This is your opportunity to provide entirely solicited advice in a very general sense

In My Humble Opinion
1

Mods:

If this is too mundane/pointless for this forum, I apologize. Feel free to direct it elsewhere. From my own personal knowledge of the fora (lurking for about seven years or so), this seems the best place to ask this question.

And that question is: What should I do?

Allow me to provide you with the necessary background information.

I am 22 years old. I have a bit of college experience, but it’s not been good. Underperformance in high school as a result of depression and disinterest has put me in an unfortunate academic situation, and I am currently faced with very limited options for schooling. I live in an apartment in a decent part of my city with a roommate and have pretty minimal overhead. I own my car. I have not seen my father since I was a child, and have not been funded by him in any way. I have an extremely distant relationship with my mother.

With all of that out of the way, the gist of the above is that I have a definite lack of “experienced” perspective into my own situation. I do not want to be like either of my parents, and the advice that has been dispensed to me lacks the sort of drive and ambition that I would like to aspire toward.

I have bounced around between dozens of jobs, unable to find any one job that funds my existence and doesn’t make me miserable. Presently, I have been in the process of starting a small-scale clothing/media resale operation that has worked out well for me. It is clear that working for myself is the only way to go until I can get myself out of entry-level hell as far as job prospects go.

It seems to me that college is the most obvious answer, but I’m very frustrated with the proposition. I really, honestly want to be in an environment that is conducive to academic learning and social growth, but the expense of college on top of general living expenses for me is a difficult one to swallow. My eligibility for aid is not good, either.

I have a serious girlfriend who I have considered marrying, which would significantly increase both of our chances to receive a college education while continuing to metabolically function.

I’d love any sort of insight, advice, etc. that this community might be able to provide. Having read things very closely for years, I have come to respect the overwhelming force and breadth of knowledge available here. Feel free to parent me, even if you’re younger than me. Any questions you might have that would assist in illuminating the path are welcome.

2

I guess the first, most important question to me is: Is your depression under control?

3

I have been in a situation not entirely unlike yours (still ongoing, actually). I understand especially where you are coming from with respect to funding; your age will make things difficult with FAFSA for a few more years yet (I’m assuming you’re American).

Me in a nutshell: dropped out ninth grade, divorced parents, don’t talk to my father, have a good relationship with my mom (Cheez_Whia) although she lives 800 miles away. I’ve been lucky with having an extremely supportive SO (his scholarships at University went a long way towards my own tuition and books) plus whatever support my mom could offer as well as my now in-laws.

I went back to community college starting around 18. When I started JC I had to begin with the basics: arithmetic, remedial English, etc. I finished my AA at 23 (summa cum laude) and at 25 I’m now at a top university as a transfer student. Because of complications with FAFSA (my age at the time + my mom living in another state + single status = bigtime problems for state university funding) I had two years off in between JC and university.

My husband and I knew that we would eventually get married anyways, but having to send a withdrawal letter to UCLA because of my finances really hurried that along (by like, 5 years). This said, I wouldn’t jump into marriage unless you are REALLY sure. It would be hypocritical of me to say that 22 is too young to be considering it, but be as sure as you can be. (I was 23, he was 32, and we’re coming up on two years married now). Now I am at UCLA and he’s at Loyola Law. Both of us are highschool dropouts. I’m looking at heading towards law school now, myself.

That’s awesome that you are in business for yourself. If you’re liking it a lot, I’d suggest you take a few business classes here and there at a community college. Even if it doesn’t lead to an MBA (and who knows? Maybe it will!), at the least you will be able to work smarter. Maybe even start with just one class. Set small reachable goals for yourself, and as you go along set bigger goals. Rome wasn’t built in a day, etc. To be perfectly honest, confidence is all you really need: by posting to the Dope alone, cognizant of the facts surrounding your situation, you show that you have the brains to do it. Now you just have to start!

Please please please don’t think you can’t do it because your past was lacking academically, or because you feel too old, or whatever. The basic skills alone you’ve earned by carving out your own living, both working crap jobs and starting your own business, puts you head and shoulders above the other students. And you know what? Just by having been where you are, you are in a superior state of mind. You know the value of an education, and because of that you will have a drive and a tenacity 1000 times greater than your peers.

I don’t know that I’m giving really good advice, but there it is. If you’re in California I can give you much more specific and detailed advice, but if you’d ever like to chat about your experiences in general, feel free to IM me on AIM or send me an email at varishnabeastington@hotmail.com. Both my husband and I have been through this sort of thing, and would be more than happy to chat.

