“Are you havin’ a laugh? Is he havin’ a laugh?”
I know I’m jumping into this thread late, but as soon as I heard “BF”, my instinct would have been to “Run. Run like the wind.”
I agree with the other posters who said that you need to force some sort of conclusion: “Either choose me or choose him. No in between.” There’s a place for group relationship, but that does not seem to be here.
Most assuredly not, if by that you mean making stuff up.
You can’t eliminate women who have boyfriends as potential future SOs . Most commonly desirable women (and men for that matter) have boyfriends most of the time. You’d be reducing your pool tremendously.
You have to keep up. I’m not sure how many people read the thread from beginning to end, but this is a rapidly evolving situation. Right now, the question is wether I ought to call her back or not. That , and a possible reconciliation, would have to come before I force a conclusion.
I’m a little confused. You need a reconciliation? Did you have a fight?
If she called you, do whatever you would do if anybody else called. Did she ask you to call back or did you just see it on caller id? In any case it seems reasonable to respond to her call. You should be trying to stop pursuing her, not punishing her. She didn’t do anything wrong that I’m aware of.
Don’t depend on us to tell you what to do. We don’t know squat. We hopefully can help by suggesting possibilities or strategies, but you’re the one who’s close to the situation so use your best judgement.
No, and no. Why would you call her back? She didn’t leave a message, and a non-clingy person doesn’t check their caller ID to find out if people called them and hung up.
Stop obsessing over this girl. Stop spending an hour trying to find the perfect way to tell her you’re a little miffed for ditching you. Stop agonizing over whether to call her. As dozens of other posters have tried to tell you, the only chance you have of getting this girl is to lose all interest in her and see if she chases after you. And it’s a pretty slim chance, with what sounds to be a somewhat dubious payoff.
read this post.
I just saw her caller ID, no msg was left. Let me know what you think now that you’ve read the post I linked to above.
Agreed.
Yeah, that was my assessment too. I haven’t called her back.
Well, I have a crush on her. I have to be a little obsessive.
I’m not agonizing. I assure you.
the payoff will DEFINITELY be worth it, one way or another 
It’s precisely because it’s a pretty slim chance , though, that I’m being hesitant. I suppose I’m not sure she’s spent enough time with me to…ermm…fully appreciate all my qualities. But maybe that insecurity is based on shaky grounds. How long is long enough? I’ve known her for over 3 months now. I guess that ought to be enough, eh?
Such a bad timing though. Right before her boyfriend arrives? Or right after he took her on pleasant trip?
Or is it my insecurity speaking? I really can’t tell.
I see I missed a key message on the gym date. Please ignore the clueless comments.
I agree with stolichnaya.
You know, something i realized fairly recently is that sometimes we may expect too much from any one person; it’s FANTASTIC if you can find a close mate with a deep personality and great sense of humor and she’s a good listener and you just have perfect chemistry and hey, the sex is awesome as well…but sometimes it can be very satisfying to have a few close friends who bring a piece of each of those things to the table as well. Maybe you have a close friend who fills the role of confidant, and another that is just a lot of fun to be around, and another that doesn’t mind a roll in the hay now and then without getting too emotionally wrapped-up in things. And maybe that’s working for her to some extent, with you as a so-called “surrogate” boyfriend and she doesn’t want or need anything more from you…maybe she just hasn’t made that clear to you, that she’s happy getting certain kinds of attention from you and maybe she’s happy to give you a certain kind of attention as well. The question then would be, can you satisfied with filling that role in her life?*
- The preceding speculation was pulled almost entirely from my nether-regions and may be TOTALLY off. Take with liberal doses of salt.
so, what happened next?
Well, I returned her call yesterday and it was as if nothing had ever happened; Asymmetrical perspectives I assume we have.
Anyways, I had lunch with her today, went to wholefood market where I bought myself food and some chocolates for her. I might be taking her to dinner tonight after she visits her friend in jail (which she should be doing right about now).
I’ll try to make her read the story tonight if that’s the case, otherwise, it’ll wait til tomorrow.
In other news, I have revised my initial assessment from 5% to around 0.5%. That’s just the vibe I’m getting.
::shakes head::
Maybe you should ask her if she’d like to be “friends with benefits.” Then you’d get to “root” her, as my Aussie friend would say, and you’d have the friendship, and it would be more casual and you could get on with your life and declaw your cat.
So, I’m back from dinner. I suppose the two of you who still care will want an update 
She brought up my email at once point and she explained herself to my satisfaction and apologized twice so that’s closed.
She read my story in the car and she laughed many times and said she liked it. She wasn’t upset by the kiss or the sex parts though she did say that, in reality, the ending would have been her taking me to dinner or something (assessment down to 0.01%).
She also said she was going to show it to her boyfriend. I suppose I should be pleased to know he will feel the pangs of jealousy and possibly hate my guts but I derive no pleasure from the distress of others. I don’t mind if he realizes I have a crush on her. It’d be interesting to see if he tells her something about it.
And that’s all for now.
ps: I won’t declaw my cat. I can live with the scratches and the ruined furniture.
Ahh yes the word “root”. It has far more uses than you ever thought possible…
You’re loving this, aren’t you?
As in artist, it’s probably wise to experience all sensations at least once so you can recall it with vivid details. That is what I did, and is what I think is happening here.
shrug
I wish. It’s the tiniest of consolation prizes really. I know what I’d be loving and I suspect you do too
I wouldn’t call myself an artist. As a human being however, I suppose it’s good to experience as much as possible to grow. And this is definitely a new experience. A bitter-sweet one.
