How to put this? I think that on many levels, I am too uptight. Here’s a situation that rolls around relatively often: I meet someone who is perfectly pleasant to me, then find out later that he or she has done something in the past or is currently doing something that I find despicable. It doesn’t affect me, and in fact, he or she is being polite and friendly to me. Of course I am perfectly polite back, but I have trouble being friendly. My husband, on the other hand, has no trouble saying “he’s a good guy” about a convicted wife-beater.
One time a friend/co-worker of mine was telling me about a woman he used to know who had gotten pregnant by one guy, and told another guy he was the father, then married the non-father without ever telling him the truth. My friend then says, “She’s a really good person.” I just can’t wrap my mind around that kind of thinking. The way I see it, she’s not a good person; she’s a bad person. Sure, maybe not all day long, but that is a particularly heinous act.
I recently met a couple who have an eight-year old. The father is 36 and the mother just told us there is a ten-year age difference between them. Presumably she’s 26, then, since she doesn’t really look 46 and she has a two-yr-old. So if she’s 26, then nine years ago she was a 17-yr-old having sex with a 27-yr-old. A grown man with a career having sex with an underage high-school girl. I understand that a lot of people think that is just swell, but I think it’s abominable, and it’s definitely criminal in the US. (I blame the man, not the girl). Anyway, this has colored how I perceive the husband. Maybe even he thinks now that he was wrong then, but I’ll never know. I can’t grill him for information!
Right On Girl,
I hate stupidity. If, in my opinion, the person in question is doing or has done something stupid, well then, that it is, they are stupid, and I want nothing to do with them. Stupid covers every aspect of life.
Not to defend the man, but:
Having sex with a 17 yr old is not necessarily illegal, though.
He may not have known her true age. I have met many 15/16 yr olds who look like they are in their 20’s.
But you are on the right track. And there exist many people who do think just like you.
Oh, this is me, too. I can no longer enjoy Sean Connery movies after I read in some interviews what a misogynist he was.
And I used to have a wonderful time chatting with a bunch of friends in a MUD. I really liked this one fellow I’ll call T–he was funny, smart, fun-loving, generous of spirit. But then T decided to leave his wife and move cross-country to be with another person in our group with whom he had started a cyber relationship. I don’t blame him for leaving an unhappy marriage, but he had two young children. Two young children who ought to have him in their lives! It would have just as easy (easier, even) for the other party (who was unemployed) to move nearer to T so he could be within driving distance of his former family, but he wanted to completely “start over” I guess. I was so freaked out by this, it completely changed my opinion of him. I could hardly even talk to him. It ruined the experience of our group for me.
I have other examples, but you get the idea.
I realize I shouldn’t be such a judgmental hag because I am far from perfect. But when I know someone has done something that I consider awful and inexcusable, I can’t reconcile it. It’s all I can do to continue to be polite.
Um, isn’t there a chance the eight-year-old is a stepchild or adopted child, and the parents simply don’t feel the need to announce this information to everybody they know?
I will usually just ignore them. Because essentially, they are simply not worth the oxygen.
I can be very unforgiving sometimes. If the mistake was an honest mistake, I can forgive and forget. However, if the person knew what they were doing was wrong and did wrong willingly, then I have better uses for my oxygen.
One of the reasons I hated living in the Middle East, was the general belief that women are nothing more than sex-slaves or property, and that is the general practice, beleive me. Women were treated horribly over there. Marriage is not for love, but for reproduction. And making love is replaced by legal rape.
Not quite my cup of tea. I still prefer a more civilised lifestyle.
It is possible she was 18, and was still 18 when she had the child, or that someone was rounding when they described a ten-year age difference, or, as someone else has pointed out, the child was adopted or is a biological child only of the father.
one stupid desicion does not an asshole make
I’ll be the first to admit that I am often too forgiving when it comes to people doing “bad” things, but I probably fall into the category that your husband does, bluethree. When people are generally nice, that’s how I think of them. I cannot look at friendship I receive and be cold in response because of something I know about the person. FWIW, I am not aware of any friends being wife/spouse beaters or doing anything particularly heinous or evil, and I don’t know exactly how I’d react to that, but my guess is that I’d distance myself from that person, but when I did see them I’d still be happy to see them, and I probably would say afterwards, “gee, so and so’s a really nice guy… too bad he had to go and steal all the walkers from the nursing home.”
A judgement error is not the same as intentionally doing bad.
But, I am always polite, courteous and respectful, regardless of what I think about a person. However, if possible, I do avoid people who intentionally do bad things.
If it was one thing in the past, I can also over look that, too.
Just because he was convicted for child molestation/rape/murder/your choice ten years does not make him a bad person. It does make him a person I do not wish to be associated with, nor do I want my family associating with him either.
I judge people on how they treat ME, not how they may or may not have treated other people. Of course, there’s always exceptions to the rule - mass murderers, etc. but I don’t tend to meet them often. I think it’s bad to judge people based on this kind of stuff.
First off, you’re judging people based on gossip, or at best, an extreme lack of facts. Like Fretful pointed out in the example of the eight year old, there’s at least two reasonable explainations as to why a 26 year old may be mothering an 8 year old. And regardless, if she was a 17 year old having sex with a 27 year old, and it grew into a loving marriage, what’s the problem there? Maybe he was an extremely immature 27 year old, and she was an extremely mature 17 year old. You just don’t know.
