So I was perusing this thead about things Dopers tend to overstate, and I noticed some commentary within about how Dopers tend to be of above-average intelligence. Someone therein made a comment (which I am quite liberally paraphrasing here) about how we degree-laden Dopers should be mindful that there are millions of folks out there who haven’t even obtained high school diplomas.
While I know I couldn’t compare to some of the many brilliant contributors to this board, I do know that I have somewhat higher intelligence than the average member of the population. And yet, I never really pursued a college degree. I figure there must be a few other Dopers who have not or did not obtain degrees for various reasons, and I’m wondering how the folks who fall into that category have managed in their jobs and careers since they’ve been of the age where they potentially would have graduated from college. I’d love it if you would share your stories. For that matter, are there Dopers who did not complete a high school education?
Please share as little or as much as you care to – I realize that this might be a sensitive topic for some. I’ve encounter some bias based on my lack of a degree, but I’ve managed to find or create valuable positions for myself in small companies that have kept me gainfully employed, so I wouldn’t say I’ve really suffered as a result of not graduating.
I went to college but I dropped out with a academic record that was mediocre at best.
I’ve been working for the state of New York for twenty four years now and doing great. I’ve got a unionized civil service job which is the next best thing to being unfireable. I make good money and have solid benefits.
I could theoretically retire next year at the age of 45. But I plan on still working. And now there are rumors that, because of too many people retiring, we’re going to be offered a pension upgrade if we agree to work a few more years.
So obviously I feel my lack of a degree has not held me back.
I graduated high school only because my parents threatened me. I didn’t really think it was worth it - and if you’d gone to my high school, you might have found it that way, too. I didn’t learn a damn thing except in ROTC.
I didn’t attend college, despite getting offered two full-ride scholarships to prestigious unviersities. I didn’t want to go to college because I didn’t know what I wanted to do with life and I didn’t see any good with persuing a college education while undecided as to the course of my life.
I graduated in 2003. It’s about to become 2007, so I think I’m doing pretty well - I have a decent-paying job with our local newspaper and am making the breakout into journalism without having set foot in college. I also have an internship that will soon be turning into a paying job with an online gaming and technology Web site. That will pay pretty well, too. I think I’m doing pretty good, and every time someone tells me “You know, you really ought to go to college,” I laugh. College is, I think, not needed in a lot of situations that people say it is. Sure, for doctors and lawyers and teachers, yes, college is a must. For a journalist? You can learn AP style and shorthand and how to conduct an interview in college, but if you’re a shitty writer, no amount of schooling in the world is going to make that better.
I took a detour on my college degree. After one semester in Engineering, I enlisted in the Navy. I spent four years in the USN.
When I got out, I still did not have enough money to go to college fulltime as I missed out on the GI Bill and got stuck with VEEP instead. So I used my excellent Navy training as an electrician* to get a civilian job as an HVAC Helper of course.
I excelled at the controls and especially computer control system and got a quick promotion to HVAC Mechanic. I usually got plenty of overtime. I was slowly working my way towards my Associates in Engineering and by this time all of my friends from High School had graduated with their Engineering degrees and failed to get jobs in the field. I met and proposed to my wife at this. She had her degree from Rutgers in ME and was working as a Computer Programmer after returning to school for COBOL programming. When she got out of Rutgers the only job she had gotten was secretarial.
I am a little slow, but I realized I was wasting my time. I research computer programming schools and what the job market was looking for. I found that while there was a lot of a C++ jobs, they all required a Bachelors in Comp Science. I found that in contrast, companies were hiring COBOL and RPG programmers as long as they were breathing.
So I went to a seven-month full time training course in Computer Programming with COBOL & RPG. I landed a job quickly at $5,000 less than I was making in the HVAC job I mentioned above. Nearly fifteen years later I am doing fine in my field. Not great, but a good living in my cube farm Dilbert like world.
Jim
I joined to train in electronics, which would have earned me some credits towards my EE degree. Through the wonders of the nuclear program, the Navy assigned me to be an Electrician.