On preview, apologies for being so long-winded!

4

I hope you don’t mind if I ask you some questions.

  1. Do you live in the U.S?

  2. What jobs did you have that made you miserable and why?

  3. Besides clothing/media resale operation is there anything you’d like to do?

That’s sort of risky long term, and you won’t have any benefits or anything.

I’d suggest going to a community college in your area and talking to a counselor. They have all sorts of tests you can take to see what you’d be interested in doing.

If you can’t get aid, I’m sure you can get loans. Together with some kind of a part time job, you could survive.

Are there any two year programs you’d be interested in? Chef/cooking, nurse, lab technician, x-ray tech? Lots of two year programs and you can get get certified and make a pretty decent living, and then continue school if you want to. How about one of the trades like carpentry, electrician, heating/ etc. Would you be interested in something like that?

5

Not through any medication, and I am prone to the odd freakout, but it tends to be entirely stress related. It’s the sort of thing that seems as though it can be triggered by circumstance, but not not present a consistent problem, if that makes sense.

6

Please don’t worry about being long-winded. The more you have to say, the better. I can use any and all help and will take any advice at least into consideration, if not action.

I have had some difficulty figuring out exactly to what extent marriage might benefit us in terms of funding college. My girlfriend is about my age, and we’re both very stressed out by the financial situation that college imposes. Obviously I am not going to jump into anything I am not certain about, but I’d like to have as much information at my disposal as is possible. What is the financial benefit reaped insofar as tuition in concerned?

It’s good to hear you’re doing well and have managed to get yourself through at least part of the gauntlet. I am definitely plagued by thoughts along the lines of, “Well, some of the people I graduated high school with are well out of college at this point, and here I am,” etc. I try to suppress them, but they’re there. Obviously I understand that many are far worse off than I am – free of dependents, in reasonably good health, and aware of my situation.

My own personal FAFSA problems have stemmed from negligence on the part of my parents in filling them out. As I understand it, their tax information is required until I am 24 years old. Unfortunately, my mother has a very “I’ll get around to it…” attitude toward just about everything, and no amount of pestering (or even “just give me the information and I’ll do it”) works out.

7

  1. I do, yes. Columbus, OH.

  2. I have had dozens of jobs. I have serious problems with jobs that have a set pay rate (i.e. differences in performance will have zero effect on compensation), working for other people, working toward no end I care about. I realize this gets into “woe is me/life sucks, get a helmet” territory and this is the peril of many workers, but the long-term jobs I have had have all made me feel terrible and not like myself. I have worked in office environments, service environments, call centers, etc. I have more or less run the gamut. I have survived for quite some time on odd jobs, promotional work, taking jobs I hate as necessary to fill in some gaps, etc.

  3. I’m honestly not certain what I’d like to do. I am guilty of having too many interests. I realize my current operation is risky, but that’s the life I’ve chosen. I feel that I am young and resilient enough to lose my ass many times over, get back up, and try new things. My stock in trade seems to be in the generation and execution of ideas, to put things in very broad terms. I have no intention of reproducing, so I feel as though I have a long life ahead of me to attempt success on my own terms.

My experiences with classroom learning have been consistently terrible throughout my life. I am not in any way socially unsuccessful, I “get along” fine, but the actual experience has always been lacking. I want to say this is a product of having gone to bad schools (underfunded, largely anti-intellectual central Ohio public schools and a series of colleges that seemed only slightly removed from high school). I hope that it is. I honestly want to believe in an academic environment that suits my purposes, but I’d be lying if I said I had encountered it. As it stands, I am in a position where I know I will need to work to even get into that sort of environment.

My plan for the immediate future is to do well enough in community college to make myself a viable candidate for a state school, but that idea is not the most invigorating. A very questionable carrot at the end of that stick, to be sure. I wish that I had a more defined plan that I had confidence in, but that is not the case. I think, however, that I would benefit from a traditional education, despite all of my qualms with the way that most everything about college is set up.

My experiences with college counselers have been awful across the board (and this spans about five colleges, at this point). I’ve tried speaking to different advisors, and I’ve always gotten the impression that these people have long since given up on trying to help people and just want to move bodies out of their office. I am sure that exceptions abound, but I’ve yet to encounter them. Every time I’ve set foot in a counseler’s office I’ve left far more confused than I entered.

