We live at the end of a private gravel road, so there is no plowing/salting/etc. Recently we’ve had a freeze/thaw cycle combined with freezing rain and snow creating a sheet of ice that a Zamboni driver would be proud of. The final 25 yards is a fairly steep slope.
So, my gf told me that she slid down the slope this morning, even though she had her Subaru in Neutral.
Personally, in this situation I have my 4WD on, my skid prevention disabled, and my Jeep in Drive.
Who is correct here? (I threw some ice-melt, and the temperature is hitting 40F today)
You are. With care and judicious use of engine compression, an icy slope can be navigated; plus you have the ability to try to power yourself out of any slide. In neutral you are freewheeling, and the tendency is going to be to hit the brakes at some point to slow yourself down, which results in an uncontrolled slide.
I had to drive out 20 miles of glass-slick road some years back. I had the Jeep in compound low on the hills and just tried to maintain a steady velocity. Cars were off the road, in the ditches, and piled into each other. I made it out, but my shoulders ached for two days afterward.
Kayaker indicated he would select “D” rather than one of the lower gears, so engine braking won’t come into play. Engine braking is also a bad thing when it’s slippery, since you can’t easily turn it off like you can the brakes.
Assuming a late-model car with electronic stability control and ABS, then your best bet is to leave it in “D” and use the brakes as necessary. Avoid driving in a manner that requires sudden changes in direction or speed, because those changes won’t be possible. ESC should keep the car from spinning (yawing), and ABS should help you retain some degree of steering control while braking. If it’s extremely slippery and the road is very uneven, then your car may move in unexpected directions despite the best efforts of ESC/ABS - in which case you won’t do any better without them, either, so you should avoid driving altogether.
I extended what was an otherwise great ski trip in Vermont when on the second to last day of our trip, I ran the car off the road.
Was coming down a snow covered winding mountain drive just steps outside our slope side condo. Was in second gear and moving slow, but probably not slow enough. Turned the wheel left but the car decided it was just going to straight off the road into the ditch. Nothing about being in gear, out of gear, ESC/ABS, steering did a damn bit of good. Ended up with cosmetic damage of the front air dam and busted radiator spilling coolant all over the boulder on which it stopped. Was lucky I didn’t bust the suspension.
If both cars have ABS, just ride the brakes all the way down in D gear. ABS is much more useful for maintaining control during what would otherwise be a wheel slip situation than it is for improving stopping distance.
I’d go in first gear, lightly applying the brakes. ABS and traction control are great, but you do best by limiting the speed the car ever reaches, rather than controlling it once you have passed the limits of friction.
ABS is fantastic, but it’s best not to get into a situation where you need it and engine braking can help that.
Not having a late-model car with either ABS or ESC, and not having 4-wheel drive, I would put it in whatever gear limits my speed to below the maximum I’d feel comfortable going down that hill at.
I drive a 2000 Accord with a stick shift, so that comes naturally, but pretty much every automatic I see lets you choose a lower gear if you want. You can put it in 3 or 2 instead of D, and I sure would use that option. Probably go with 2 from the sound of it, but obviously hard to know for sure without seeing it.
I don’t see why having ABS or ESC would make a difference with respect to that choice. Presumably the brakes would anti-lock just as well if you stomped on them in 2 rather than D, and they’d have the advantage of slowing you down from a lower speed than you might have crept up to if you’re in D. And you’re less likely to start into a spin, or spin as badly, with that leash on your speed that a low gear puts on your car, so the ESC should have an easier time of it.
But as I said, I have no experience with these things (and won’t, as long as this car continues to not need major repair money put into it), so I could easily be wrong. I’d be interested in the explanation, though.
A few weeks ago my business’ parking lot which is completely level was a big sheet of ice. I called the plowing people and they spread anti-skid. Before he arrived, one of my employees was stuck in the middle of the totally flat lot. She got out of her car and crawled to the door.
In other words, you’re better off never letting your wheels slip in the first place. That’s very true, but if you’re on a steep, icy downhill, wheel slip is going to happen whether you’re in 1, 2, D or P. In that case, it doesn’t matter what gear you’re in, just mash the brake pedal and let ABS do its job.
I am getting light-headed just reading this thread. If I had to drive down something like that, I’d put it in L but even L wouldn’t be low enough. Press brakes as gently as possible.
I’m having flashbacks of that awful feeling of realizing a split second too late that you’ve started down a hill you have no business going down. :: shudder
Well, to be fair, if it’s as steep as my drive (about 17% slope), the brakes are really going to be doing all the braking as you creep along at walking speed. Just don’t see the point of putting it in neutral.
I would never, deliberately, go over an edge and down a hill in NEUTRAL. :eek:
4WD is better than AWD, and AWD is better than 2WD, and anything is better than neutral. I would chose 1st gear and just creep over the edge. If the trans has a low range, that’s what I would use. If it’s Zamboni slick, I might first lower the tire pressure by 8 or 10lbs. If I started to slide, I would try to power out of the situation (couldn’t hurt at this point). Can’t do that in neutral.
I did that once in an old Navy pickup. I was staring at a steep downgrade with about six inches of new snow. I eased the truck forward until gravity was just taking over, threw the manual shift into reverse, let go the brake and as I started to pick up speed, revved the engine and let out the clutch, spinning the tires in reverse. Good for the tranny? Nope. Slowed me down, though.
