Doctor Who - Season 3 Episode 4, great big spoilers!

See what a nice person I am, I’m not even going to post the name of this episode in the Title as it could possibly be considered a spoiler for those not exposed to the new season as of yet. I’ll even do the whole extra measures to ensure that it doesn’t show up on mouse-over.

So, anyway, Season 3 Episode 4 - Daleks in Manhattan, or, as someone on TWOP so cleverly coined: “Sec’s in the City”. :smiley:

I feel very meh about this episode, although I am trying to keep in mind that it’s only part one of a two-parter and I should probably reserve judgement. I’m a bit burned out on Daleks, honestly. And I know, as someone so aptly put last week, searching for plot holes in Doctor Who is…well, just pointless. But come on!!!

Why are the Doctor and Martha now taking another detour with no explanation of whatever happened to “You get one trip and that’s it”?

What exactly was that glowing green artificially engineered muck that pointed the Doctor toward Skaro and, therefore, the Daleks? And why didn’t the Doctor just take it back to the TARDIS to analyze instead of spending so much time wiring it up in the theatre?

Why didn’t the Daleks recognize the Doctor? He was standing right there in plain sight, these were the same 4 Daleks that recognized him so quickly in Doomsday, and he hasn’t even regenerated since then! Come on!!!

WTF is up with the Daleks? I understand the purpose of the Cult of Skaro is to think more like humans, but they can’t honestly think that becoming human is a good way to accomplish this! Now they have no armour! No laser! No sucker! Someone can just walk up and punch them in their big ugly heads!

And for the love of all that is holy, why does the Doctor get to change his suit and poor Martha is still stuck in that party outfit? I can only assume after visiting 16th century England and the exhaust-choked motorway of New New York, that outfit has got to be getting a little ripe.

But anyway, hopefully all this and more will be answered next week. And I did quite like Hooverville, Tallulah (the stereotypical showgirl who managed to ask way more Excellent Questions than Martha), the shots of the workers high up on the Empire State Building and the Doctor’s angst at the continued survival of the Daleks.

Reviving, as this episode just aired on Sci-Fi in the US.

As per the last thread, please put anything that has not aired in the US in spoiler boxes. Anything that has aired in the US or from the earlier Series is fair game.

That the Daleks are very, very bad needs no spoiler.

That it’s revealed in Episode 57 that the Black Dalek has iset up residence inside K-9 should be boxed.

I haven’t got too much to say regarding this episode, except to this:

From the Daleks’ point of view, Doomsday could have occured after this episode. Also, The Doctor had Martha ask the questions, so they wouldn’t recognize him.

Actually it was the BBC that came up with that.
Cite (you may not want to click on that as it has a full episode title list).

I think it’s safe to assume that the “one trip and that’s it” business is over. It was a variation on the “meet cute” that The Doctor often does with companions. He was hurting over Rose and (inexplicably) the bride woman turning him down, so instead of presenting the Companionship in terms of “you can come with me” it was “I’ll reward you with one trip and then it’s straight home.” He modified it almost immediately to “one trip forward, one trip back” and it’s a short hop from that to full-time Companionism.

I assumed it was residue of one or more runs of the Final Experiment or whatever. And do we know where the TARDIS is at the moment? It’s tighter storytelling to have him futz with some wires in one place instead of traipsing back to the TARDIS with the muck and then back to the theater.

The TARDIS is on Liberty Island - Not exactly convenient.

I noticed that The Doctor merely said, “I’m sorry” to the Pig Slave instead of “I’m sorry. I’m so sorry.” I guess he got the memo that “I’m sorry. I’m so sorry” was last season’s catch phrase.

I thought this episode was the worst this season so far. Too much Daleks. Also, what’s this about Martha being in love with the Doctor, 3 episodes in?

The Christmas special was even worse though. I think it was supposed to be “wacky” OR “zany” but it was just irritating. I just wanted someone to shoot that bride so she’d stop screaming.

I’ll reserve judgment until the second half, but the shot of the monster at the end was really one of the least convincing rubber masks in the history of the series. The hybrid idea was a serious mistake: the Daleks need to remain in their tin cans, otherwise, they spoil.

But I do like 30s Manhattan; it’s one of my favorite time periods. Still, it did require a bit of suspension of disbelief to think a Black man would be accepted as a leader by whites in that era.