And here I thought this thread might actually be about what women like in a man. If anything, it’s about what women hate in a man, unless you’re the kind of deceptive, manipulative, attention-seeking sort of girl this whole scenario always revolves around. They love to prey on the men who don’t seem to know any better, or better still, the men who do know better but still indulge them anyway for some particularly inward, self-flagellating reason. You reallly haven’t read anything any of the people have said in this thread, fimy. Yes, you read the words, you responded to the words (often parsed individually in a sentence by sentence format) and yet the brick that is the advice you’re being given still hasn’t hit you in the head hard enough. I could name names of the folks who’ve made some particularly good posts here, but it’d be a long list because virtually everyone agrees that you’re wrapped up in a textbook case of top shelf dysfunction at your emotional and financial expense. The most dysfunctional thing about it in particular is that you already seem to be aware of this fact, and still indulge it. Nobody’s patting you on the back for wanting to “see this through to it’s inevitable conclusion”. It’s no big feat to want closure. It’s a big feat to act on getting that closure, and you’re still spinning your wheels. This sort of passive/depressive/masochistic/woe-is-me behavior is the kind of thing that girls like Wanda love to prey upon because it means free shit for them, whether it be bikinis, chocolates, dinner, or even the cheap five minute thrill that the ego boost gives her. She’s in the driver’s seat and she’s taking you for a ride to somewhere that even she doesn’t know, and you’re in the passenger seat, perhaps hoping she does. Then again, maybe you’re not. It’s kind of hard to tell what you’re thinking because you come back with strawman responses which openly acknowledge how pointlessly depressing this situation is, and that you’re content to prolong it. If you were doing this as some kind of big psychological expirement, it might at least make sense.
You’ve clearly got a decent head on your shoulders, but I have to wonder how well it’s working after you return to this thread (after everyone having given you some really good advice about severing the notion that you’ll indulge her bullshit one minute longer) and openly admit to having bought this girl more crap, in this case, chocolates. I wonder if I even need to ask who paid for dinner. The people who are telling you these things are doing so because they’ve been through it, at least to some degree, or know someone who has. If there’s something we don’t know, you have only yourself to blame for not telling us, but I don’t think there’s much more light to shed on her or your standing with her. You’ve gone into far too much detail as it is by responding to virtually every post defensively, sentence by sentence, which only serves to reinforce what we’re all calling you on from the beginning. Even assuming it wasn’t true, you convey a sense of having far too much time on your hands, enough at least to go into trivial details that only serve to dissect a situation that doesn’t need to be dissected. You cannot buy a woman’s affection, and these he-said-she-said exchanges about who got whose call first and who didn’t call who back later should be your first and only reason to lose her name, her number, and any reason you had for even being interested in her in the first place. If this was just about sex, then you should have just made it about sex. To respond to what this was all originally about in the first place, the signs all indicate that she liked you and she was testing to see if you had enough of a spine to go and fuck her brains out, consequences be damned. To her and everyone else here, it appears that you do not. Don’t sweat it, there will be other chances. Where one door closes, two more open. As you’ve said here, it is a learning experience, but I think you have more to learn from the advice in this thread than you do from any experiences with this girl.
In the future, put girls like this on the back burner while you do what others have reccommended here, and if you play your cards right, the roles will be reversed. If she’s still around by then, and judging from her clearly manipulative/disturbed/unbalanced nature, she’ll be the one pursuing you instead. Not that I would consider that a good thing based on what we know of her. But hey, if sex with the crazy girl is what you want, it doesn’t take a whole lot of reverse psychology to get it.
I just stumbled upon this thread, and I would have to wave my arms vigorously and point to anamnesis’s post above. At the beginning of the thread, I thought there was some hope – the Valentine’s comment and the night alone with some wine threw up a huge glowy Come Hither! sign, but I’m afraid you’ve let that opportunity pass, and there won’t be another. Had it ended there, I would have told you that it’s unfortunate, but now you know better for next time. However, the more I read as your predicament evolves, the more I’m inclined to think that this girl – and girl is all she be, as a grown woman would not exhibit such inconsiderate behavior (by my definition of “woman,” anyway) – is far far less than what you perceive of her. Sure, she’s smart, attractive, and funny, but she’s also passive-agressive, manipulative, and completely uninterested in treating you with anything close to the decency that you deserve (whether she consciously knows it or not). Even if she were to call you up at this very moment, profess her undying love for you, and inform you that she were on her way over to jump your bones, though the sex may be delicious for a time, the relationship would not be a rewarding one for you. Oh wait, that’s right, she never calls (unless threatened with the imminent loss of your goodwill – that doesn’t count).
You wanted a noninvasive test to gauge her feelings for you – you’ve had it all along. Stop looking at what she does and look at what she doesn’t do. Things like, well, calling you, for example. Or reciprocating thoughtful gestures. At best, she’s really flaky and inconsiderate. At worst, she’s playing you, bigtime. Probably somewhere in-between, and subconsciously – but even if it’s subconscious, it’s still no excuse. The way I see it, the only “win” you have in this situation is to get over her as quickly as possible and move on with your social life. Perhaps retain her as a friend – since obviously you enjoy her company and have fun with her – but anything more intimate than that, you are wading through an emotional minefield (with the immasculating Bouncing Betty mines, no less).
I’ve been to this place before, as have many of these other posters. All have given you sound advice (on which you seem to not have the chutzpah to follow-through). However, I recognize that this is a learning experience for you, and sometimes we just have to make mistakes on our own and learn our own lessons, regardless of all the best counsel in the world. In fact, were I in your shoes (or rather I should say, when I was in your shoes) with that relative inexperience, I would probably discard all but the most passive of advice and engage in the same self-flagellation anyway, just to learn it myself, just once. However, should this situation arise again with some other crazy girl (you’d be surprised by how abundant they are!), I should hope that you’d be wise enough to not follow this same progression of events.
At any rate, I wish you the best, no matter how it turns out.
Tchuss!