Doing the nasty in your own home when you have guests over

The BBQ Pit
1

And by “the nasty” I mean smoking, so get your minds out of the gutter.

The Brickers are in the DR for Christmas, and a small disagreement arose amongst my in-laws last night. (Being Latin, that means there was shouting but no throwing things). One of my siblings-in-law smokes. Another had guests over for a rousing game of XBox 360-enabled Rock Band. Among those guests, one apparently either doesn’t like cigarette smoke, or (depending on which version of her story you believe) has a medical condition exacerbated by cigarette smoke.

Ms. Nosmokerson told the smoker, “You can’t smoke in here, I hate it.” Note, please, that it wasn’t “I’m terribly sorry, and I hate to ask, but would you mind awfully if …?” No, no – it was very direct and very commanding: “You can’t smoke in here, I hate it.”

Smokey rejoined with “I’m in my own house, and if you don’t like it, there’s the door.” Whereupon my other sibling-in-law, who was actually the host of the Rock Band event and had invited the guests, got into the debate by insisting that Smokey extinguish.

So the debate rages. Today we learn that supposed “I hate it” was actually code for “I have an allergy and a rare medical condition and will require hospitalization if exposed to smoke.” I am always skeptical of information which conveniently emerges to strengthen one side of a debate, but who knows?

My view is that few smokers would be ballsy enough to smoke in the face of “I’m terribly sorry, and I hate to ask, but since I have a terrible allergy to smoking, I’m afraid I can’t stay if there’s going to be smoking in here.” So in my view, it was the manner of the request, and the actual existence of the allergy/rare medical condition is irrelevant to how the issue should have been handled.

But I’m on the sidelines of the debate, because my Spanish isn’t good enough to handle the fast pace that debates in this context require.

I could have placed this in IMHO, I suppose, because I’m essentially asking for opinions about the situation. But in my experience, smoking vs. non-smoking tends to ignite (NPI) some passionate responses.

2

I concur. As a former smoker, I’d have gladly abstained or gone outside to smoke if a guest politely requested that I do so, even if their reason was simply that the smoke bothered them–no medical conditions necessary. However, If I got told, nay, commanded not to smoke in my own house, my response was more likely to be along the lines of “Don’t like it? Then, you can fuck right off.” blow huge cloud of smoke in self-important guest’s face

3

I’ve come to realize that one of the few upshots of having had cancer is that now I simply have to clear my throat and every cigarette in the office gets immediately stubbed out. Personally, I believe in live and let die, so I only abuse this power when someone insists I attend a meeting in the smoking room.

Basically, OP’s scenario sounds like a good example of “it’s not what you say, it’s how you say it.” Had the request actually been a request, it probably would have stood a much greater chance of being resolved peacefully. By making it an order, it immediately turned everything into a hostile confrontation.

Of course, never discount the possibility that there are deeper family grudges at work here, and smoking is merely a pretext.

In any case, I advise staying on the sidelines. It doesn’t sound like getting involved will have a positive effect for anyone, least of all you (especially if this is an ongoing grudge match).

4

So if I understand, Smokey lives there, and Toady (the one who agrees with the guest–sorry I don’t have another name) doesn’t live there but hosts the event, and Scoldy (who insists on putting out fires–I’d call her Smokey, but the name’s taken) is a guest, right?

If so, the host-vs-houseowner bit puts a little weirdness into the situation. It sounds as if none of the three parties behaved well:

  1. Scoldy should’ve made the request apologetically and offered the option of leaving as one that’s totally fine by her. Her demand was totally obnoxious.
  2. Smokey could’ve taken the high road by not smoking at an event hosted by the sibling: since he’d offered his house for the event, and since he was letting someone else run it, the best thing to do would’ve been to accede in this minor matter, at least temporarily, to Toady.
  3. Toady should’ve mediated the situation quietly and privately, talking to Smokey and Scoldy individually, to try to find a way for both parties to get what they need and save face. Taking sides with Scoldy against the sibling was a bad move.

I think Smokey was least in the wrong, and if Smokey hadn’t said that Toady could host an event there, I’d totally have Smokey’s back. The giving-of-the-house-for-hosting thing adds a weird wrinkle. Unless the story’s not being told right (i.e., Scoldy’s demand was actually a polite request), Scoldy is most in the wrong.