But at least the New York accents improved since the last time the Doctor visited the Empire State Building. :slight_smile:

Sure, she was irritating. However, one thing about Dr. Who that I find annoying is that far too few people are just plain terrified or in awe of what exactly is going on. She was much more the ‘everywoman’ of the situation.


Now, is part of the reason that people don’t wig this telepathic field that supposedly links TARDIS-riders together so they understand alien languages and such? I don’t remember that from pre-Eccleston Doctors and don’t recall seeing the introduction of it in the new series (I also don’t think I’ve seen the introduction of the psychic paper although it’s been explained other times). It would make sense, as long as the TARDIS is linking people together, for it to transmit some of The Doctor’s “travelling through space and time is perfectly all right” vibe.

It was mentioned by the Tom Baker Doctor in “The Masque of Mandragora,” which was set in Renaissance Italy. Sarah Jane asks why she can understand what everyone was saying and the Doctor explains “It’s the gift of the Time Lords” (I’m pretty sure he did not say “TARDIS”). The Ecclestone version expanded it a bit.

The mechanism is not well explained, but the gift has always been limited to automatic translation of languages. But the new series has been giving the TARDIS many new qualities.

Wow, people actually replied this time. Last time when this thread died a quick and merciful death, I assumed everyone felt pretty much the same about this ep as I did.

Most of my bitching still stands.

If Doomsday occured after this episode, why would the Cult of Skaro be out of their Void Ship? And as far as Martha asking the questions and the Doctor skulking around behind her and Frank, in Doomsday those same four recognized him “as enemy” after spotting him dashing quickly across the screen behind a fleet of Cybermen, in a regeneration that they’d never seen before. It just didn’t sit with me that they didn’t notice him whatsoever standing in a group of, what, four people?

Fair enough.

I understand that that is the case, but I think it’s important if they’re trying to establish Martha as a real companion and not just Rose 2.0 that we get to see this conversation, especially since we’ve been privy to the “One trip and that’s it” and the “Well okay, one trip back and one trip forward” conversations, and
:spoilered for future episode talk:

in The Lazarus Experiment the Doctor admits that Martha is important to him and agrees to let her come aboard as a full-fledged companion. The Doctor is wounded and detatched, and it seems that part of Martha’s function is to heal him…so far we’ve watched her restart one or both of his hearts on two occasions. Those of us new to the series and the idea of companions leaving and being replaced need to warm up to her along with the Doctor. As it is, they’re just suddenly in olde New York with no explanation or agenda whatsoever, and it doesn’t jibe with what was happening the last time we saw them.

The TARDIS was indeed on Liberty Island; I don’t get why he never seems to move the TARDIS just a bit closer to their headquarters when they hang out in one place for any length of time. Seems it’d be useful. But I do like the “sussing out the green glob” scene for the glasses porn and for the look on the Doctor’s face when he recognizes the genetic signature or whatever from planet Skaro.

Thanks everyone for the insights.

I hope you don’t mind me reviving your threads.

They had a heart to heart at the end of the last episode, when he tells her about the Time War. I assumed the “you wanna come with?” was in there somewhere.

It used to be that the TARDIS was notoriously hard to steer. Once it was set somewhere, it was easier to keep it there.

Which brings me to my biggest complaint about the new series: I never had the impression that the TARDIS moved physically through space. I always thought it moved by slipping in and out of space-time.

Seems perfectly reasonable to me that a ship capable of travelling through both space and time would be capable of moving through just one or the other.

Not at all! (sorry if I gave that impression)

Nine was able to hop it across London several times with precision, but then of course he landed them in 1869 instead of 1860, and returned Rose home a whole year after she left initially. I think we’re meant to be left with the impression that the TARDIS just kinda does whatever the hell it feels like, and hopefully you’re down for where you’re going to end up.

Although she seems to respond to string controls while charging along a motorway!

It’s been interesting to read opinions on this season on Twop from the (few) people who haven’t already seen it, but I’m really missing Jacob’s recaps.

So glad I’m not the only one! Jacob is truly a gifted writer and always managed to make me look at each episode from angles I’d never considered. I hope they’ll change their minds and bring them back.

I couldn’t stand his recaps. Every time I slogged through one I wanted to reach through my monitor and shake him while screaming “You are recapping a television show! You are not writing a doctoral dissertation!”

Hear, hear. They were what, fifteen pages long?

A question, tangentially related to the episode:

Can anyone identify for me the music that they played at the end? Thanks for the help.