who you’re criticizing, Girl Next Door. Most people here have either:
(a) shared their experiences, which is a healthy and encouraged way of dealing with stuff like this;
(b) recommended professional help, which is hardly the same as giving professional help; or
© opined that there was no illness to speak of.

I reread the thread and I don’t see anyone claiming to be an expert on anything other than their own past. No diagnoses were given except the one implicit in the thread’s title. Maybe we skipped making the statement because it was obvious.

42

Reading Crick&Watson and fuzzy-wuzzy’s statements (and handy’s approval of them) made me oh-so-angry. Unless you have training in psycholgy or psychiatry, have personally experienced clinical depression, or are close to someone who has, there is no way you can know how devastating it can be.

Just for kicks, let’s try an analogy from Crick&Watson’s example: Someone with a fever, aches, chills, and runny nose might be tempted to guess that those are symptoms of influenza. Using C&W’s reasoning, if that person said “I have influenza”, obviously he/she does not, because to have a condition renders one unable to notice its symptoms. Preposterous, of course. It is the same thing for a mental illness like depression.

As a type II bipolar, I know what it’s like to have extended periods of depression. I’ve been depressed often enough to know what’s going on - it’s unpleasant yet familiar territory. I knew something was wrong when I did not have the energy to do anything but wake up, brush my teeth, go to work, do a mediocre job, come home, eat some toast, go to sleep and start again the next day. I slept in the living room for 6 months because walking to the bedroom at the other end of the house was more than I could handle. I was too sick to bathe regularly, let alone pay bills or cook, or anything equally complicated but necessary to normal healthy living.

And I knew I needed help - I had not always been like that - I even had the number of a therapist a friend recommended, but I could not make myself call. My insurance would have covered it, but I didn’t have the energy to go. Eventually my situation changed and I had the support I needed to work out some of the more behavior-related issues, but without medication and therapy, I know the symptoms would return.

There’s help out there. If you can’t get it on your own (as I couldn’t), ask someone you trust to call for you, just to make that first step.

Clinical depression is a real physical disorder. It is not something that’s in your head (well, the chemicals are in your head, but it’s not something a person makes up for sympathy). It can be helped with therapy by a licensed professional, medication prescribed by an MD, or a combination of medication and therapy. If you think you have a problem, talk to your doctor. There are specific diagnostic tools that can determine whether you are just having the blues or have a serious problem requiring care.

Again, best of luck to you.

Insert Random Witticism Here.

43

Perhaps I overreacted, Boris. I was rather incensed, most specifically by Crick & Watson and Fuzzy-Wuzzy’s comments (I think those are the “there was no illness to speak of” ones).

I, too, have sufferred from depression, and I know that meds helped me greatly. They had some inconvenient side effects, it’s true. But new meds are constantly being developed that help deal with them. Talking therapy can also help.

So I guess my beef is two-fold: first, to the dunderheads who say “you’re not really depressed, life sucks sometimes, get over it” I say “Holy shit, how can you say that? This could be a person’s life we’re talking about here!” and I also think their comments speak volumes about how far we still have to go to overcome the stigma associated with mental illness.

Two, to those of you saying “Don’t take the meds! They suck!” I would suggest that the same meds might be just the ticket for another, and also there are lots of different meds to choose from.

I am the webmaster for a program that works on destigmatizing mental illness:
http://www.mindsprogram.org

Again, apologies if my previous post came off as incoherent or reactionary. Mental illness as a real and genuine form of illness is a topic I feel strongly about.

Peace,

Leslie

Leslie Irish Evans
http://leslie.scrappy.net

44

For those of you who don’t understand, I’m going to see if I can make some analogies that will make some sense to you. I’m doing this because clinical depression is a common disease affecting, according to some studies, 1 in every 10 people in the U.S., and therefore it is likely that someone close to you, either family or friend, will exhibit symptoms and will desperately need your support.

Here is what our panic and/or anxiety attacks feel like. Imagine you’re on the 25th floor of a high rise office building. You step into the elevator, alone, and the doors close behind you. You press the button for the first floor and you begin your descent. Everything’s going along nicely – you may even be whistling a happy tune. Then all of a sudden – BAM – the elevator comes to a sudden, jarring stop, the lights flicker and then the elevator goes completely dark! Immediately your heart starts racing, your head starts spinning and even your ears block up. You start to panic, thinking that at any moment the elevator could go crashing down and you could die. You try to tell yourself that it’s only a temporary delay. Surely someone will be coming by soon to help you. You’re fully aware that your fears are unfounded – no one ever starves to death in a stuck elevator because no one notices that it’s not working. The walls feel like they’re closing in on you. The space keeps getting tighter and tighter as you try to will yourself to just relax. But the more time passes, the more panic and fear sets in. THAT is what we feel when we have an anxiety attack – unfounded fear, as though we’re trapped in a tiny space in the dark and the doors won’t open. I’m not suggesting that it’s the same thing as actually being stuck in an elevator. I’m saying that if you can imagine that feeling then you will know how our anxiety attacks feel to us.

