Do men ever grow up?

The BBQ Pit
21

Kat, these sterling qualities you point out are only just enough to get him qualified for “human being”, not “good husband”. I think refusing to grow up and be a responsible partner are plenty of reasons to consider divorce, especially when he refuses to change.

I’m not advocating divorce, Kat, but I will say:

You deserve better, and the only way you’re going to get what you deserve is to count on yourself, not someone else.

Badtz Maru - the girls you describe are just that - girls, and as long as you continue to lump all women into that category, they’re the only thing you’ll ever see.

22

Hey! That’s not true! I, personally, am 12 inside this 34 year old body! So there!!:stuck_out_tongue: Nener nener nener!!

23

Well, the same thing could be turned around and said about the OP.

24

Seriously, my parents have fallen into the same rut. In our daily episodes of Passive-Aggressive Theatre Presents, my mom plays the role of Nagging Shrew All-Mother, and my dad plays the Poisonous Arrested-Development Sulk-Head. After conducting an intensive, on-going field study of this phenomenon, I have only this to offer you: By picking up his slack, you encourage his bad habits, for which you will then resent him, even as he resents you in turn for condescending to pick up his slack. If you don’t nip this in the bud now, in twenty-five years neither of you will remember how to be your actual selves around each other, and will be forced to act out the same argument for every hour of every day, like zombies.

Do you actually call him on it when he pulls asshole stuff like trying to blame you for his theft of your lunch? Or do you fume to yourself, for fear that you’ll hurt his feelings, and let it sour you against him in general? He’s pushing thirty. There is absolutely no reason his feelings should be hurt when someone calls him on some inconsiderate bonehead move of his. If they are hurt, tough shit. If he hadn’t been an inconsiderate bonehead in the first place, he wouldn’t have had to hear it.

In your quest to avoid confrontation, you’ve inadvertently given him license to act like a butthead. He may never stop acting like this, but if he does, it certainly won’t be because you asked him nicely with your voice, even while your actions tell him he has no reason to change.

Just a bit of advice, which is worth, I hope you’ll remember, every cent you paid for it, from a kid who’s seen where this can end up.

25

Seems to me the question you have to ask yourself is: “Do I want to be his wife or his mother?” Either you’re his partner or his boss - at least that’s my take on things. You two need to define your roles in a way that works for you. At least that’s what I’d advise if I was your counselor… but what do I know…

Good luck.

26

I have to agree with the last two posts…coming from a classic “enabler”. (I work on this constantly just like a recovering alcoholic or addict.) This guy will never grow up if you do not let him. He will never learn to put others needs above his own.

I also have to agree that just because he doesn’t drink, beat you, etc. that does not make him adequate husband material. You are ill with a progressively degenerative disease. I can only imagine how it must worry you at times that this person you have chosen to spend your life with may not be up for the task of handling the enevitable. I imagine that you probably have plenty of help and support from your family. Good for you and good luck.

Obviously you are dealing with some pretty annoying situations or you wouldn’t be in counseling. Perhaps if you use a similar approach to dealing with your big child the same way that an AlANON wife might deal with an alcoholic spouse. Do not do anything for him that he should be doing for himself. Do not smooth over, cover up, or pick up the pieces of any of his messes. He won’t like it but eventually he will realize that these are things he must develop the discpline to do for himself. Luckily he is only spoiled and selfish, not impaired by drug or alcohol abuse.

I know I stated that many a man I have come into contact with was selfish, but then we women are at least half responsible for raising them. I too am guilty of spoiling my children, my son in particular. And like I stated before, selfishness is not necessarily an exclusively male trait.

Needs2know

27

I just have to say this–every man I have ever known has or has had a mother. Almost every woman and/or mother I have ever known claims to have been or to be the parent most responsible for child rearing/nurturing/training. If this be so, if the woman does do the bulk of the child rearing/nurturing/training and boys still grow up to be less than satisfactory men, maybe women should re-evaluate their child rearing/nurturing/training methodology.

28

…I don’t think I made myself very clear, so I’ll try again.

I’ve been living with my husband for 16yrs and sometimes he seems to be losing ground in the maturity department. But he has other charms and gifts that are of far more import.

The truth is that we are all flawed beings. But your friends love you anyway. And you love them anyway.

It’s like your children, you forgive them their flaws and their differences from you. In a sense you have to release them to become whatever is their destiny whether you understand it or not.

If you really want this man to become the man you hoped he was when you married him then you need to let him learn his life lessons for himself. Truly, it’s like pushing a rope. You weren’t put on this earth to direct his life journey and determine his learning pace. I believe that falls into the realm of the Gods.

If you control/can predict all of his actions/reactions when will he ever be able to impress/touch you with his own actions/reactions?

The flip side is that you will sometimes be stunned into silence by the things that seem boneheaded.

This is not a male female issue, it goes both ways.

You gotta take the bad with the good, I’m assuming there is some good or you wouldn’t have married him.

29

First, whatever you are doing now is obviously not working and hasnt worked in three years. So you will have to change something. What I see so much in relatonships is people trying the same fix over and over and over again.

One thing that helps me think about my relationship is to ask the hard question first: “Am I willing to leave over this?”

If the answer is no, then your only other option is to find a way to live with it. It is that simple, and clears out the deadwood.

The other thing I would do is to try and decide what it is that really bugs you, and focus on that. It sounds like there is so much going on that it is muddleing your thoughts, and you can’t hardly tell what is driving you crazy, and what is the “fallout craziness”–the stuff you could live with, or maybe wouldn’t even notice, if the other stuff wasn’t there to set your teeth on edge. The problem with this (in my own experience, YMMV) is that to the SO the nagging and anger from the “fallout craziness” seems as heartfelt as the “real craziness” and since in those cases you are overreacting, you become easy to dismiss. For example, when someone has been an ass all day, but the straw that breaks the camel’s back is something like a dish towel on the floor, all they see you reacting to is that dish towel, and by that standard you are a screaming harpie.

I only have what you have written, which is just a small piece of the pie, of course, but I would suggest that you seem more irritated by his attitude than by his actions. I can understand this. A friend and I have similiar husbands in that they don’t do much around the house and have to be asked (nagged) to do what they do do. However, I think her situation is infinitly worse because my husband thanks me, and admits that in this area I am the better person. Her husband seems to harbor deep guilt feelings about this or something, because he refuses to admit that he slacks around the house. Instead, he takes what she does as some sort of insult, or feels compelled to point out other things he does do, and take the offensive by accusing her of not appriciating him. He can never just thank her. The behavior is the same, the attitude completly different.

So I would suggest you not even worry about the actions for a while and concentrate on the attitude. Occe again, I have only what you have written, but it sounds to me that if he would at least admit that he has a problem (and “absentmindedness” is the nice word for the problem, and the one you should use between the two of you. “Chronic lack of empathy” is what you can call it to yourself) and that the two of you have to find a way to deal with this (even if that way is your mothering him) Hopefully, a lot of the anger will fade, and you will have the emotional energy to maybe start working on the behavior.

Lastly, if your counseling sessions have turned into a ritualized experience that you can predict and which you know do no real good, then change counselers. It obviously isny doing any good the way it is now.

As a final note, I want to chime in on the “this is not a gender thing” chourus.