Also, people change. With the case of the pregnant woman marrying someone she knew was not the father, maybe she’s been living in guilt since then. Maybe she was young and scared when she was pregnant, and she thought the guy who was not the “real” father would make a much better father than the real one. Maybe the real father was a drug dealer, wife beater, who knows? Everybody tries to make the best decisions they can at the time, and the addition of stress and fear can make us make bad decisions. All we can do is pick ourselves up, dust ourselves off, and go on with life. I’m sure that if you delved into the deep dark secrets of almost anyone, you’d find stuff that would make them a “bad” person. Judging from what you say in the OP, I know I qualify!
Thanks for your responses. I’m glad to know that I’m not completely alone in this.
As for the couple I referred to earlier, it’s true that the oldest child could be adopted, they could have been rounding up their ages, or the wife could actually be 46. It would be rude of me to ask, though, as I don’t know them well enough to get into that kind of conversation with them.
And even if he did poach on a teenage girl, that was almost ten years ago and he could be a completely different person now–I don’t know that either. I just used it as an example. Interestingly, when his wife mentioned the ten-year age difference, the husband gave her that momentary look, the glance that says, “remember, we weren’t going to bring that up in public.”
Most likely all of us have good friends who delight us with their wit and kindness, who have done something reprehensible at some time, whether consciously or by accident. If I have a good friend for a long time, and then find out he/she has been very bad, I’m likely to be forgiving about it. On the other hand, when I hardly know someone, and he/she brags about having successfully perpetrated fraud (for example), I have a hard time extending a friendly hand.
I was afraid I would be in the minority and get totally flamed, so I’m glad that didn’t happen (yet). And it’s not like I hold people’s preference in sports teams or politics against them.
I would have to think that if we failed to forgive everyone that did something wrong we would have no friends. That is why I mentioned the continuing effort and specific intent to do wrong, treat people badly, or whatever.
I have recently devoted the majority of my life and money to helping those less fortunate than I. Many of these people have done some really stupid things in their lives, and I still help them. But those that still knowingly and willingly do stupid things do not receive any assistance from me.
Mr reasons are based on how people have treated me. Almost noone wanted to help me when I was at my lowest point. And I do not want others to feel as hopeless as I felt. I like to think that humans can still show some form of kindness towards one another.
Or that the husband is not the father of the child. There are a number of explanations that they may not want to discuss. Particularly with someone who seems very ready to assume the worst.
Good people sometimes do stupid bad things. I’d much rather be friends of one of them than with someone who can’t wait to judge everyone else’s mistakes and then gossip about them.
I am just curious – would you still feel that this was a problem if you found out she was 18 (because of approimation or some such thing) at the time? Do you think it would still color the way you feel about the husband?
I have a very high tolerance for forgiving and forgetting, and I’m all for the Biblical credo, “Judge not lest ye be judged,” but…
I was mildly infatuated with a guy from kindergarten to 12th grade. He and I were close friends. My senior year in H.S., I discovered he was not only committing credit card fraud, but also that he got his freshman girlfriend pregnant and was beating her before and during the pregnancy.
He and the same girl, now his wife, still live within a mile from my parents, and I barely even nod when I pass him. Even if he got help, and even if she forgave him, I’m just not sure I can.
Another example:
One of my best friends became pregnant when we were fifteen. The guy refused to acknowledge the child and never paid a dime in child support or showed up for court dates. When my friend wanted to marry at the age of 23, and her new husband wanted to adopt her son, the only way the biological father would sign the adoption papers was if my friend agreed to cancel all back child support payments. He SOLD his son. I don’t see him often, but when I do, I feel nothing but hatred for him. I see no need to be polite at all.
And a brief third story:
My sister discovered her husband was charging hookers and strippers on her credit card. I got no love to give him either.
I have a cousin whom i will not mention the name of.
I have known her from birth (shes 5 years younger than me) and have always thought her a good person. however, i have recenlty heard from several reputable sources that she is now prostiuting herself to mexican men to suport her coke (cocaine) habbit. (not a racist statement, she ONLY does it with mexican men)ok…so this is bad…but the worst part is…SHE IS ONLY 13…her partners are old enough to be her father.
She admits to this pratice when asked about it. Heck, ive recenly seen her snort coke. her mother was told about her sneaking out of the house at 1 in the morning to ride off with strange men, but she simply denies that her daughter could do somthing like this.
I have nothing to do with this whole branch of my family now…hopefully i will be able to get some video evidence of her leaving the house and hopping into cars one night, and show this to her father, who will definitely do somting about this pratice.
I can usually ignore stuff that doesn’t pertain to me personally. One of my best friends cheats on his wife whenever he gets a chance, has hit her several times, steals and otherwise rips people off, and does a terrible job of providing for his 4 children. I don’t really hold that against him, though - I’ve told him a few times that I disapproved of certain things he did, but he’s still my friend, and in other ways he’s a likable person and a loyal friend. I can’t really judge him because I have done some bad things myself in my life, and would not like it if someone treated me poorly because of it when I had done nothing to them.