Then consider this if you will. Alzheimer’s and Parkinson’s are neurological disorders that affect the brain, and as a result, the body as a whole. Imagine you know someone with Alzheimer’s. They’re in the early stages of onset so they have many lucid moments. They function well for the most part, but they’re aware that they have a disease which sometimes prevents them from completing ordinary tasks – even things as simple as getting out of bed. They call you up and start crying. They tell you that they KNOW they have to fix dinner so their family can eat, but they’re completely panicked because they can’t get up. Now would you tell them that they should just do it for the sheer joy of doing it, or would you rush to their side to help them through their crisis?

Or picture this scenario. A friend of yours has Parkinson’s. They’re fully cognizant of the fact that they have a disease which makes their hands shake. But the mere fact of knowing one of their symptoms is tremors doesn’t give them the ability to CONTROL those tremors. They may know what’s happening to them as it’s happening, but they’re powerless to do anything about it because their brain is misfiring the signals that will steady their hands so they can do things like use an ordinary household appliance. They call you up in tears. They’re scared because they know company is coming and they have to vacuum, but their hands won’t stop shaking and they need your help. Do you tell them to take some deep breaths and figure out some coping skills, or do you run over there and do whatever you can to help them?

People who suffer from clinical depression experience the exact same feelings of helplessness and lack of control in spite of knowing full well what it is we need to do. Understanding our disease and recognizing its symptoms, as in the case with Alzheimer’s and Parkinson’s sufferers, does not mean that we don’t actually HAVE the disease. Our minds may tell us one thing, but our bodies won’t cooperate. Clinical depression is a neurological illness! If a friend or family member ever calls you up and says that they’re having a panic attack and they need your help, PLEASE try to be as understanding and helpful as you would with anyone else suffering from a neurological disease that they can’t control.

“How wonderful it is that nobody need wait a single moment before starting to improve the world.” - Anne Frank

45

Techchick, bless you too, for your kind words and willingness to help others through this very frightening disease and its resulting symptoms. And to everyone else here who is also suffering, I offer my well wishes and hopes that you can conquer this illness. May G-d bless us all with good health, warm hugs, happy days, restful nights and good cheer this holiday season and throughout the coming year.

Shayna

“How wonderful it is that nobody need wait a single moment before starting to improve the world.” - Anne Frank

46

From Handy:

If a person knows he is a diabetic, is he really a diabetic? I can ask a diabetic patient of mine, “what makes you think you’re diabetic?” He could reply with a list of symptoms: “unless I take my insulin, my blood sugar is very high. If I don’t monitor my condition closely, I get sick and have to be hospitalized. I’ve had my left foot amputated because of gangrene- my circulation is very poor- and I’m going blind.”
I could then tell him, “hey! Either you’re not a diabetic after all, or you’re already half cured because you’re so self-aware!”

And from Crick:

I can’t speak for other depressed people, but as for myself, I’ve never once thought to myself, “Gosh, I don’t experience nearly enough joy!”
No; joy is not a goal for me. What I desire is to survive this day, or at least this afternoon, without killing myself. The only reason I feel the need to live is because I have three small children who would be badly hurt if I died; if not for that I would already have gone eagerly away. I have to not only keep living, but for the well-being of my kids I have to put on my best happy face and shove my problem aside. (Concentrating on caring for others and helping people isn’t enough, apparently, to improve my mindset; as a nurse and a mom, all I DO is take care of other people.)

Sure, it would be nice to feel a moment of joy once in a while, but I’d gladly settle for a little relief from this crushing pain.

Right now, the closest to “joy” I get is daydreaming about committing suicide, but I can’t even let myself indulge in this small pleasure.

Those who haven’t experienced depression often say things like, “I know how you feel. When my grandma died, I was really depressed.”
When my dad died, I grieved. I loved him very much; I still miss him. I guarantee that grief feels nothing like depression. Compared to depression, grief IS joy.

47

wooooo I should have known better than to give an opinion on this topic. I did not say at any point that there is no such thing as depression…I truly believe that there is. But it has gotten to the point where any time anyone is feeling a little blue or out of sorts with life…they are “depressed”. This lays a raw deal on the people who really do suffer…through no fault of their own…kinda like the little boy crying wolf. The ones that really do need help…get pushed in the group that really only wants to not face reality.
I will be the first to admit that I have not had depression as such…just a blue day here and there…and I cannot say that I understand the feeling. If for whatever reason I have offended anyone with an “opinion” then I apologize.

48

Okay, Girl Next Door, I can see better where you’re coming from. I thought you were criticizing everyone on the whole thread and now I see that I was wrong.

49

Yikes! Granted I failed to wrap my observations in velvet, but it was not my intention to attempt to address the entire mental health community, or take on any and all forms of depression related illness as a topic.

