On one of the few occasions that my SO and I engaged in this activity, I dicussed how her O’s were always digitally, or orally stimulated. She replied that it was a myth that women had O’s from penetration alone. She said that some sort of stimulation above and beyond actual intercourse was nearly always necessary no matter how long the man could last it would never be enough. Is this the case? I realize that clitoral stimulation is primary in the female O, but I thought that this could occur indirectly from penetration.
Depends on the woman, no? Clitoral stimulation is the easiest way for most women to come, and that’s not really facilitated by penetration (although some women have clitorides positioned such that it does work.) Vaginal stimulation may work, especially if her g-spot is sensitive, but it’s not a sure bet.
In short, no, most women don’t orgasm just from penetration. There are some positions that make it easier to more fully stimulate the g-spot, but the bottom line is that no matter how big the guy is, and how long he lasts, intercourse on its own is usually not enough.
The figures I recall are that about 75% of women never experience orgasm from penetration but do by other means. Some surveys show that up to 25% of women don’t have regular orgasms at all during sex with a partner. I’m sure they do better with a vibrator though.
her? Just stimulate her digitally, or orally before or after and then do your business in three to five minutes since even if you lasted all day it’s only going to make her sore!
It depends on position.
I come when on top, because of the position of the clitoris and the penis hitting the g-spot. I have a harder time coming without penetration, but I can’t come at all with out clitoral stimulation.
(Roland, please please please stop typing the first line of your reply in the title box… please?)
(Roland, please type your post in the “message” section rather than starting in the title section. It’s annoying, as it’s very difficult to quote and doesn’t show up on the topic review.)
Many women enjoy penetration for its own sake, physically, psychologically, or both, even if it doesn’t provide the sort of stimulation necessary for them to orgasm. Hence, they may be dissatisfied with partners who don’t have much stamina simply because the experience doesn’t last long enough, not just because it doesn’t induce an orgasm.
I consistently bring my GF to O by keeping it in all the way and simply pounding away (usu. from below).
Well, just because she’s not having an orgasm, that doesn’t mean it’s not doing anything for her. The big O is NOT end-all and be-all of a woman’s sexual pleasure. And, of course, there’s the tiny little matter of women who are able to have orgasms through intercourse alone (this is often position-dependent). So the point is that she’s probably enjoying it, at least up to a certain point.
Every woman is different. Some women would be perfectly happy to follow your 3-5 minute plan. Others wouldn’t be at all satisfied with that, ever. A lot of women would fall somewhere in the middle, or swing back and forth between the extremes. I think the third category covers most women, in fact. Depending on a whole lot of factors, the exact same act of intercourse could leave the exact same woman thinking, “Damn, I was just getting started!” or “For god’s sake, would you just hurry up and come already?”
For those who do have orgasms just from intercourse, there are a lot of contributing factors. Some positions can provide clitoral stimulation, but not all. Woman-on-bottom missionary doesn’t give clitoral or g-spot stimulation, so it can be really hard for a woman to have an orgasm in that position. If that’s your preferred position, then you could last till the Trump of Doom, and she might never have an orgasm. However, state of mind, hormone balance, thoroughness of preparatory work, they’re all as important as position. Especially state of mind and thoroughness of foreplay.
It’s a vastly unfair fact of female sexuality that we cannot think about anything else and have an orgasm. You can have that little voice in the back of your head nattering on about what you have to do at work tomorrow, and how the dogs are due for shots, and what you should make for lunch, does your ass look fat from this angle, are you going to get off like this, etc., or you can get off. You simply cannot do both at the same time. If you can’t shove all the other crap out of your mind for a while (and that’s often quite hard), you aren’t having an orgasm, especially not from penetration alone. Same for lack of adequate foreplay. The physical effects of inadequate foreplay usually center around inadequate lubrication. (Just because there’s wetness there, it doesn’t mean we’re good to go. There’s as big a difference between wet and wet enough as there is between a frying pan being hot and hot enough.) Trust me, lube is a big issue in the ability to orgasm from intercourse alone, as are the physical changes in the vagina itself during arousal. Inadequate foreplay can also lead to the mental state issues I mentioned before.
Generally a good description, but two points. First, by the studies it is at least a quarter of women who can orgasm by intercourse alone, and by my own informal study conducted over the last several years, all women. Of course I have a hard time determining exactly what they mean by intercourse alone, and whether they consider intercourse positions that result in significant clitoral stimulation to be “alone” or not.
Secondly, woman on bottom missionary can be the best (or second best compared to woman on top) position for clitoral stimulation. The key is to allow the man’s pelvis to rub over the area. This is accomplished by not thrusting, but rather sliding the entire pelvic area. If the man considers his hip joints to be fused it will accomplish what I am talking about.
Also, remember that when they say “can” come from a certain method, they do not mean “will” come from that method.
Lastly, it is best to remember that above and beyond all the general trends we talk about, every woman is different. Things that work for one do not woro for others. There are women out there who cannot come from anything other than intercourse (except perhaps self stimulation).
I keep seeing people referring to G-Spots, but this is still a matter of controversy. In fact, I think the mainstream position is that it doesn’t exist at all. Instead, those in the “mainstream” maintain (I think) that what women call G spot stimulation is in fact indirect clitoral stimulation. Here’s an idea to help settle the matter. Have women have sex while actively having a PET scan of the perineal area. Compare the scans of those women who claim “G-Spot” stimulation with those who say they don’t experience this phenomina. There should be a difference in the scans, with the area of the “G-spot” being lit up due to action potentials occuring in the nerve cluster which would have to correlate with any such spot.
