Doctor Who - Season 3 Episode 5, open spoilers

Cafe Society
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Well, my thread last week went over like a lead balloon, but maybe now that this two-parter has concluded more folks will be interested in discussing. Once again, I’m not going to put the name of the episode in the title, as it could be a spoiler for those who have not yet had the oppourtunity to see the third season.

Carry on, nothing to see here…
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Okay then, Evolution of the Daleks - pretty good, considering I was not terribly fond of Daleks in Manhattan and had low expectations for this one.

Good:

The gossiping Daleks in the sewers, especially the one turning its eye-stalk around to make sure no one was nearby before admitting that it was beginning to doubt Dalek Sec. I laughed out loud.

The Daleks in general were just much better in this episode - I was just waiting for them to come to their senses and blow off this “Let’s-become-human” nonsense and take out Sec, and they did not disappoint.

The Doctor’s Amazing Big Hair that just gets bigger and bigger the more excited he gets!

Soloman’s “can’t-we-all-just-get-along” speech, during which I kept saying out loud “Exterminate, EX-TER-MIN-ATE!”

The explanation of glowing-green-sewer-jellyfish thing, the absence of which had annoyed me last week.

The destruction of the human/Dalek/Time Lord mutants, because we needed them around like we need a hole in the head.

Bad:

Okay, can someone explain to me why the Doctor was helping Sec? As soon as Sec revealed the “empty human shells”, I kept waiting for him to get all Doctor on his ass and start screaming “These people were ALIVE” or something, or pretend to go along with helping him and then at the last minute reveal his Fantastic Doctor-y Plan which would somehow magically wake them all up. But no! He was honestly helping him, and then all upset when the Daleks buggered their plan. The hell?

And! The Doctor getting all compassionate with the very last Dalek in the universe??? I kept shouting at the screen about how poor Nine was spinning in his grave somewhere. And why didn’t said last Dalek in the universe simply blow the Doctor away? I mean, of course I wouldn’t want that, but…it just sat there! Jesus, how many oppourtunities did they have to do away with him once and for all this episode, but instead they just wasted time explaining their Big Plan for ten minutes like a composition of every bad James Bond villain. Less talking, more EXTERMINATE.

The Doctor screaming at them to kill him was just sad and scary.

Whoever came up with the term “Dalekanium” should be smacked.

Thoughts? Will Dalek Caan (and yes, Mr. Bunny and I totally spent the last few minutes of the show yelling “KHAAAAAAAAAAAN!”) be back this season? Will there be another bizarre and overly-complicated plan put into action to create more Daleks? Will the Doctor collapse under the weight of his own hair?

Next week -

Martha changes clothes!!!

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I must have missed that part–what was the explanation?

I miss Rose :frowning: (I like Martha, but I wanted Rose and the Doctor to get it on in some hot Tardis lovin’)

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I thought it was a pretty sloppy script, with a few Britishisms like “lorry” coming from the mouths of American characters. How much effort would it have been to run the dialogue past a real American first? And the Depression didn’t happen overnight, did it? Did they have Hoovervilles in NYC as early as 1930? I doubt people were calling it the Depression that early, anyway. And I didn’t like the schoolboy-level social commentary (or schoolgirl-level, I suppose, since this one was written by a lady). Some people are poor while others are rich and That’s Bad, was about the level of insight.

Still, the episode looked very nice, with good matte work and effects again, but the rubber masks were a little bit Old Who. The new companion is supposed to be a trainee doctor and a bit more cerebral than Rose, but she just comes across like a screechy and none too bright teenager. Don’t think much of the actor’s performance, either.

Meh, while I find the new Doctor Who hit-and-miss, and pretty good when it’s in hit mode like in the previous two stories, I never cared for the original programme even as a kid, so I find the episodes where they bring back old baddies like the Daleks rather tiresome. Surely they can give the Daleks a rest for a while now?

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Didn’t like this episode at all. I’m totally over the Daleks, and they’re always seeming like they’re “the last” only for more to turn up from somewhere unlikely.

And how many opportunities were there for the Daleks to kill the Doctor, or the Doctor to kill the Daleks, and they just stood around yabbering about nonsense?

Bah!

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That one dates back to the original Doctor Who back in the '60s, I believe. Using it was more a continuity nod than anything.

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possibly a reference to the great lost story Evil Of The Daleks, in which the Daleks experiment to create Daleks with human characters, and humans with Dalek characters. Then they turn on each other and destroy the entire Dalek race, seemingly.

In fact, the Doctor first questioned whether it was possible to restore their minds. He would have done that if it was possible. But he gave that up when it was clear that their minds had been irretrievably deleted. But the reason that he was willing to help Sec was tyhat he saw that Sec had rediscovered mercy. He saw the possibility of a new species of Daleks that aren’t totally evil, and should be given the chance to survive.

That would be Terry Nation. It was first used in the second Dalek story, and frequently in the Dalek comic strips.

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Attempts by the Daleks to hatch new Daleks. They all died. Their failed experiments got flushed away.

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Wow, my poor sad thread has been revived over night!

