Orbifold: I agree if they were, in fact, American soldiers that were;
a - dressed “casually”
and
b - armed after driving to the zoo in their MILITARY vehicles while armed
and
c - playing with the animals.
I just can’t see ANY commander letting his troops do this in a war zone! Look at the consequences that would befall, not the soldiers but the COMMANDER. I can just about guarantee that this person would be relieved of command, his career would be over and he would most likely be court martialed.
Now me, I’ll just sit and wait for a more complete report before flying off the handle and just assuming that our troops are a bunch of “drunken fucktards” that like to kill endangered tigers while they’re trapped in cages.
Again wring, assuming that this actually happened the way that it did, maybe they were looking at the animals and some complete fucking yahoo decided to try and feed the tigers.
Stranger things have happened but I take exception to Diogenes just assuming that everything he reads is the TRUTH because, of course, our troops are a bunch of Neanderthals in uniform (or NOT in uniform as the case may be).
And no, I don’t agree that it would justify this rant. As was stated by someone earlier in the thread, if I saw my buddy get bit by a tiger and I were armed, that tiger would be dead.
That turns out not to be the case. Iraq is/was pretty secular - Baathism, remember ? When the troops looted the tax-free at at Baghdad Airport, for instance, there was plenty of liquor to be had. ( Link)
There is physical evidence that one of these soldiers was being immensely stupid. If it was “some yahoo” and not the soldier who stuck his hand in the cage, why is there no report of this hypothetical yahoo being injured?
Indeed. Just like when I was in Saudi Arabia and the duty free shop sold liquor. It’s not technically being sold in the country for USE in the country.
Hey! I may be totally wrong here but I’m gonna look around and see if I can find the Centcom policy on liquor for troops in the Middle East, specifically, Iraq.
fact that nimrod A stuck his hand in cage w/live tiger, all by itself justifies the rant.
as for acceptable level of proof. He’s got a news story that a tiger was killed and that US soldiers were invovled. Since the tiger was in a cage and I cannot come up with any legitimate reason for the tiger to be shot while in it’s cage unless humans did something incredibly stupid**, I’m on the side of the OP.
(** which includes your speculation that they wanted to ‘feed’ the tigers)
While the death of this tiger at American hands is tragic, let us not forget the thousands of tigers who would have been killed at the despotic hands of Saddam Hussein had not America intervened. Instead of focusing on this one unfortunate incident, let us instead celebrate all the other tigers in Iraq who now have a chance to live in a free and democratic society, once we dig it out from underneath all the rubble.
Gimme a break here…I said that I could be totally wrong. My opinion based on what I know about how Centcom works is that there would be no drinking while in Iraq. If indeed it was a soldier that got chewed on after going through and outer cage to try and do whatever with the tigers then he deserved what he got.
AGAIN my only beef is the way this thread was presented. Reuters reports that American soldiers are scooting around in military vehicles, wearing civilian clothing, armed and drunk so of course it must be true. At least that’s what I get from DtC’s op.
It pushes my buttons and I’m not ashamed to admit it.
Hey now wring, you KNOW I like you but all I’m saying is that in the heat of the moment if I saw my buddy who I most likely live with 24 hours a day get mauled by a tiger **even if it were his own damn fault I’d still shoot the damn tiger!
You have no conception of what comaradery in a war zone is like. When you’re willing to kill and/or die for your buddy, things become VERY uncomplicated. I am in NO WAY saying that the shooting of this tiger while in a cage was justified unless the thing wouldn’t let go of the guys arm or something.
I’m just saying that, again, my buddy just got mauled, that’s a dead tiger.
Saudi Arabia and Iraq aren’t really comparable. One is a religious state, the other a secular society. Both are Muslim countries, but Iraq wasn’t run by the religious establishment like Saudi Arabia is.
well, I doubt that the possible drunkeness of the soldier that fueled the rant (tho the concept was included. And it does rather explain why some one who is presumably a rational, thinking adult, with at least some level of intelligence, would step over protective areas to go pet the pretty kitty involved)
So would you have been less provoked had DtC said the guy was a blithering idiot??.
(I understand your point that the shooter was prolly instantaniously reacting to protect his friend. we really wish those protective thoughts would have come to play a few moments earlier so he’d say “hey, Earl, don’t be an idiot, don’t stick your hand in that cage”. had he done that, no dead tiger. Either way, it’s through stupid acts of humans that the tiger is dead).
Sorry to add another minor nitpick, but my understanding is that - despite the 60% Shia population - Iraq has traditionally been a fairly moderate muslim country, even before the Ba’ath party took power. Of course, the Ba’ath party wasn’t “moderate”, but they were secular - I don’t believe they banned booze.
No, I’m afraid I don’t have a cite - this is just based on half-remembered conversations with my foreign affairs prof. I submit it for whatever it’s worth, and would welcome being corrected if I’m wrong.
Sorry, one more point - in Desert Storm, our troops were in Kuwait, Saudi Arabia, and (I believe) some other countries. And we drove back the Iraqis to the Kuwaiti border with Iraq, but I don’t think we actually had troops stationed in Iraq. So the Saudi attitude on alcohol, for example, need not apply here.
If you are in an American zoo and someone gets hurt like that and you pull out your gun and kill the animal you would be in a hell of a lot of trouble and rightly so. It is inexcusable.
The fucktards were not fighting enemies, they were in the freaking zoo. If they do not know how to behave in a zoo then they should stay out. Trigger happy idiots.
I just hope they are treated as if they had done this in any American zoo.
