So of course if you park in a handicapped spot or in front of a hydrant you can expect a hefty ticket and possible towing. But how enforceable are those “other” spots retailers have? Employee of the month, hero/vet parking, expectant mother, on-line order pick-up, etc.
Besides you possibly being a big jerk by doing so is there anything a retailer could do outside of having the cops trespass you and ask you to leave? Could they legally have your car towed?
I admit there is a store nearby that has 4 spots reserved for on-line pickups (not the type where the employee runs it to your car) and I have been known to take the farthest out of these spots when all of them are empty when I just have to run in to buy something.
Those spots that are not ADA or state or local law mandated are not enforceable. I doubt there are any state or local laws that enforce ‘employee of the month,’ ‘veteran.’ ‘expectant mother.’ spots.
I think the best they can do is publicly shame you and ask you to move. I don’t know if they could legally tow your car, unless it was sitting there for a long time.
Without 100% certainty because I don’t know all of the rules in all government agencies, I don’t think you will get a government issued ticket.
I think one issue is whether it could be considered trespassing. Another is whether state law or local ordinance would allow the property holders to have the vehicle towed. All of that may vary by jurisdiction.
100% that. For store owners, that’s sort of our ‘catch all’ for getting people out of the store that are being a problem. We reserve the right to refuse service to anyone for (almost) any reason or no reason at all, and the police will back us up on that.
Towing the car would probably be a separate issue, but the police won’t have a problem removing the person from the premises and trespassing them if the store asks them to. Assuming the interaction doesn’t escalate into an arrest, the person would be able to leave with their car. If, for whatever reason, the car stays there, the store should be able to work with the police to have it removed.
In my area, at least the last time I had to do this years ago (but I think the rules are more lax now), I’d put a note on the car saying it’s on private property and needs to be removed, wait 24 hours, have the police ticket it for being abandoned, then call a local tow company to come get it. For the love of god, people, we aren’t your free airport parking. If you leave your car in my tiny parking lot and go on vacation, it won’t be there when you get back.
That’s another important part. If this is, for example, a strip mall, the store owner probably can’t do much about what happens in the parking lot. The property owner may have to make that call.
Another thing to remember is that those private spots (and street parking marked as a loading zone) are never going to be enforced by the police just based on them seeing someone parked there that shouldn’t be. In other words, nothing is going to happen by parking in the on-line pickup spot unless someone at the store calls the police.
As an anecdotal point from my local jurisdiction: any parking lot that is open to the public free of charge as part of a public place of business is available for anyone to park in for any reason up to one hour without restriction.
So if I want to get lunch at Joe’s, and I park in a spot in front of Frank’s, and Frank has signs posted that say, “Parking only for customers of Frank’s; violators will be towed”, that sign has no bite for the first hour that I’m eating at Joe’s.
This is just to say that you should just check your local laws. Local parking regulations are usually relatively concrete as laws go.
Although these parking lots are private property my understanding this is not the same thing as (say) a person’s driveway at their home.
These places are part of a public accommodation. The merchants need to allow people use of these things and let them into their stores except in narrow circumstances. Unlike a person’s home where you can deny access to anyone you want for any reason you want.
I am not sure how that is balanced in (say) a shopping mall (private property versus public access).
It’s been a while since I read the law, so I just looked it up again, and it’s not from my local city but actually the entire state.
California Vehicle Code 22953(a): An owner or person in lawful possession of private property that is held open to the public, or a discernible portion thereof, for parking of vehicles at no fee, or an employee or agent thereof, shall not tow or remove, or cause the towing or removal, of a vehicle within one hour of the vehicle being parked.
Other parts of the statute point out that civil remedies could be pursued, so I suppose it’s not fully open access if a business wanted to pursue something. But they definitely can’t just tow you, and my sense is that people do generally ignore such signs in my city itself for short stops into businesses.
You would have to look up the laws in every state. In New Jersey the only state parking statute that is enforceable on private property is for handicapped parking. The caveat is the spot has to be very specifically marked with the proper signage. Other private property parking enforcement has to be covered by local ordinance. For instance every commercial building with an enforceable fire zone is listed in the local ordinance. The fire marshal has to inspect the fire zone to ensure it’s marked properly before it can be enforced.
You may not be able to tow the car. But you can “trespass” the violators.
