Good point. And don’t people put their graduating year and degree, anyhow? So couldn’t he could simply put:
Northwestern University, 2015, Masters of Science - Mechanical Engineering
Notre Dame, 2013 Bachelor of Science, summa cum laude - Engineering
(Hey, it’s my example, I’m gonna dream big! Also…it’s obvious I know nothing about engineering or the degree systems thereof!)
Would anyone care, resume-wise, that some of his credits transferred from another school? After you’ve got the real goods, is the sin of omission great?
A GED is also seen as detrimental, don’t kid yourself. It is never regarded as being as good as a high school diploma, whether or not that’s the way it should be.
One way to “erase” the GED or DeVry stigmata from your record (of course, it remains there, but you know what I mean) is to go from there to another degree, one with more weight and prestige. If you have a Bachelor’s or Master’s in XYZ from the Univerity of Illinois or Purdue or Notre Dame or what have you then the DeVry or GED thing won’t matter nearly so much.
So, if, for sure he’s going on to a four-year degree at a regular university that might well be a good option - but what others have said is true. Many employers loathe DeVry and actively look down on the people who went there, whether they should or not.
I think some if not all schools offer “Bachelor of Engineering” and “Master of Engineering” (B. Eng. and M. Eng.) instead of Science… Still good! And did you make sure those schools actually offer Engineering?
Just another opinion: I didn’t go to high school at all (OK, I did the first three months of 9th grade, but that hardly counts). We didn’t formally homeschool either, although I liked science and math and pretty much kept up with where I was supposed to be on my own efforts. When I decided I had to go to college now or it wasn’t going to happen, I got a GED, spent one year at a community college and transfered (as a sophomore) to MIT, which is a pretty “decent” school :). Now I’m a research biologist with a PhD. In the long run, not going to high school didn’t hurt me any (except maybe on the socialization and pop culture knowledge front), and was a lot more fun. So it can be done.
(It’s only when I write posts like this that I realize how weird my childhood was. It seemed perfectly reasonable at the time…)
JRB
Easier said than done. Both of those schools (nearly all the charter and magnet schools in the CPS system) have far more applicants than spots. You apply, you meet whatever their requirements are, and then there’s a lottery for admissions. We’ve applied to both of those (and others) every year with no luck.
There are a number of MEng programs, but I can’t think of a US school that offers BEng degrees off the top of my head. Most of the schools that offer MEng degrees also offer an MS in engineering - the difference is the structure of the program and the focus of the work. MEng programs are typically terminal degrees, and the focus on engineering as it’s practiced. Rather than a research thesis, the student’s work on a particular design project as if they were professionals working for a client. Classwork for an MEng course will include some technical subjects, but also frequently goes into project management and some of the business side of the profession. An MEng is a great degree for somebody who wants to manage or own a consulting business. It’s usually seen as a terminal degree, similar to an MBA.
MS degrees in engineering are research based, and are more focused on the knowledge than the actual nuts and bolts of the profession. MS programs can lead to PhDs - it’s rare for MEng holders to go on to doctoral work.
For the most part, people are interested in your last degree. If I’m looking at your son straight out of high school, I may be skeptical of a Devry education; if I see that he’s since graduated from Notre Dame summa cum laude, then I’m comfortable with his education.
Unless you’re filling out an application that requires you to list each institution, there’s no sin of omission in naming only the degree-granting program. If Notre Dame accepts two years worth of community college classwork, then those credits count exactly the same as credits other students earn in their first two years at Notre Dame. Likewise, the degree says “Bachelor of Science, Notre Dame” - it doesn’t make any distinction between students who transferred and students who were there from day 1.
I also want to echo this concern. It’s not an issue for the high school program, but engineering technology (ET) is a very different degree from engineering. The core requirements - math, physics, stats, etc. - are tougher for engineering than for ET. In most states, ET grads are not eligible for professional engineering licensing, which really limits how far somebody with an ET degree can advance as an engineer in the industry.
Most of the ET grads I’ve worked with have ended up in positions that require a fair level of technical understanding, but little actual engineering design work - jobs like engineering sales, technical marketing, or construction management.
Why not your friendly in-state flagship public university, the University at Illinois at Urbana-Champaign, whose stature in engineering is higher than either of those two?
Ah, that’ll do, too! Honestly, I picked Notre Dame 'cause my brother in law got his engineering degree there, and it’s been on my mind lately 'cause my husband (also a Notre Dame grad) just applied for a one year position there. Should that evolve into a tenure track for him, it’d be a great school for the kiddo, as most colleges have some sort of tuition break for kids of professors. I don’t know if he’ll have the grades to get in, though. We’ll see!
And I picked Northwestern 'cause I used to live in Evanston, and that’s where husband got his Ph.D. from.
My experience is that in the Chicago area people tend to suffer from school snobbery. As an example, in K-12 going to any private school, no matter how crappy, is seen as inherently superior to any public school, no matter how good. I have even heard people say they’d never hire someone from any public school because they are inferior. 4-year colleges are valued over community colleges regardless of circumstances. And the DeVry type schools are loathed and despised. I can’t help but think there’s some bias at work here, something to do with parents who spent tens of thousands getting Precious into private schools from kindergarden on being outraged that those public school losers who opted for community college or a DeVry instead of a Very Prestigious University might actually be able to compete with Precious out in the real world.
Of course, that is not a universally held sentiment but the meme does exist in this area to a degree I haven’t seen other places I’ve lived. So DeVry graduates may be at a disadvantage in some areas in Chicago but not at such a disadvantage in, say, Dallas, TX.
While DeVry may not be quite the lawsuit magnet that U Phoenix is, it has been sued several times for providing a poor quality education and engaging in deceptive advertising (see here for details). While none of those suits have been successful, it’s hard to believe that a decent quality school would attract even one such lawsuit, let alone three.
I’ll answer this one…you have to look after your own. If you need to get your son out of a dreadful school, so be it. Who knows, he may end up liking NSA or Web Graphic Design. You’re not “bumping” some other kid. They’ll just get their opportunity another way.
A lot of engineers don’t put things together, but there certainly are engineering jobs where you do. The variety of job experiences is one of the great (and overwhelming) things about engineering. I’m a Mech. E. and work in R&D. I do a lot of prototyping and at times I’m involved in every aspect of making parts from machining to foundry work to grit blasting to inspection. I get a lot of satisfaction from seeing a part go from a design on the computer to something sitting in front of me.
WhyNot, if your son wants to get his hands dirty, he’ll be able to.
Interesting example. I’m a welding engineer, and I have no friggin’ idea how to weld. On second thought, obviously I have and idea; I really just don’t have the talent or hands-on experience. I’ve been thinking of taking some community college classes to learn how. I always love the vendor demos when I get to put on a mask and make things stick together. We don’t use a lot of GMAW in my industry, though.
I hope you are not one of those engineers that walks away from the job as soon as the welding starts.
Especially with mechanical systems, startup and commissioning are an important part of the job. Designers who consider their job done when they hand over the plans are not people I like to work with. Engineers who stick around and make things work are.
Ugh!! I wish I had a nickle for every time an engineer handed me something and expected it to work. I’m like really? You really think this is going to work?
Also…it’s obvious I know nothing about engineering or the degree systems thereof!)