My intention was merely to offer to someone who sounded like a normal, rational, intelligent young woman who is going through a rough time the honest and suggestion that often subtle changes in routine and environment can succeed in altering one’s mood where pharmaceuticals and therapy have failed. I also wished to point out that it is often misplaced pride which is an obstacle to be overcome in cases where support of others is of major benefit. I failed to see how such a benign thought could provoke an outpouring of outrage.

Perhaps if previous suicidal thoughts had been mentioned a bit earlier I’d have had the sense to stay out of this altogether.

As I recall, the OP was, ‘Does anyone else feel this way?’ I believe ye have yer answer – nearly everyone seems to, especially now.
Dr. Watson

50

TC- I parrot/lemming most of the comments above.

I’ve found my depression sometimes comes from being in a rut. Not experiencing new things or going places or socializing. Prior to having kids, I did alot of all three, but still had bouts of the blues. ( I am actually less depressed about life since staying at home, because my home is my office and I’m the boss…ineffective as I am : ) )

I attribute the blues prior to kids as being stuck in a job that was really beneath my mental capacity and skills and the fear of trying to find something else out there in a new feild to learn all over again. That and having bosses that really didn’t recognize all the hard work that myself and a coworker did for their company. ( We ran the place.)Both of us were depressed most of the time while on the job, outside of work, it wasn’t so bad.

I’ve always found for myself that some form of exercize did wonders to clear my head from the damaging negative thoughts. Although, taking into considering how many mental hair shirts I was wearing, you’d think I’d weigh 90 lbs and be in triathalons every weekend.

This Christmas season always puts me into a funk. A funk that starts in Mid November and cruises through until after New Years. It probably always will.

51

Techchick, if you do start that message board. I would like to be a part of it.

If we can’t bring ourselves to get help in other ways, the least we can do is support each other.

52

I want to apologize for getting on the case of the two people in this thread as far as I went with my words. I had been drinking but your words made me feel just like my father was talking to me. He doesn’t understand and is one of the main people in my life that tells me to snap out of it.

The blues are one thing, the depresson is another. I am self employed and my finances are pretty screwed right now so as far as my job is concerned, it’s my fault. I am also a part-time web designer and should be working on a site right now, but my creative side is really screwed up. I am expected to have a main draft completed by Thursday…yeah right. I can barely focus enough on a graphic to make it work. I sit there and stare at the screen wondering why the hell I am a designer…yet when I am able to concentrate my graphics are actually quite good for someone with no formal training.

I have had 3 or 4 panic attacks in the last few weeks. Usually at a store. I start shaking uncontrollably. My voice shakes and I feel like I am going to loose my balance.

I had brought up my sleeping patterns as an example of knowing I am headed in that direction. Last night, I slept 12 hours. A few nights ago I slept 10 hours. I am usually a 9 hour a night person, but 10-12 hours is excessive.

I have no insurance, and since my finances are so tight (still paying on December rent) I can’t afford a $100.00 trip to a doctor and $100.00 in medications. (anti-depressant and ritalin) I know part of my problem is that my ADD is untreated right now. When I am on my ritalin, my world seems more together and I am able to do the things “normal” people do.

I suspect that I will have my depression board up by the 2nd week in January. I really have to focus on this other web site I am doing, so I will keep those updated that are interested.

Thanks again, I can’t thank some of you enough, for your understanding. I hope that we who are going through this, and discussing it will help some of us find some sense of calm while in our depression.

If any of you are on AOL, AOL has some good message boards and chat rooms. Go to keyword: OLP My last depression was helped greatly by going into those places. Sometimes really messed up people come in there to start crap, but overall it was a very positive experience for me…I met some people that understood what it was like and it countered my father’s thinking.

My psychologist at that time was concerned at first about the internet thing until I gave him more detail about what I was talking about in the chat room. I had done some other stuff on my alloted web space on AOL and showed it to him and he realized that it was actually helping me in a small way.

53

TechChick - if you lived closer, I’d give you my therapy appointment today. Sounds like you’re really having problems with the money thing, and believe me, I know what it’s like to either not have enough to manage, or be too tired to manage it when you do have enough. If there’s anything we can do to help you, just ask, okay?
We’re here for you.

It may be that when an ornithologist says the Water Ouzel walks under the water, he only means that he has seen a Water Ouzel or some other bird sitting on a stone in the general vicinity of a body of water.
–Will Cuppy

54

Techchick – I thank you for your discernment, and hope that you understand that my opinion was offered in good faith, and was not intended to offend, insult, dismiss, or denigrate. It wasn’t until yer fifth post that the depth of the situation became clear, and perhaps I should have led by asking questions rather than offering suggestions.

If I sound like yer father, I can only say that the man must care very much in his heart, and perhaps ye should overlook the crude expression of his thoughts, as ye have taken it in yer heart to overlook my own, and consider that his underlying message is one of consideration and honest worry for his daughter. I have children of my own, and would be stricken beyond expression by the knowing that one was suffering.
Dr. Watson