I dropped out of high school. I haven’t exactly had a stellar career - ill health has interfered with my ability to be an active part of the workforce over the last decade. When I do work, it’s in Office Administration, a role that I enjoy.
Graduated High School in 1984… Went to DeVry in 87 (had to quit after 1st year) USAF 88-90…decided wanted to do Web Work in 94… self taught… first job in 95 for an internet company, fired (lack of business, no fault of my own)… got WebMasters position with local tech company (for the marketing dept… director asked me "what made me think I could do the job, since I had no Marketing Degree or CompSci degree… after I showed him a)what was wrong with the coding on the current web, how it should be better organized for user experience (I brought in a rework of the site on disk)… he gave me the job on a 30 day trial… 10+ years later I’m still with IBM (company I started with in 96 was aquired) as a Staff Software Engineer…
I was an angry, depressed high-schooler who dropped out in the second semester of my senior year. After a few months working at Collinsville Ice and Fuel, I got my GED. Then I worked at Pizza Hut, and then joined the Army. Now I’m a junior EE student in college, getting straight A’s. So, except for Pizza Hut, I’ve been doing alright since I dropped out of high school. I had benefits and a nice place to live in the army, and now I get paid to go to school and learn about some damned interesting things.
Fun Fact: I was actually accepted to a university before I dropped out of high school. Its a good thing I dropped out, because at that time I would have majored in English and minored in history. Then where would I be today?
Not myself, but my second ex-husband - learned computer programming at college, although he dropped out without graduating (parent’s divorce). At the time I met him, he was working his way to the top - to the point that, even tho I have a master’s in
Civil Engineering, he was making twice my salary. At the time that we spit up, he was pulling in about 100 k a year. That was 6 years ago. Og only knows what he makes now.
My college keeps a record of everyone who asks for my transcript. In 15 years and several jobs, nobody bothered to ask for one; all employers took me at my word that I had a degree, although I had signed waivers allowing them to check.
I did well at secondary school and was admitted to a good university (Arts/Law) but dropped out after one semester because I wanted to have babies more than a career. :rolleyes:
Four kids and no husband later, I returned to uni (Arts, Sociology and Philosophy of Science majors) six years ago, at the same uni (Melb), but combining study and working* and * tending to the needs of the sprogs became too much even though I was doing exceptionally well in my course work (lots of High Distinctions and even a couple of ++HD’s :eek: I’m a clever little vegemite when it comes to academia!! ). I couldn’t dump the kids of course, so the study went westward.
I dropped out of college after a year and a half to pursue love and family as well (double :rolleyes: ). After raising my kid alone for 11 years, I’m doing fine financially. I would be less fine if me and Mr. K didn’t both work, but we don’t live in an appliance box, my bills are paid, and I have a retirement plan that will keep me out of the pet food aisle.
I see the earning power of a college diploma becoming less and less over time. I still encourage young people to go to college, but less for earning power and more for developing a broader understanding of their world. Most kids believe that the paycheck is the prize when it comes to education. In my opinion, it’s secondary to the well-rounded education for its own sake.
The only post high school education I completed was my Psychiatric nursing training. I did a couple of years of surveying but became bored with the actual work and left. I completed my nursing training and became the only person ever to top the state in every exam in all 3 years. I left the day I qualified for registration.
I then studied audio engineering and computer programming but both courses required up front fees that I couldn’t keep up with so I didn’t make it to the final exams. I did a few years of live sound mixing and managed two bands.
About 20 years ago I started as a base grade public service clerk. By luck a huge computer project allowed me to parlay my computer skills into a string of positions that got me where I am today. Computer skills were in short supply then. I earn about $80,000 a year, manage no staff, go to very few bullshit meetings and genuinely enjoy what I do 99 out of every 100 days. The next step up the ladder is all managing staff and going to bullshit meetings and doing things that you know are a waste of time.
Graduated high school in 1984. Went to college for four years in Art History, but never wrote my senior paper or filed for graduation because I got a more than full time job.
Work as a project manager currently. Make a pretty good living, plus bonuses and stock options.
Back in school now getting a degree in Accounting - which, if I switch careers, will pay much less.
