Famous Irishmen

Factual Questions
1

While dining at an Irish owned restaurant here in town I read the placemat and it stated:

“Nine Famous Irishmen”

"In the Young Irish disorders, in Ireland in 1848, the following nine men were captured, tried, and convicted of treason against Her Majesty, the Queen, and were sentenced to death: John Mitchell, Morris Lyene, Pat Donahue, Thomas McGee, Charles Duffy, Thomas Meagher, Richard O’Gorman, Terrence McManus and Michael Ireland.

Before passing sentence, the judge asked if there was anything that anyone wished to say, Meagher, speaking for all, said: ‘My Lord, this is our first offense but not our last. If you will be easy with us this once, we promise, on our word, as gentlemen, to try to do better next time, and next time — sure we won’t be fools to get caught.’

Thereapon the indignant judge sentenced them all to be hanged by the neck until dead and drawn and quartered. Passionate protest from all the world forced Queen Victoria to commute the sentence to transportation for life to far wild Australia. In 1874, word reached the astounded Queen Victoria that the Sir Charles Duffy who had been elected Prime Minister of Australia was the same Charles Duffy who had been transported 25 years before. On the Queen’s demand, the records of the rest of the transported men were revealed and this is what was uncovered:

THOMAS FRANCIS MEAGHER
Governor of Montana

TERRENCE McMANUS
Brigadier General, United States Army

PATRICK DONAHIJE
Brigadier General, United States Army

RICHARD O’GORMAN
Governor General of Newfoundland

MORRIS LYENE,
Attorney General of Australia, in which office Michael Ireland succeeded him.

THOMAS D’ARCY McGEE,
Member of Parliament, Montreal, Minister of Agriculture and President of Council Dominion of Canada

JOHN MITCHELL,
Prominent New York politician, This man was the father of John Purroy Mitchell, Mayor of New York, at the outbreak of World War I."

The story leaves out some details, namely what did these 9 Irishmen do to deserve to be sentanced to death for treason?
I am willing to bet that it was serious.

Also even though these 9 Irishmen reached positions of power and influence, did they actually live good wholesome Christian lives or was it a matter of never being caught (as in the statement made to the Judge).

I also find it hard to believe that Queen Vic was so courious about the other 8 Irishmen that she would seek out a report on them.

So is this a true account?

2

The death sentences and the eventual offices held are real. I recognize some of the names and did a spot check on a couple of others. Some of the statements are a little exaggerated: Thomas Meagher was the acting governor of the Territory (not State) of Montana at the time of his accidental drowning. On the other hand, he had a full life (raising and leading the Irish Brigade for the Union during the U.S. Civil War), so it is not as though he was simply a historical footnote.

The “transportation for life” phrase is, I believe, an error. Transportation was usually for 7, 14, or (rarely) 21 years and I am not aware of anyone who was sentenced to stay in Australia until they died.

The fact that these guys “made good” should not be a surprise, at all. They were already political leaders in Ireland. When they found themselves in Australia (or Canada or the U.S.) among a large number of Irish immigrants (to whom they were heroes), it was fairly natural for them to assume positions of leadership, again.

They were not thieves and brigands who had to change their lives to “live good wholesome Christian lives.” They were soldiers, lawyers, and members of parliament. The crime for which they showed no repentance was inciting Ireland to break free from Britain. The Irish independence movement had been festering since its last big attempt in 1798 (with a couple smaller attempts in the early 1800s) and, in the face of British complacency toward the Famine and with the inspiration of several revolutions in Europe in 1848, these men organized and led a rebellion against the Crown.

I suspect that the story of Queen Vic calling up their records was simply inserted for dramatic effect. My guess would be that Her Majesty’s Government (whatever the Queen, herself, did) kept a close eye on each of these men as they gained power, to be sure that they did not try to return to Ireland (or to incite their adopted countries to agitate for Irish emancipation).

3

Rainbow, please forgive me while I hijack your thread for a sec; it’s not often I get to tell this story.
You wrote:

“…JOHN MITCHELL,
Prominent New York politician, This man was the father of John Purroy Mitchell, Mayor of New York, at the outbreak of World War I…”
Well, if the legend I’m about to relate is true, it might just call into question the quality of the genes that John passed on to his son, John Jr.

John Purroy Mitchell was, in fact, the mayor of NYC – and not a bad one at that. He was very young (in his 30’s IIRC) which earned him the nickname “The Boy Mayor.” He was also a reformer with some very progressive policies that, unfortunately, got utterly wiped away when Tammany Hall came back to power after JPM’s term.

Anyway, after serving as Mayor he joined the war effort as air corp instructor. He died in 1918 in what is usually described as an “aviation training accident” at a Louisiana airfield.

Well that’s how it always described. However the legend among historians is that ol’ JPM tried to do a loop-de-loop or a barrel roll and forgot to strap himself in. Oops. John splatted on the Lousiana landscape like an overripe grape. Poor guy, he was actually a pretty admirable guy.

(If you’re in NYC and want to see JPM, there’s a gilted (sp?) bust of the guy just inside the E. 90th St. entrance to Central Park, right near the base of the reservior. You can’t miss it.)

4

This story is all over the web, too. From what I can tell from cursory Brittanica searches, it seems like Irish glurge loosely based on historical fact. But here’s what those crazy Young Irish did to get in trouble:

[was involved with O’Brien and was also shipped to Tasmania but he escaped to the US in 1852. After the Civil war, he was acting governor of Montana until he died by drowning in the Missouri River.

[url=“http://www.britannica.com/eb/article?eu=31900&tocid=0”]Sir Charles Duffy](http://www.britannica.com/eb/article?eu=52963&tocid=0"Meagher[/url) was an Irish nationalist who was arrested and imprisoned in 1848, but was released in 1849. After several years in Irish politics, Duffy retired in 1855 and moved to Australia, as opposed to the YI guys who were shipped off to Tasmania against their will years before.

Google searched of the other lads yields mostly websites repeating this tale. I’ll see if I can dig up anything else.

5

(You could check out the “1874” aspect of the story about the Queen by doing a quick check on http://www.britannica.com/ for each man to see whether he had achieved his highest office by that year. (Meagher, for example, died within a couple years of the Civil War.) You might also see whether they were given special “life” sentences to Australia, despite my earlier denial.)

6

From what I’ve been able to find Alphagene is correct.This is loosely based on fact.
This site:

http://www.ballingarry.net/warhouse/guide.html

says that Meagher,McManus and O’Donahue were sentenced to life imprisonment in a penal colony on Tasmania and Mitchel was sentenced to 14 years tranportation to Australia.
Thomas McGee was a politician early in Canada’s history but I haven’t found anything on any of the other four.
But, this site lists the governors of Newfoundland before Confederation, and Richard O’Gorman isn’t among them.

http://www.gov.nf.ca/ltgovnor/govnor.htm

7

I meant the other three,since Alphagene covered Duffy.