We (my current and former employers, operators of supermarkets and/or convenience stores) will trespass folks who:
park in the electric vehicle charging stations
park in the 15 minute pick up spots and go shopping for an hour
park in the employee only spots
park big ass SUVs, vans or pickups in compact car spots, creating a safety issue for drivers or pedestrians
And anyone who parks in the handicapped parking spaces without a decal or plates can be ticketed and/or towed, but by the police.
The level of enforcement depends on how difficult parking is in the area. If we need four spots for employees to park and non-employees are parking there, it’s fucking up our employees and/or our other customers. Either the employee is forced to park in a spot close to the store for 4-9 hours making customers walk further, not return shopping carts, etc. Or the employee is walking to a poorly lit part of the parking lot at 10pm. We might warn you once or twice but then we will just ban you from the store, or from all our stores.
I have never heard of a store doing this. What did you do, tie up an employee or manager standing there until the ‘offender’ comes out & goes to get back into their vehicle?
Like I said it depends on what the parking situation is. If you’re used to a normal suburban environment with plentiful parking, you’re not committing resources to it.
If parking is the determinant of whether a store succeeds or fails, then you are willing to put resources against it. Resort areas in the high season. Urban stores. Stores near a popular restaurant with scarce street parking.
You hand them a piece of paper telling them they are banned from the property and take their picture and their license plate number.
It’s a criminal offense (“trespass”) for them to return. They can be arrested for it, and then we can secure or tow their car if it is not removed by a friend or family member.
It’s the same thing if they are standing in front of the store yelling at customers, panhandling, collecting signatures on petitions, etc. Girl Scouts with permission, okay. Group collecting signatures for a ballot initiative, not okay. Generally speaking, political or religious anything, not okay. Girl Scouts, Boy Scouts, Little League team, Junior Cheerleaders (from the local town), okay.
Even when it would be legal, lots of times it won’t happen for different reasons. For example, if you are parked in one of these on-line pickup spots while you run into the supermarket to buy one item , you will probably be gone before the store has even figured out that you aren’t picking up an online order. Do veterans normally carry proof of that status? And I wouldn’t want to tow a car just because the woman who parked there didn’t look pregnant because that doesn’t mean she isn’t. Really, probably the only types of spots you might get towed from are employee-only spots and electric vehicle spots. And even then only if you are there long enough for them to notice, call a tow truck and the truck to get there.
I’m really surprised by that California law - according to this article it’s meant to protect people whose cars have broken down (although the legislature could have done a better job of writing the law) but I’m wondering how many stores either charge a nominal fee or just don’t have parking lots to avoid providing parking to customers of other businesses. It might not be an issue for a supermarket or mall- but that doesn’t mean it’s not a problem for a 7-11 with 5 parking spaces.
Here it’s trespass parking. It’s not a state statute but a municipal ordinance. And the vehicle can’t be towed unless it’s been there for 24 hours or more.
We get complaints of people parking in the pick up parking spots. But by the time any of us get there the vehicle is usually gone and we’re not tracking down a car for a $25 ticket.
Setting any legislatively stated motivations aside, it’s a nice statistical efficiency gain for all way more often than not in a city laid out like mine. The 7-11 with five spaces is either (a) isolated practically from other businesses and thus on its own anyway, or (b) sharing parking premises with other businesses and thus getting to lean on the benefit of a short-term shared allocation, allowing their customers to visit even when their five spots happen to be full for a moment.
I’m not going to say it doesn’t work that way in your city - but that law is for the entire state, and I’d bet there are places in California where few businesses have parking lots and a store (7-11 or other) with a small parking lot is likely surrounded by other businesses that depend on street parking.
If someone is using the services of the VA, they’ll be issued a veterans ID card. If someone is retired from the service after a full 20-plus year career they’ll be issued a retirees ID card. Those folks tend to carry that card everywhere all the time because they tend to use it often to gain admittance to something at a VA facility or military base.
Folks who are veterans other than the above, like me, have no such ID. But …
All US states issue driver’s licenses / non-driving ID cards which have “Veteran” printed on them along with all the other usual DL stuff. When the vet gets / renews their DL/ID, they can provide proof of their veteran-ness if they care, and the label gets applied to their DL/ID forever after. That’s handy for all the various stores and entertainments where vets get a discount of some sort. I have one of these. So if I have my driver’s license with me, I also have proof of veteranness.
Bottom line being that it’s a virtual certainty that a vet who cares about their veteran status does carry some form of ID most everywhere most all the time. You almost have to go out of your way not to.