I quit HS in '56 (class of '57) and joined the Navy later that year. Retired just before my 40th b’day w/ a life pension and excellent medical care. A couple years later I started my own trucking business, did 24 years w/ that and decided to retire completely. I’m not wealthy, but I own my home, have a couple of rental units and I’m doing OK.
I attended a number of training schools in the Navy, I’ve always enjoyed reading and I think I’m a bit smarter than the average bear. I did have an opprtunity to attend Drexel Un. in ‘63, but by that time I was married and had a kid, so I chose the financially safe route and stayed in the Navy. I’ve always kinda’ regretted that, but life is a series of choices and I’ll live w/ mine.
I agree that a college degree is not necessary for a lot of jobs. In fact, I question the push going on in some states (like my own) to make sure everyone gets a degree. I think we might be wise to revisit some of our ideas about what jobs require a college degree, and to contract (not expand) the number of students who go to college. Like you note, many people don’t know what they want to do and have no direction–but they go to college anyway because they’re supposed to. Some of them figure it out and find a path, but a lot of them don’t.
However, the comment about journalism surprises me. I have little doubt you’re doing great at your job, but overall the field strikes me as one where we would benefit from journalists with more education, not less.
Journalists have a huge responsibility in our society (IMHO) because so many people rely on their work to understand current events and the world around them. Journalists are the ones who tell most people about things like bird flu, what’s really going on in Iraq, the effect of tax and monetary policies, the impact of proposed constitutional amendments, global warming, stem cell research, educational reform, campaign finance reform, the history of the middle east conflict…the list goes on. Good writing ability and “knowing how to interview” is critical, but I also want someone who knows how to ask the right questions and follow up on angles that might otherwise be overlooked. I want someone with the ability to be critical and analytical about the information they gather. These are skills that colleges work to impart. A college degree may not be entirely essential, but I think it could be very helpful.
In fact, there’s a program at my U so journalists can go back to school and get yet another degree beyond the baccalaureate, not in journalism (in fact, we don’t even have a journalism department) but in some other field like politics, or economics, or public health) so their coverage of these issues will be more thorough and accurate.
I know there are some brilliant, well-respected journalists who don’t have degrees. But overall I think it goes too far to suggest that higher education is not needed in the field.
I graduated HS, went to 1 year of college and dropped out. I found that after you’ve started working fulltime and making your own money, it’s difficult to try and go back to depending on others to support you while you attend school. I don’t make huge bucks, but I make enough to afford my small farm and dogs, cats and horses. I really can’t think of much I want that I don’t have, except central heat and air in my 150 year old farm house. But even that’s coming around. It’s about 1/2 insulated, and I just bought storm windows. Some day it’ll be comfortable.
My sister dropped out of HS to go directly into college. After a year or two in college she started travelling internationally, working just enough to keep her going. She did that for about 10 years, finally settling down and marrying. She worked her way from secretary to manager of international transportation for a national retail firm, all without even a HS diploma.
My current job is decent, and I would not be doing any better in job pay or title if I had a degree, which proves college degrees are useless. If you are hiring for a position and it is down to two candidiates, one who has no social skills, can’t communicate well and did marginal on pre-employment tests, but has a degree, or employee B, smart, sharp, did well on tests, well spoken, but no degree- who do you hire?
I have only my associates degree from an art school in Chicago.
I have an excellent job as a designer at an insurance company. I make more money than almost all of my friends and have better benefits. I’m 27 and own my own home and 2 cars. I teach classes at a local college in web design and yes, even they know about my lack of a bachelor’s degree. I’m supervisor of the Graphics Department at my company and they’re setting me up to take over as manager of the department when my boss retires.
I left school and went straight into university, but dropped out after taking 5 years to do half a degree. Job prospects were so so but by chance I was able to keep on a student job within the university. I’m managing to keep my head above water financially but my job bores me to death and I’d have made more money as a Civil Engineer. Its such that I’ve taken up part time study to get myself a degree in computing, anything to get me out of this rut.
Having said all that, it was a long and tortuous route that let me meet the woman who would eventually have my child, so not a bad way for things to turn out
). I couldn’t dump the kids of course, so the study went westward.