I have cats, and occasionally we’ll find out that a guest is allergic to cats. Usually we find out from the guest’s red eyes, and we apologize and offer to lock the cats in a bedroom, and invariably the guest tells us not to do so, and depending on the strength of their demurral, we may or may not do so anyway. If someone demanded that we put the cats up, we probably would, out of shock, but we wouldn’t invite them back.

Daniel

5

Er… no. Both Smokey and Toady live here. They’re both adults – but I would point out that in the DR it’s fairly common for adult children to live at home until they marry, and that Toady is getting married this spring and will be moving out at that time.

6

Medical conditions exacerbated by casual nearby smoking are largely BS. It’s a control thing on the part of the Nosmo King crowd.

Nosmo Queen was inappropriately rude. She is either passive-aggressive or plain aggressive, but she definitely has a bug up her behind about controlling the Wicked Smokers. Smo King should have asked before lighting up, even in his own kingdom; common courtesy. Coupla social losers.

Stay on the sidelines and just enjoy the show. That’s what Christmas family gatherings are all about. If asked for your opinion, render mine. For both parties.

7

I smoke, but I do understand how irritating it can be to people that don’t smoke. I would never smoke around a nonsmoker unless they specifically told me “you can smoke in here”. My sister, on the other hand, will either just light up, or stand in the door and smoke, so you get the smoke in the house anyway.

This is a tough one, since Scoldy and Toady were within their rights to ask Smokey to refrain. I get the impression from the OP that it was Toady’s gathering, and Smokey was just hanging out. But when you are rude and belligerent about it, most people are going to become hostile. There’s a reason please is called “the magic word”. A word to Toady to this effect might help ease things a bit.
Personally, if I was Smokey I would have acceded to Scoldy’s request and gone outside or in another room to smoke. But I can definitely understand his response, the request should have been phrased more politely.

8

I smoke, and I host all the holiday dinners, and when my family is here (especially if there are kids around) I smoke in the office, with the window open and the door closed.

I choose to do that, out of courtesy. But this is MY house. I am perfectly within my rights to light up when and where ever I like, in MY house. Anyone who ordered me not to smoke in my own house would find themselves outside looking for someone *else’s *hospitality to enjoy right quick.

9

  1. Knowing that in today’s world many people strongly object to being around smoke, smoker-host (Smokey) was rude to light up without asking if anyone minded first. There are guests and good manners compels you to consider the desires of your guests. Even if you think the desire is BS.

  2. Non-smoker guest (Nosmo) was rude in how they communicated his/her desire to be in a smoke-free environment, even though he/she did not do the first rude thing.

  3. Smokey should have extinguished even if the request was made rudely, rather than escalating the conflict. Later (and I mean within 5 minutes later) someone should have taken Nosmo out of the room and shamed Nosmo to apologize for rude behavior. Faces saved all round.

  4. Inviting-host (Toady) should have taken Smokey out of the room and requested the cigarette be extinguished as a favor to him and then taken Nosmo out and first request an apology to smoker for the rudeness and if not willingly done so told him to either apologize or leave. Trying to tell Smokey to put it out in front of Nosmo was idiotic as at that point it would be face-losing.

So pretty much rudeness and a lack of basic etiquette all around. There are reasons for basic manners. Doesn’t anyone teach y’all these things?

Sheesh.

10

My house, my rules, my Castle, my realm.

Request? Fine, I’ll consider it.

Command? Get The Fuck Out Now.
And don’t ever come back until you’ve apologized in front of those same witnesses.

Hell, I don’t like cigarette smoke, but in other people’s cars I’ll give my approval if they ask - because it’s their car - as long as they open their window.

But I guess I just have an oddly old-fashioned sense of honor and a mindfulness of where I am. Unfortunately these days, too many people think they own the world and can command everyone around them to their own desires and interests.

11

Nosmo may not have done the FIRST rude thing, but in my opinon, giving orders in someone else’s home totally trumps smoking in one’s OWN home on the rudeness scale.

“Hi, I’m here to eat your food, drink your booze, and enjoy your Wii. OMIGOD, put out that cigarette, you vile cretin!!!”