You’re neither a doctor, nor a woman. How can you purport to know thing one about g-spots? I’m sure it’s not just the collective imagination of the majority of women in the world. Maybe sex would be a more enjoyable thing for your SO if she knew that you were listening to what she had to say about this mythical g-spot, rather than fantasizing about PET scans of her pelvic region. Women have this “nerve cluster” in their heads that need to be taken into account, before you go “diving straight for the clitoris”.
To be fair to our inquisitive friend here, it’s quite possible to know something about a part of the body without possessing either that part or an MD. That’s one of the wonders of the internet.
I don’t believe that the existence of the G-spot is in question anymore, as long as it’s narrowly defined as a particular area of the vagina that, for many women, feels unusually good when stimulated in a certain way. That’s all it needs to be in the context of this thread, as we’ve been discussing sexual positions that stimulate that area. (I think people are still debating a bit over what causes the sensation, though, as well as over the whole female ejaculation thing.)
Dnooman, I am simply pointing out what I believe to be the case, that is to say that medical science doesn’t subscribe to the “G” spot. If I am in error then please correct me, rather than launch into speculation as to what would improve my sex life (unless that is germaine to the question). The fact that I’m not a Dr. has little bearing on the issue. There are many Dr’s who subscribe to notions well outside the mainstream (that doesn’t of course mean that they are incorrect) the late Dr. Atkins being one such person. I believe in many things outside the mainstream as legitimate possibilities ghosts, UFO’s ect. however, I don’t introduce them into discussion without specifically referencing the fact that I realize that science has not accepted these things. In the same way I am just pointing out that a statement made in passing referencing the “G” spot, is something not accepted my many if not most Dr’s and mainstream science.
Well, the Great Cecil has two articles with references to the g-spot:
http://www.straightdope.com/classics/a1_069.html
http://www.straightdope.com/columns/011130.html
From the second:
(Bolding mine)
I have had 5 partners in my life and I am one of those weirdos who can o from penetration. Only; actually.
My former hubby did not engage in any sort of foreplay whatsoever (don’t ask), and it worked.
I am weird…
Can be for some women, perhaps, but not for this woman, or for any woman she’s ever discussed the subject with. As with all things sexual, ymmv, but given the choice between two reports about what does or does not provide clitoral stimulation, I’m gonna side with the people who actually have clits. No offense. If it were a discussion of penile sensitivity, I would totally believe you and your male friends over some random woman.
As for the G-spot, what medical science accepts or doesn’t has very little bearing on what a woman feels. Who gives a damn about what some study with a whopping 12 people (talk about your possibility for skewed sampling) shows? I know what I feel, and I know what causes me to have an orgasm. Sex isn’t about science, it’s about what two people feel. Dr.J can doubt that existence of the G-spot all he wants to in the academic world, as long as he’s treating what I feel as real where it actually matters.
I recall a segment on HBO’s “Real Sex” where there was a diagram of several different types of vaginas. It was to show the differences on how women could achive orgasm during intercourse. There were different names for them based on where the clitoris was located. The one with the clit in an optimal location for stimulation during intercourse was called something like “The Deer” since she could more easily have an orgasm quickly. Another was named “The Buffalo” because the clitoris was not in an optimal place and getting an orgasm through intercourse would be a much longer process.
I don’t know how scientific that was, but it seems reasonable that women who have their pieces in the right places to be stimulated by intercourse would be more able to orgasm through intercourse alone.
Of course the man’s technique will have a lot to do with it. If he’s just in-out-in-out there won’t be a lot of clitoral stimulation other than the flat pressure when he’s all the way in. Moving more in-up-out-in-up-out will work better. On the up stroke, I usually try to really get the feeling that I’m rubbing my pelvic bone against my wife’s clit and it seems to work well. She can orgasm from me-on-top intercourse alone with that in-up-out motion. (She can do it easier if she’s on top, though) Just in-out wouldn’t do it for her. Also, when she’s getting close, I don’t do the in-out motion. I just do a up-down rubbing motion on her clit. Usually I have to press a lot of my weight on that area. Sometimes it’s so much pressure that afterwards, the skin feels a little ‘raw’ around my pubic bone. But it seems to work.
That technique isn’t really ‘penetration alone’ since it’s penetration with clitoral stimulation. But unless you’re running some sort of orgasm experiment, why not give her penetration and clitoral stimulation at the same time?
The Clitoral Truth is a great book that explores the theory that the clitoris is actually much larger than many anatomists believe. Its author argues that the G-spot is actually a part of the anatomical tissue that should be considered part of the clitoris. A good read.
That’s why I think that PET scans would be especially useful in shedding some light on the issue. This is because they show the metabolic activity of specific cells/areas relative to others. If something “different” is going on deep in the vaginas of some women, but not others then there is a good chance it will show up. Even if such an investigational technique doesn’t ultimately pan out don’t dismiss something that could probably qualify as a PhD thesis at many Universities. Of course there is the issue of getting the glucose/tracer dye to be taken up by the relevent tissues.
Another, possibility is that “referred pleasure” is occuring in these women. There is a good deal of research on so called “referred pain”, perhaps this could be a similar phenominum (but I’m reaching).
That would indeed be a fascinating study, assuming you could find enough women capable of first getting aroused and then having sex, and then managing to have an orgasm under laboratory conditions and during a pet scan to be statistically significant. That’s a heck of an assumption, though.