Yeah, I’m pretty over them myself. They’re fun when they show up unexpectedly like, once a season, but now it seems like every other episode has freakin’ Daleks.

Well, ignorance fought. I’m brand new to the show, as is probably painfully evident. I still say it’s a pretty darn silly term, tho.

Yeah, I got that much, I guess I just figured that he would be…a little bit upset about thousands of humans being mind-wiped to be used as shells for Humeks or Dalmans or whatever. Even if there was nothing he could have done to reverse it, I still expected at least some Great Big Hair Angry Shouting. Instead he was just like “Hey, good idea, lemme help!”

I agree with those who are less-than-thrilled with Martha. For me, she’s gone from potentially cool to obnoxious to just boring. I hope they salvage her character somehow, 'cause right now she just serves to remind me how much I miss Rose.

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Um, I am going to show myself to be way out of the loop here…there’s a new Doctor Who series?? I used to be a huge fanboy geek in the Davison/Baker eras…what have I missed?? Is this available on American TV? Sorry if this seems like a hijack…

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Seriously? Wow, where to start…

Yes there’s a new series, now on its 3rd season. I adore it and it’s pretty popular both in the US and UK. I believe the 1st and 2nd seasons are, or were, being shown on SciFi…if not, they’re both available on DVD. Season 3 is currently being shown only in the UK, will probably not make it to the States until this July.

FWIW, Mr. Bunny was also a fan from the Baker years, and loves the new series and Doctor(s) a great deal.

Oh man, I envy you… :smiley:

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Yeah the new series is already on its second doctor!

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Saw a license plate today…Tardis6

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Reviving, as this episode just aired on Sci-Fi in the US.

As per the last thread, please put anything that has not aired in the US in spoiler boxes. Anything that has aired in the US or from the earlier Series is fair game.

That the the term Dalekanium is a rather lame term, but has been canon for over thirty years is fair game.

That it’s revealed in Episode 48 that the Dalekanium is really what powers the TARDIS needs to be boxed.

I only have two notes:

  1. I agree with those upthread who mentioned The Doctor agreed to help Dalek-sec a little too quickly.

  2. Flying Daleks look silly.

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Just a thought, Is there anthing that would preclude the possibility that Dalek Cam ends up crashing in the Ascension Islands and being the Dalek in the museum back in season one?

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Couple things:

  1. Voice is different. Yeah, I know it’s all Nick Briggs, but Caan’s voice is noticeably deeper than the Dalek in the museum.
  2. Museum-Dalek says that it is a soldier, bred to receive orders. No name given, no mention of the Cult of Skaro.
  3. Museum-Dalek is unaware of the Time War and the resulting destruction of the Daleks and the Time Lords, and has to inquire as to the fate of them. The Cult of Skaro seemed to be more or less on the up-and-up regarding that.
  4. This is incredibly nerdy of me to know, but the Daleks have little identification marks under their eye-stalks, and the museum-Dalek’s is different than Caan’s.

Anyway, god am I glad this two-parter is over. It must be how folks watching the first season as it aired felt about Aliens in London and World War Three (though personally I quite like those two episodes, fat farting aliens and all). I tried to approach the episode objectively and pretend I’d never seen it, and it didn’t help whatsoever. Still thought Soloman’s speech was horrendous and guiltily cheered a bit when he got zapped, still thought the Doctor did not go nearly batshit enough at the revelation that the Daleks had mind-wiped some 1,000 humans, still though the Dalekanium stuff was silly (although, thanks to those in the know above, I was willing to let go the silliness of the name of the metal, and just concentrate on how inconceivably stupid it was for Martha and Tallulah to simultaneously figure out that of course that was what the Daleks had attached the side of the Empire State Building!).

But, what are you gonna do. Each season has to have its low points, I suppose, or we wouldn’t appreciate the finer episodes as much. Hell, Season 2, Fear Her! shudders and represses memory again

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The Empire State Building was completed in May 1931; a Hooverville in Central Park in New York (as depicted in the episode) existed in 1931. Not easy to match up the dates, but it’s certainly possible (though the term “Hooverville” dates from 1933. Still, it could have been used before then, and it’s a convenient shorthand.) So the history is OK.

Better than the last episode. I think the doctor didn’t get indignant at the shells because they were killed by the Daleks long before Sec became human/dalek.

The science was especially confusing. They were looking for a solar flare, but it was lightning that fried the piggies. What was the connection? Also, how does the Doctors DNA get involved when the radiation goes through him?

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Yeah - That had us scratching our heads a bit, too. I also had figured The Doctor had done his radiation absorbing trick he had revealed when he was on the Moon earlier.

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In an effort to be positive, however, I will point out:

The impatient pigmen in the elevator were hilarious,

Martha’s reaction to having to kill said pigmen was admirable,

The visual callbacks to old monster movies like Frankenstein, with the giant laboratories and slowly lowering slabs and lightning rods, were very cool.

Actually, there were a lot of little things that, when taken apart, work quite well and I really like. Shame that when you put them all together they fizzle.