I really appreciate all of the feedback thus far, everyone.

8

I am rather at the tail end of my career, it has been … interesting …

Having a pretty good UK education (well prestigious) I can safely said that most of it was of no direct use for work.

Before Uni I took any crap job I could - purely for the money - and in hindsight I reckon that what I learned from them was extremely useful. At Uni I was surprized how little people knew about the real world, both the students and the tutors.

After Uni, I was surprized how little people knew about other than their own little area.

I’ve worked with MBAs, the ones that went in good, came out good. The ones that went in crap came out the same. I considered getting an MBA, but at the interview it was pretty clear that it would have been a waste of time - admittedly the place was not top notch, but my former boss (marketing director) had gone there - and there was a grant going.

What I’m really saying is that unless you can identify real weaknesses in your basic education, or you have a deep desire to be a ‘professional’ or get stuck into a large corporation, then you probably don’t need to worry about formal education.

If you want to learn about accountancy, then buy a book on it. If the book does not make sense, then it is 90% chance that it is a lousy book. Ditto for commercial law.
With other things you can learn from other people, they love talking about what they are interested in - you just need to listen.

The fact that you have decided that you want to work for yourself, suggests to me that you should get on with it and not worry about formal qualifications.

9

I have certainly had thoughts along these lines. The fact that my ventures blowing up in my face would put me back in, “Oh god, I’m filling in job applications at stores” territory is somewhat terrifying to me. A college degree, though it is not at all a safeguard, at least puts me in a position where I could potentially manage some terrible office or something, instead of being one of the entry-level drones.

2006 is not a good time to be young and cognizant.

10

I’m not that sure that a college degree is that valuable, even for crap jobs.

After a few years people are looking for experience.

IMO, in the UK, it takes about a year to knock the crap out of people fresh out of college - it certainly did for me.

I’m not decrying education, it can be enjoyable, but even vocational stuff tends to have little to do with the real world.

11

Have you looked into long-distance education? Some of it is entirely self-directed, but other schools offer netcasts, chat with tutors and whatnot.

My cousin didn’t graduate from high school until we were in our mid20’s, kept lots of clerical jobs over the years and when she decided she wanted a college degree so she’d be able to get better pay etc she got it long-distance. It worked well for her, but of course this time she was studying because she wanted to - not because her Mom had said she had to.

12

I’m not sure that’s true in the U.S regarding education. I’ve worked for two large companies that required a degree in pretty much anything to hold a managerial position. There were people with the company for 10-20 years that couldn’t be promoted to management, but they’d hire a kid off the street for a management position as long as they had a degree.

I’m sure it’s not like that everywhere, but it was true for the companies I worked for. Sometimes state/government jobs have an either/or requirment for experience vs education but you’d have to have very specific experience in the field often from military.

13

This has been the case in the majority of companies I have worked for. Personally, I think it’s nonsense. But I’m not the one making the rules. I think you need a degree to make the rules…

14

So far, what I’m hearing is, “I don’t like education, and I don’t like entry-level jobs.” Well, good luck with life.

Look, I admire the fact that you’re able to keep body and soul together with odd jobs and your own small business. That’s probably more than I could do. But the odds against ever making a good and legal income with your own business, without a skilled trade, without an education, and without access to venture capital would make astronomers blanch.

It’s normal not to like entry-level jobs. It’s normal to complain about them to your friends, and even to post Pit rants about them on the SDMB.

However, you’ve used words like “miserable” and “terrifying” to describe the prospect of working at such a job. That isn’t normal. I suspect, per jsgoddess, that your depression is not under control, and that you would benefit from some sort of counseling that would enable you to cope with the hassles of a job without losing control.

Once you have secure and stable employment, many employers will pay for school tuition, which would make it more viable for you financially. And, the same coping skills which help you to hold a job would probably help you to do better in school.

On the positive side, you’re more literate than many white collar professionals with whom I have worked, and that will stand you in good stead at such time as you resume your education.

I personally would advise against getting married until you’re more secure emotionally and financially, but I’m not married myself so there isn’t much I can say about that.

15

You’re hearing incorrectly (or I’m being unclear).

I like education. Love it, in fact. I hate what i have known as “school.” I want to believe that there are environments more suited to traditional learning that I might access, but that has not, thus far, been the case. I attended absolutely dreadful public schools and have since attended a series of colleges I disliked. I realize that at this point in time I will have to attend a college I’m not terribly fond of in order to academically reposition myself, and I think that I can handle that. It’ll be rough, but I think I should be able to make it through.