12

Chimera, I guess we have a different sense of old fashioned honor. Yeah DianaG, Nosmo was rudest and needs to be taken out of the room and bottom line either apologize for the manner of the request or leave. But there is a code of hospitality. Someone is a guest in my house then their needs come first, even if they are rude and try my patience. It doesn’t matter if I didn’t invite them, they are guests and should be treated as guests. Plus it was rude to Toady, who did invite Nosmo.

Your attitude reminds me of the Dad who comes downstairs when his daughter’s date is picking her up in his boxer’s farting and picking his nose. Sure it is his castle, his realm. But he’s still being a pig and his daughter will likely not forgive him ever.

13

If you know that one of your relatives (or acquaintances) smokes, have a problem with it and plan on going there for a visit, either make arrangements beforehand for avoiding smoke or don’t go. If you don’t realize it until you get there, “please don’t smoke” will probably work better than something seen as a command.

People who smoke and are planning a large gathering at their home should expect that at least a few people will have health or other problems with their smoking and arrange to smoke outdoors for the duration of the gathering. Not doing so is passive-aggressive or other-aggressive.

I take it you’ve never treated or heard of asthma. Or heart or lung conditions exacerbated by secondhand smoke. :dubious:

With considerable publicity about hazards of secondhand smoke and a couple of Surgeon General’s reports having had time to circulate, we should be well past the notion that complaints about secondhand smoke are just the province of fussy, controlling nonsmokers.

14

Two immature shitheads having a pissing match.

I really can’t pick a side on this one either Bricker

15

So, it your house it is your rules, but in someone else’s car, it is also your rules, but, you will relent if “they ask” and “as long as they open their window”?

But you are oddly old-fashioned in how you respect others?

16

You’re in the DR–and cigars are out of the question, I guess? Damn.

I also do not react well to rude commands. Though I’ve never been in that position, where someone demanded I comply with their wishes in my house, I suspect I would respond similarly (“Oh, yeah? Last time I checked, I’m the guy paying the mortgage, sister…”). Then I’d probably feel bad later, because it’s not an unreasonable request, merely one delivered disrespectfully. I definitely would accommodate a politely worded request, no hesitation.

17

From the perspective of someone who’s also married to a Dominican and has lived in the DR for almost 10 years, this is familiar yet unfamiliar.

It’s also my experience that people, especially family members, can be very direct with each other in the DR. However, smoking is almost always socially unacceptable in the DR - smokers are a very small and mostly invisible minority here. Due to the climate, a great deal of socialising in the DR is done in the open or semi-open air and houses are designed to reflect that, so when in the company of smokers it should not be such an issue.

18

I’m not sure how much the code of hospitality extends to your sibling’s guests in your home.

Add to it that you are in the DR - which may have a completely different level of smoking tolerance than the mainstream U.S. (I’d expect it does).

19

A little excessive in your reading of it.

When I was growing up, my father would smoke in the car, choke us all out, and scream at anyone who dared to roll down a window.

If I was in your car and you lit up, no I wouldn’t say anything. It’s your car. If you asked me, naturally I’d say it was ok with me. But I’d certainly roll my own window down, and maybe ask you to roll yours down.

If you yelled at me about rolling down the window, I’d ask you to take me back to my own car, and reconsider our friendship.

Dseid, guests are guests, and should behave as such. If they cease to act in a respectful manner toward their host, they cease to be guests. This isn’t to say that I’m a bad host, as I’m sure you or others could bunch up your undies and claim (inaccurately). On the contrary, I’ve always been complimented on how good a host I am when I have people over. I do my best to make them feel welcome and provide for their needs.

GUESTS do not demand or otherwise disrespect their hosts. Period.

20

Dangerosa - as per the post above yours, there is a different level of smoking tolerance - “smoking is almost always socially unacceptable in the DR” - I defer to those who know.

You understand that it is as much your sibling’s home as it is yours? By my code it extends more. I can be rude back to my friend, but being rude back to my siblings friend is disrespecting my sibling as well.

Chimera maybe people are afraid to tell you anything else? :slight_smile: Or maybe in real life you’ve never actually done that? Maybe in real life you and yours know better than to do something similarly rude as Smokey did and have guests who were also raised well and know how to ask for things nicely?

But such is human nature. A perceived insult. A cheap shots tossed over as a result. A bigger volley thrown back. And soon we are in a whole 'nuther Pit thread. They were rude first. Yeah but they were ruder! Disproportionately rude! All that changes is the scale. Human nature sucks man.