I have attempted conseling previously and feel I gained nothing. Those were frustrating experiences.

16

I didn’t enjoy public school myself, and to this day I’d rather read something on my own than take a class. But employers aren’t interested in hearing about how I learned something on my own; they want degrees and credentials.

Why is that? Because degrees and credentials say something about you–that you’re able to take direction, that you’ll stick with something even though it doesn’t interest you every minute of every day, that you can meet somebody else’s standards in passing the exams.

Do those attributes describe you? If not, you’re probably going to have to change in order to better yourself financially.

17

I understand what you mean, but if it means you have to try to avoid the circumstances that you have to conquer to progress in whichever field you’re interested in, it really becomes a consistent problem.

When I read the OP, I thought of myself. I excelled in school, but I didn’t really get anything from it. It was a time-waster, really. And I don’t use my degrees in my job.

I have never been a person with much in the way of goals. What keeps me working is necessity, not passion or dedication.

You might consider looking at something like transcription. I mention it because it generally pays by the line rather than by the hour, so performance is everything. Commission sales might be another possibility. Some people are invigorated by the challenges of sales. Some people shrivel and die.

But I do think the depression might be an issue. So long as you’re not challenging yourself, it’s not acting up. But if it’s lurking, you’re going to need to address it head on.

Best of luck, fellow Ohioan.

18

Superorganism, I have no advice other than to share my own experience.

I did well in (high) school, and never considered anything other than University. Due to laziness and lack of work ethic I did badly my second year and dropped out - to take up a warehouse job ("picking, no education required)

I left this to become a Timeshare Salesman, got fired after one year to take up a job working the graveyard shift as a clerk. Which was a contract position, end of contract I started working in a Casino, did that for two years. Got married. (at age 23). Went back to school part time - while working nights - failed due to lack of sleep. Started working weekends, went to school full time (with wife support) and had my best year ever.

Worked for 6 months as a manager

Emigrated and took up a job in Public Relations

Now earning approx $90k per annuam heading the dept.

My thoughts from my own experience.

  1. I have never had a job I hated, or that is truely dead end. Even as a warehouse picker there was prospects to advance into management. It may take time - sure, and it may never pay as much as a doctor, but you can still “succeed”. The trick is to have a positive attitude, and if you are in the top percentile of employees you WILL get the chance to advance, maybe not quickly, but it does happen
  2. A positive work attitude and good aptitude goes a long long way
  3. My degree has not directly helped in my work, other than as “proof” I am intelligent
  4. A varied background can be a great asset

The only advice I would offer would be not to expect too much from any job. Work will never be “fun” the same way leisure is, however whether it is enjoyable or not is entirely in your attitude. If you take pride in what you do, and challenge yourself it will be enjoyable, and these are entirely internal measurements, not what anybody else wants to impose on you in terms of status.

Some of the jobs I have held?
Bar Man over new year
Cleaning bricks outside in snow
shoveling pig shit
Cleaning the floor of a rabbit farm (shovelling rabbit shit)

I love to learn new things, whether it be via “formal” education, or simply by researching and reading - and soliciting opinions.

I would say that no matter what you do, happiness is an internal measurement, it doesn’t rely on holding a good job, earning a lot of money or having a lot of status. In fact many of these things tend to follow happiness.

Only when you can genuinely enjoy what you do, will you be happy. All too often (IMHO) people are looking for a “magic” solution in terms of finding a job you love, to me that is bunk, it is up to you to love the job you have.

To be “happy” you need to learn to appreciate what you have, while striving for more. To enjoy your current situation even while you seek to improve it.

Cheers

19

I guess if I was in your shoes, I’d find a job that I could tolerate enough to pay the bills and take some college coursework at a community college at night. Do that for a few years, then when you’re 25 you will no longer have to use parent resources in determining your college financial need and you will be eligible for a lot of aid. Since you’re in Columbus, you could then drop your work to half time and go to Ohio State part time while maintaining your existing apartment. Take advantage of the next few years to try to get a handle on what your long term goal is.

20

Do any of you have any experience or advice regarding obtaining grants, scholarships, etc. when one is not fresh out of high school?

I do not come from a background of academics, web searches for this sort of thing are disastrous, and college advisors aren’t particularly helpful.